Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Name your price. The EC will not be abolished.
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2020 Democratic Challengers III: Weekend at Bernie's
- Thread starter Spartanforlife4
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Name your price. The EC will not be abolished.
5 years ago Nate Silver predicted 270 is unlikely, and since then only Connecticut has passed it.
unofan
Well-known member
Doesn't have to be abolished if enough states do an end around.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
How is it more? How is Wyoming more powerful than California under the EC? Wyoming isn't even as powerful as Iowa.
That is the farce of this...you have a point with the two senators but in the National Election they have zero say on the outcome.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
And who is going to do that? No small state is going to even if they are Blue. Red States for sure won't.
Again I am for divying up the EVs however the state wants but most states have enough issues to solve that it will be ignored.
Edit: this discussion might belong somewhere else. Started a thread
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unofan
Well-known member
Wyoming has one electoral vote for roughly every 150,000 people. California has one electoral vote for every 500,000 people. Essentially, the average Wyoming voter has 3.5 times the power of a California voter in the EV.
In the Senate, the difference is starker. A Wyoming voter is equal to 66 California voters.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: Weekend at Bernie's
Well, it obviously will be, eventually. The long trend in American political history is towards greater democracy and equality. We've been ironing out both Constitutional and statutory inequalities for the last 240 years -- privileges accorded the wealthy, whites, men, whites again have fallen, and we will eventually get rid of privileges given to rural voters for a variety of historical and cultural reasons (slavery, Jeffersonian Utopian primitivism, racism).
The Electoral College falls on the number line somewhere beyond lynchings, poll taxes, and voter id, but it's there for the same purposes and someday we will get rid of it. And that "someday" will be the moment Texas goes blue which, given Yankee techie migration there, Messicans, and the subsequent improvement in both education and overall intelligence, is slated for about 25 years from now.
There is one way to save the EC without instituting a full blown South African apartheid state: split states up into 1 million pop unit states. Create 250 more states out of the big states. Then the effect of the silly states like ND and WY will be completely swamped. MT will have the electoral clout of Brooklyn, as it ought.
Well, it obviously will be, eventually. The long trend in American political history is towards greater democracy and equality. We've been ironing out both Constitutional and statutory inequalities for the last 240 years -- privileges accorded the wealthy, whites, men, whites again have fallen, and we will eventually get rid of privileges given to rural voters for a variety of historical and cultural reasons (slavery, Jeffersonian Utopian primitivism, racism).
The Electoral College falls on the number line somewhere beyond lynchings, poll taxes, and voter id, but it's there for the same purposes and someday we will get rid of it. And that "someday" will be the moment Texas goes blue which, given Yankee techie migration there, Messicans, and the subsequent improvement in both education and overall intelligence, is slated for about 25 years from now.
There is one way to save the EC without instituting a full blown South African apartheid state: split states up into 1 million pop unit states. Create 250 more states out of the big states. Then the effect of the silly states like ND and WY will be completely swamped. MT will have the electoral clout of Brooklyn, as it ought.
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FadeToBlack&Gold
Microlot Marxist
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: Weekend at Bernie's
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Here's the data. <a href="https://t.co/w1WJigC7qE">pic.twitter.com/w1WJigC7qE</a></p>— Nate Silver (@NateSilver538) <a href="https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/1102973238672527362?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 5, 2019</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Here's the data. <a href="https://t.co/w1WJigC7qE">pic.twitter.com/w1WJigC7qE</a></p>— Nate Silver (@NateSilver538) <a href="https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/1102973238672527362?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 5, 2019</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: Weekend at Bernie's
Colorado is getting read to pass it, and then I think New Mexico is looking likely to be next. After that Delaware, Maine, Nevada, and Oregon are the low hanging fruit -- but some of them have had Democrats in control of their legislatures and governorship for a while and haven't taken any steps to sign on.
It doesn't seem very likely to get to 270.
Colorado is getting read to pass it, and then I think New Mexico is looking likely to be next. After that Delaware, Maine, Nevada, and Oregon are the low hanging fruit -- but some of them have had Democrats in control of their legislatures and governorship for a while and haven't taken any steps to sign on.
It doesn't seem very likely to get to 270.
FadeToBlack&Gold
Microlot Marxist
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: Weekend at Bernie's
The "popular vote gets the EV" thing is never going to get traction outside of states that already lean or are solidly blue.
Here's an idea - field a candidate who will actually campaign in Pennsylvania, Michigan, Ohio, and Wisconsin this time, instead of taking us for granted and wasting time trying to pick off states like Georgia and Arizona that are still 10+ years away from flipping. What a concept.
I feel like a godd@mn broken record at this point.
The "popular vote gets the EV" thing is never going to get traction outside of states that already lean or are solidly blue.
