America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

I don't recall anyone saying tort reform would fix everything, but it would cut down on costs and does need to be "part of" the solution

ROTFLMAO

That's comedy right there. The right has been saying for years (since Bush took office) that Tort reform is the panacea that will fix Health Care.

Now your saying they never said that?

Too funny.

 

[walrus]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

We'll never get tort reform, so instead of a public option on health insurance, why not have the gov't supply drs with liability insurance. Every time they have to pay out, just print some up, whats the big deal

 

[Bill]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

ROTFLMAO

That's comedy right there. The right has been saying for years (since Bush took office) that Tort reform is the panacea that will fix Health Care.

Now your saying they never said that?

Too funny.

Of course the right (but not only the right) has been saying for years that tort reform is needed. But they haven't been saying that is the "only" thing needed to fix health care, which is what you're implying. Any bill that goes forth without tort reform will make the Dem argument about bringing costs under control disingenuous.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

Of course the right (but not only the right) has been saying for years that tort reform is needed. But they haven't been saying that is the "only" thing needed to fix health care, which is what you're implying. Any bill that goes forth without tort reform will make the Dem argument about bringing costs under control disingenuous.

And that is what's so laughable. You just wrote it there and it's comedy at its finest. You believe and the right believes that there are no cost savings to be had without Tort reform. Which is a bald faced lie. A health care bill without Tort reform or with Tort reform should be voted on its own merits. The two issues are completely separate which you seem to agree with, but then don't.

 

[Bill]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

And that is what's so laughable. You just wrote it there and it's comedy at its finest. You believe and the right believes that there are no cost savings to be had without Tort reform. Which is a bald faced lie. A health care bill without Tort reform or with Tort reform should be voted on its own merits. The two issues are completely separate which you seem to agree with, but then don't.

Where specifically did the right (or I) say that Tort reform is the only source of health care cost savings?

What would truly be laughable is for the Dems to allow the bill to go forward without tort reform while continuing to say they want to control costs. If we want to control health costs, tort reform is not a separate issue from health care. It is part of the cost escalation problem. Is it the only piece, NO.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

Where specifically did the right (or I) say that Tort reform is the only source of health care cost savings?

What would truly be laughable is for the Dems to allow the bill to go forward without tort reform while continuing to say they want to control costs. If we want to control health costs, tort reform is not a separate issue from health care. It is part of the cost escalation problem. Is it the only piece, NO.

If it's not the only piece then why do we have to solve both at the same time? Seems to me that's one of the problems with Congress right now is they have to have the whole cow or they don't eat.

 

[walrus]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

If it's not the only piece then why do we have to solve both at the same time? Seems to me that's one of the problems with Congress right now is they have to have the whole cow or they don't eat.

Didn't Obama say he could cut out enough waste to pay for the "new" health care policy without raising taxes, why aren't we doing that now?

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

Didn't Obama say he could cut out enough waste to pay for the "new" health care policy without raising taxes, why aren't we doing that now?

No clue. I wish we were but from what I've read, heard, seen, the entire system is set up in such a way that rewards "excess" (tests, etc.) and excess = wasted money.

 

[geezer]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

No clue. I wish we were but from what I've read, heard, seen, the entire system is set up in such a way that rewards "excess" (tests, etc.) and excess = wasted money.

Exactly.

 

[LynahFan]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

If it's not the only piece then why do we have to solve both at the same time? Seems to me that's one of the problems with Congress right now is they have to have the whole cow or they don't eat.

Not just a whole cow - don't forget to stuff in the pork, the bacon, the ham, the sausage, and most importantly, the headcheese!

 

[Bill]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

If it's not the only piece then why do we have to solve both at the same time? Seems to me that's one of the problems with Congress right now is they have to have the whole cow or they don't eat.

They should be solved at the same time because tort reform is an important piece of reigning in escalating heath care costs. It's not the only contributor to rising costs, but tort is a significant one. Why would we want to pass a huge new health care bill, one of the main goals of which is to bring escalating costs under control, and not simultaneously address one of the main contributors to such rising costs?

