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2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

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Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

burd said:
Good thing he doesn't have a Richard Scaife to do the media dirty work, or it could really get out of hand.
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No, but does Dick Nixon count?
Richard M. Nixon @dick_nixon · ~7h
I don't think Perry will go to jail, but my God it will be funny if he does. Dumb bastard plays single A ball thinks he's the '27 Yankees.
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Richard M. Nixon @dick_nixon · Aug 15
Perry was indicted in Travis County. That is like Khrushchev being indicted in Langley, Virginia.
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Craig P. said:
It's not the DA that brought the matter to the grand jury. It's a special prosecutor (from San Antonio).

The undercurrent behind this is that her office was investigating Perry's business buddies and pet slush funds, and I think if she had resigned, he would have appointed her replacement.
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Don't confuse him with facts.
 
Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

The only thing funnier than Rick Perry getting indicted is some people in the lamestream media saying this will actually help him. :eek:

Look, maybe he beats the rap and maybe he doesn't, but I don't recall indictments helping too many politicians careers even if they do get off (see Edwards, John). Plus someone might start asking why a career politician like Perry is a multi-millionaire. :rolleyes: Where did that money come from? Another Bob McDonnell, perhaps?

With McDonnell in mind, lets see where this goes before passing judgement. At first, the VA Gov's indictment was chalked up to nothing more than politics as well until the sordid details started coming out. Now I'd be surprised if he's not doing time at the end of all this.
 
Rover said:
The only thing funnier than Rick Perry getting indicted is some people in the lamestream media saying this will actually help him. :eek:

Look, maybe he beats the rap and maybe he doesn't, but I don't recall indictments helping too many politicians careers even if they do get off (see Edwards, John). Plus someone might start asking why a career politician like Perry is a multi-millionaire. :rolleyes: Where did that money come from? Another Bob McDonnell, perhaps?

With McDonnell in mind, lets see where this goes before passing judgement. At first, the VA Gov's indictment was chalked up to nothing more than politics as well until the sordid details started coming out. Now I'd be surprised if he's not doing time at the end of all this.
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You do know that both David Axlerod and Alan Dershowitz have called the idictment politically motivated Dershowitz says that it is indicative of a totalitarian state.
 
Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

joecct said:
You do know that both David Axlerod and Alan Dershowitz have called the idictment politically motivated Dershowitz says that it is indicative of a totalitarian state.
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Dershowitz says stuff like that. I always discount his words as being shock click bait.

However, even the people on the Stephanie Miller show said as much. This seems to be clearly Political BS Theater. But the Boehner suit against Obama? Now that's serious, substantive stuff. :p

This is a pretty good critical test. If someone supports one as serious and rejects the other as frivolous, they're partisan. If they reject both, they're sensible. If the accept both... um, I dunno what to say. :)
 
Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

Kepler

Something has to be done to curb the growth of Executive Orders that encroach upon the legislative branch. Human nature being what it is, do you have any way to reduce the # outside of the courts?
 
Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

joecct said:
Something has to be done to curb the growth of Executive Orders that encroach upon the legislative branch.
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I am all for reining in the Imperial Presidency. That isn't what this is about, at all. The lawsuit has zero legitimate content -- it is pure politics. It has no merit whatever.

Another problem with restoring proper balance between branches is that the growth of executive power is at least half due to legislative abnegation of responsibility. Congress has learned they can pawn off the hard work onto the executive, then criticize with impunity, second guess, and howl about executive poaching of their sacred rights. This has been a deliberate, cynical political strategy by legislators of both parties going back decades. This isn't a coup by the president as much as Congress constantly passing the ball to the Oval Office, then screaming the president is a ball hog.
 
Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

joecct said:
You do know that both David Axlerod and Alan Dershowitz have called the idictment politically motivated Dershowitz says that it is indicative of a totalitarian state.
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I do and I could care less as I don't get my opinions from David Axelrod or Alan Dershowitz. What I posted and stick with is lets see more of the details here. As has been posted, he was charged by a special prosecutor, not by the person he was trying to get to resign. He was also indicted by a grand jury of his peers so they must have seen something. As Kep alluded to, its funny how every indicted Republican is a victim of a partisan witch-hunt (in Texas no less :rolleyes:) but all GOP lawsuits are completely with merit.
 
Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

joecct said:
Kepler

Something has to be done to curb the growth of Executive Orders that encroach upon the legislative branch. Human nature being what it is, do you have any way to reduce the # outside of the courts?
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Woooooooooooooooooosh.
 