Here's an idea - field a candidate who will actually campaign in Pennsylvania, Michigan, Ohio, and Wisconsin this time, instead of taking us for granted and wasting time trying to pick off states like Georgia and Arizona that are still 10+ years away from flipping. What a concept.
I feel like a godd@mn broken record at this point.Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: Weekend at Bernie's
You sound like a broken record spewing misinformation. The ticket did several events in Pennsylvania and Ohio during the 2016 campaign. The internet is your friend...
The "popular vote gets the EV" thing is never going to get traction outside of states that already lean or are solidly blue.
Here's an idea - field a candidate who will actually campaign in Pennsylvania, Michigan, Ohio, and Wisconsin this time, instead of taking us for granted and wasting time trying to pick off states like Georgia and Arizona that are still 10+ years away from flipping. What a concept.
You sound like a broken record spewing misinformation. The ticket did several events in Pennsylvania and Ohio during the 2016 campaign. The internet is your friend...
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: Weekend at Bernie's
And it didnt do the ones in Wisconsin and Michigan when the operatives on the ground were saying they were in trouble. It isnt like thisnt common knowledge...
It would take a special level of stupid and arrogance to make that mistake again.
And it didnt do the ones in Wisconsin and Michigan when the operatives on the ground were saying they were in trouble. It isnt like thisnt common knowledge...
It would take a special level of stupid and arrogance to make that mistake again.
mookie1995
there's a good buck in that racket.
Rover needs to take hilly’s Cawk out of his mouth.... she lost. Get over it
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: Weekend at Bernie's
Thank you Captain Obvious!
The point being that Hil's problem wasn't campaign appearances as she lost PA and OH despite spending time there. Her problem was not inspiring a lazy Dem coalition to vote for her instead of 3rd party candidates or Trump himself. My guess is after 4 years of Chump Dems will vote for a potted plant for President at this point.
mookie, go back to grossing people out on the AOC thread.
Thank you Captain Obvious!
The point being that Hil's problem wasn't campaign appearances as she lost PA and OH despite spending time there. Her problem was not inspiring a lazy Dem coalition to vote for her instead of 3rd party candidates or Trump himself. My guess is after 4 years of Chump Dems will vote for a potted plant for President at this point. mookie, go back to grossing people out on the AOC thread.
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Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: Weekend at Bernie's
Can we just please never use Hillary's name again? She is less relevant than Chester A. Arthur. The only purpose of name dropping her is to create a fight between liberals and moderates or give the Hater Base a ragerection (the only kind they can manage anymore).
Love her or hate her, she's dead. Move on.
Can we just please never use Hillary's name again? She is less relevant than Chester A. Arthur. The only purpose of name dropping her is to create a fight between liberals and moderates or give the Hater Base a ragerection (the only kind they can manage anymore).
Love her or hate her, she's dead. Move on.
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: Weekend at Bernie's
Those who fail to learn from the past (2000) are doomed to repeat it (2016).
Those who fail to learn from the past (2000) are doomed to repeat it (2016).
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: Weekend at Bernie's
Very true. But Hillary didn't lose WI, etc because she didn't go there (as is evidenced by PA, etc). She lost because moderates in the midwest couldn't stand her - PA, OH, IN, MI, IL, WI, IA, MN - she got blitzed in every single last midwest state. Unless the EC goes away in the next 18 months, the lesson is clear. 2020 needs to field a candidate that can win the moderates in the midwest. Now to finding that candidate...
Very true. But Hillary didn't lose WI, etc because she didn't go there (as is evidenced by PA, etc). She lost because moderates in the midwest couldn't stand her - PA, OH, IN, MI, IL, WI, IA, MN - she got blitzed in every single last midwest state. Unless the EC goes away in the next 18 months, the lesson is clear. 2020 needs to field a candidate that can win the moderates in the midwest. Now to finding that candidate...
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: 2020 Democratic Challengers III: Weekend at Bernie's
Zoinks. I should have said PA, OH, IN, IL, WI, IA, MN and outstate NY and ME.
https://www.cnbc.com/heres-a-map-of-the-us-counties-that-flipped-to-trump-from-democrats/
Outside of the midwest votes that switched to Trump, what are the Ds options then? Win Florida and Arizona? There are about no other swing electoral votes available nationwide and good luck with those. Win back the midwest or we'll win back Trump.
Zoinks. I should have said PA, OH, IN, IL, WI, IA, MN and outstate NY and ME.
https://www.cnbc.com/heres-a-map-of-the-us-counties-that-flipped-to-trump-from-democrats/
Outside of the midwest votes that switched to Trump, what are the Ds options then? Win Florida and Arizona? There are about no other swing electoral votes available nationwide and good luck with those. Win back the midwest or we'll win back Trump.
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