 

[busterman62]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

Why would we want to pass a huge new health care bill, one of the main goals of which is to bring escalating costs under control, and not simultaneously address one of the main contributors to such rising costs?

simple

 

[mookie1995]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

Exactly.

"Though MRI scanning has obvious advantages over invasive procedures, its use on the very sick is also not cost-free. When my own father was dying of cancer last year in one of New York's best hospitals, he was subjected over a period of weeks to a battery of scans. While the healthy may think of MRIs as an almost entirely benign procedure, it is not at all the same for a patient whose spine is fractured in several places from bone marrow cancer, who cannot easily lie flat, and who is hallucinating from morphine. My father came down with pneumonia from complications involving sedation for what should have been a harmless scan. In these situations, even non-invasive, seemingly harmless procedures come with risks and difficulties."

the only doctor this dude should have been seeing is kevorkian

 

[joecct]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

Just a thought:

By intervening directly and depriving society of its responsibility, the Social Assistance State leads to a loss of human energies and an inordinate increase of public agencies, which are dominated more by bureaucratic ways of thinking than by concern for serving their clients, and which are accompanied by an enormous increase in spending” (Pope John Paul II, “Centesimus Annus,” No. 48).

Or another:

“The State which would provide everything, absorbing everything into itself, would ultimately become a mere bureaucracy incapable of guaranteeing the very thing which the suffering person — every person — needs: namely, loving personal concern. We do not need a State which regulates and controls everything, but a State which, in accordance with the principle of subsidiarity, generously acknowledges and supports initiatives arising from the different social forces and combines spontaneity with closeness to those in need . . . . In the end, the claim that just social structures would make works of charity superfluous masks a materialist conception of man: the mistaken notion that man can live ‘by bread alone’ (Mt 4:4; cf. Dt 8:3) — a conviction that demeans man and ultimately disregards all that is specifically human” (Pope Benedict XVI, “Deus Caritas Est,” No. 28).

 

[dropthatpuck]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

the only doctor this dude should have been seeing is kevorkian

.

 

[leswp1]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

Of course the right (but not only the right) has been saying for years that tort reform is needed. But they haven't been saying that is the "only" thing needed to fix health care, which is what you're implying. Any bill that goes forth without tort reform will make the Dem argument about bringing costs under control disingenuous.

I don't get it. I would love tort reform but I wouldn't say no to something that is going to work on at least some of the stuff that is screwed up just because it doesn't have the torte stuff attached.

Didn't Obama say he could cut out enough waste to pay for the "new" health care policy without raising taxes, why aren't we doing that now?

2 words to start. Insurance lobbyists.

 

[mookie1995]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

I don't get it. I would love tort reform but I wouldn't say no to something that is going to work on at least some of the stuff that is screwed up just because it doesn't have the torte stuff attached.

2 words to start. Insurance lobbyists.

a bill that does nothing but cost all this to 'cover' 30MM uninsured is dumb.

fix everything. D has a super majority in both houses and hold the WH. if they play around and don't fix it for the people who vote, it will kill them.

 

[leswp1]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

a bill that does nothing but cost all this to 'cover' 30MM uninsured is dumb.

fix everything. D has a super majority in both houses and hold the WH. if they play around and don't fix it for the people who vote, it will kill them.

I think that is a simplification. Pretty sure it is covering a number of things that people don't think of because they are not flashy stuff or because people all agree- no exclusions being one of them.

Super majority- huh. Still can't imagine why anyone is scared of this majority thing. Unlike the GOP sheep these guys can't agree on anything useful.

 

[mookie1995]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

I think that is a simplification. Pretty sure it is covering a number of things that people don't think of because they are not flashy stuff or because people all agree- no exclusions being one of them.

Super majority- huh. Still can't imagine why anyone is scared of this majority thing. Unlike the GOP sheep these guys can't agree on anything useful.

bubba coulda/shoulda fixed this 17 years ago...

 

[Kepler]

Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - Part 2 - Deathers vs. Commies

I don't get it. I would love tort reform but I wouldn't say no to something that is going to work on at least some of the stuff that is screwed up just because it doesn't have the tort stuff attached.

You would if you were taking your orders from

2 words to start. Insurance lobbyists.

I see you've completed the thought.