Kepler said:
I am all for reining in the Imperial Presidency. That isn't what this is about, at all. The lawsuit has zero legitimate content -- it is pure politics. It has no merit whatever.

Another problem with restoring proper balance between branches is that the growth of executive power is at least half due to legislative abnegation of responsibility. Congress has learned they can pawn off the hard work onto the executive, then criticize with impunity, second guess, and howl about executive poaching of their sacred rights. This has been a deliberate, cynical political strategy by legislators of both parties going back decades. This isn't a coup by the president as much as Congress constantly passing the ball to the Oval Office, then screaming the president is a ball hog.
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Disagree with your first part. Wholeheartedly agree with your second. Which leads to this article in today's WaPo..

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-politics/wp/2014/08/18/voters-have-lost-faith-in-congress-but-not-in-their-member-of-congress/?tid=HP_more
 
Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

Why Rick Perry will be convicted.

Perry is accused of using his veto authority to coerce a publicly elected official into leaving office. And when the veto threat, and later the actual exercise of the veto didn't work, he may have tried a bit of bribery, which is why he is facing criminal charges.

First, he used the veto to threaten a public officeholder. This is abuse of the power of his office. Presidents and governors frequently use the possibility of vetoes to change the course of legislation. But that is considerably different than trying to force an elected officeholder to resign. What Perry did, if true, can be politely called blackmail, and, when he sent emissaries to urge Lehmberg to quit even after his veto, he may have indulged in bribery. According to sources close to the grand jury, Perry dispatched two of his staffers and one high-profile Democrat to tell Lehmberg if she left her office the governor would reinstate the PIU budget. One report indicates there may have been a quid pro quo of a new, more lucrative job for the DA, which is why this case has nothing to do with his right to use the veto.
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http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/perry-finds-way-blame-obama-indictments

Oh, and by the way. The Liberally Biased Lamsstream Media has done a HORRIBLE job reporting on this story.

And here's the best part. Perry's hypocrisy.

When Perry ran for Texas agriculture commissioner in 1990, he benefited from a federal investigation of his opponent's office, which had been facilitated by his campaign manager Karl Rove. Rove worked with an FBI agent to investigate Democrat Jim Hightower and two of his senior staffers at a time when Perry was challenging Hightower for the agriculture commissioner's job. The FBI, in fact, served search warrants at Hightower's state office on the day he was out of town announcing his reelection plans.

Perry had been a Democrat and Rove had convinced him to change parties. Rove ran Perry's winning campaign while also constantly leaking information on the federal investigation to reporters. Hightower escaped indictment but the two senior administrators of his office were convicted of raising campaign money for the Democrat during after hours while traveling on state business. One long-time Austin political operative said that if that were a crime, it was "something that only happened about 1000 times a day in Texas."

Consequently, Perry is demonstrably incorrect that Texans don't use the legal system to settle political scores. Instead, we often turn it into a form of tragicomedy. The PIU has prosecuted seventeen officeholders since it was created; thirteen were Democrats. And it will be no minor irony that Perry, who came into statewide office as the result of a grand jury investigation, might just end his carer as an outcome of the same process.
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Rover said:
He sure wasn't singing that song when Bush was President....
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I don't mind EO's that proclaim national left handers day and the like. I do not like EO's that legislate nor courts that do the same thing.

43 exaberated (sp?) a worrisome trend that has increased under 44. If 45 is an R and goes above 44's reach, will you complain?

I will.
 
Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

joecct said:
Kepler

Something has to be done to curb the growth of Executive Orders that encroach upon the legislative branch.
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The current president has been doing his part. There hasn't been a president since "Benjamin Harrison who averaged fewer executive orders per year than Obama. Reagan, Bush I and Bush II all used more. No president has averaged 100 or more executive orders per year since the glory days back in the 40s. Back when this country really was something.

Gerhard Peters: Executive Orders. The American Presidency Project.
 
Re: 2nd Term Part VIII - The Thin Red Line

joecct said:
I don't mind EO's that proclaim national left handers day and the like. I do not like EO's that legislate nor courts that do the same thing.

43 exaberated (sp?) a worrisome trend that has increased under 44. If 45 is an R and goes above 44's reach, will you complain?

I will.
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I won't because there's a simple check on all that which is the court system. For example, President Bush assumed the authority to detain American citizens without charges under the War on Terror guise. The SCOTUS said no.

Similarly, if the O passed on exec order that was out of bounds, let an unfriendly to him SCOTUS rule against it. Otherwise its just whining out of the right that their desire to halt all forms of government until they can get back into power hasn't worked as they thought it would.
 
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