2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

[e.cat]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

I agree with chickod. Hockey East needs to change recruiting. We need cheerleaders in the stands too!

 

[joecct]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

UMD was/is "Been there, done that. Got the TShirt". Played like it.

UMass is/was "Wowsers!" Played like it.

 

[BlackI]

I agree with chickod. Hockey East needs to change recruiting. We need cheerleaders in the stands too!

I can only agree on the last sentence.

 

[e.cat]

I can only agree on the last sentence.

Haha! Glad you agree;-)
How could you not?

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

UMD put on an absolute clinic. Maybe a bit of a hot take, but is Sandelin the best North American head coach that isn't coaching in the NHL right now?

A great coach can take a good class and make it exceptional. UMD rarely has the top recruiting class in the country, but stays on top regardless.

It wouldn't surprise me if he stays at UMD to retirement. A top notch throwback in 2019.

 

[state of hockey]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

Congrats to the Bulldogs once again. Consider yourselves lucky that the B1G refs couldn't find a way to hand it to Notre Dame.

 

[CanalPark]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

As someone who has been going to UMD games since the early 80's as a little kid, I don't know how we've gotten to where we are today. There were some dark years between 1986, 1993, and 2003-2004, until we finally got it going in 2009. Personally, first one was surreal and last year was really a validation for the program, but last night was just enjoying the ride. We are going to lose some guys early and Sandelin deserves a shot at the NHL, so who knows where it all goes from here. Back to my original question I've thought about how we went from being a second tier program and one described by my Gopher friends as their ugly stepchild, to now the best program in the nation and this is what I have as factors:
1. The obvious Sandelin figuring it out. There were some valleys in his tenure and I think the lowest was pulling scholarships from guys and still feel it was a bad look.
2. A shift towards Minnesota kids and not just older Canadian players who didn't develop much from their freshman year.
3. Amsoil Arena feels like a big time venue as opposed to the DECC.
4. The biggest factor in my opinion the development of the Hermantown program. That school has been the gift that has just kept on giving us top tier talent.

I hope St. Cloud and Mankato wins one soon!

 

[Bomber]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

BU needs to turn that Charlestown/Catholic Memorial pipeline back on. Throw in a few Thayer/St. Sebastian kids and make it a MA party.

 

[Kepler]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

BU needs to turn that Charlestown/Catholic Memorial pipeline back on. Throw in a few Thayer/St. Sebastian kids and make it a MA party.

What about Arlington?

 

[Biddco]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

Don't know what people are talking about with the game...I thought it was terrific.


It's impossible to fathom where this program is. I never thought they'd win a title and now they've had one the best decades in the history of the sport. Sandelin, whose job was in jeopardy 10 years ago is now mentioned with the likes of Herb Brooks, John MacInnes, Jack Parker...I just shake my head thinking about it.

 

[Hoover]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

Don't know what people are talking about with the game...I thought it was terrific.

I guess your view of the game might be relative to you being a fan/supporter of UMD.

I was there, and didn't think it was a very good Championship game. I went in hoping for a battle between the speed and skill of UMass and the discipline, defense, and physical play of UMD. Unfortunately for the impartial observer, we only saw one team play "their" game. I sensed that UMass was going to struggle to play to their strengths only minutes after the opening faceoff. UMD was more aggressive all over the ice, and played a defensive style/system that smothered the speed of UMass. I couldn't count how many times a UMass player started out deep in his own end and ended up being forced wide between the bluelines, allowing the UMD forwards to get back to help the defense. UMass was forced to play east-west, rather than north-south, and that is essentially what cost them a chance of competing last night. Good on UMD for sticking to a system - UMass didn't change their strategy and were turned back time and time again. I definitely think UMD was the better team last night, but part of what hurt UMass was their lack of adapting to another style when facing an opponent who was negating their strengths.

Congratulations to the Bulldogs for back-to-back National Championships. Three Frozen Four appearances in a row is quite an accomplishment.

 

[Biddco]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

I guess your view of the game might be relative to you being a fan/supporter of UMD.

I was there, and didn't think it was a very good Championship game. I went in hoping for a battle between the speed and skill of UMass and the discipline, defense, and physical play of UMD. Unfortunately for the impartial observer, we only saw one team play "their" game. I sensed that UMass was going to struggle to play to their strengths only minutes after the opening faceoff. UMD was more aggressive all over the ice, and played a defensive style/system that smothered the speed of UMass. I couldn't count how many times a UMass player started out deep in his own end and ended up being forced wide between the bluelines, allowing the UMD forwards to get back to help the defense. UMass was forced to play east-west, rather than north-south, and that is essentially what cost them a chance of competing last night. Good on UMD for sticking to a system - UMass didn't change their strategy and were turned back time and time again. I definitely think UMD was the better team last night, but part of what hurt UMass was their lack of adapting to another style when facing an opponent who was negating their strengths.

Congratulation to the Bulldogs for back-to-back National Championships. Three Frozen Four appearances in a row is quite an accomplishment.

Exactly! Well written post and good analysis of the game.

 

[Fishman'81]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

Of all the championship games that have been played, that was certainly one of them.

Yeah, that.

UMD has a plan: Lake State 2.0. Sandy has out-Jacksoned Jeff at this juncture, but with much more speed at the former's disposal.

It's effective -obviously- but mighty dull to witness, and we all will see more of the same for the foreseeable, probably.

The NHL is determined to bury college hockey, unwittingly or not, via the latest CBA, and that game is more evidence that it's working.

 

[Fishman'81]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

I guess your view of the game might be relative to you being a fan/supporter of UMD.

I was there, and didn't think it was a very good Championship game. I went in hoping for a battle between the speed and skill of UMass and the discipline, defense, and physical play of UMD. Unfortunately for the impartial observer, we only saw one team play "their" game. I sensed that UMass was going to struggle to play to their strengths only minutes after the opening faceoff. UMD was more aggressive all over the ice, and played a defensive style/system that smothered the speed of UMass. I couldn't count how many times a UMass player started out deep in his own end and ended up being forced wide between the bluelines, allowing the UMD forwards to get back to help the defense. UMass was forced to play east-west, rather than north-south, and that is essentially what cost them a chance of competing last night. Good on UMD for sticking to a system - UMass didn't change their strategy and were turned back time and time again. I definitely think UMD was the better team last night, but part of what hurt UMass was their lack of adapting to another style when facing an opponent who was negating their strengths.

Congratulations to the Bulldogs for back-to-back National Championships. Three Frozen Four appearances in a row is quite an accomplishment.

Your take was a good one, IMO.

The only way that game could have been competitive was if UMass played as conservatively as UMD did. (But, then they'd both be in the 37th scoreless OT as we speak.)

The Warden and I are sooo delighted that we didn't drive 3-hours to see that snooze-fest. God knows, it was bad enough on TV.

 

[Hoover]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

Your take was a good one, IMO.

The only way that game could have been competitive was if UMass played as conservatively as UMD did.

(But, then they'd both be in the 37th OT as we speak.)

I agree - we would have seen a game reminiscent of the NHL's "dead-puck era" of the late '90's when teams were playing conservatively and only tried to score on turnovers by the opposition (no offensive interest or creativity = boring hockey!).

 

[Hoover]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

The Warden and I are sooo delighted that we didn't drive 3-hours to see that snooze-fest. God knows, it was bad enough on TV.

Since I am only about an hour (driving) from Buffalo I made the trip both Thursday and Saturday. I still had a great time catching up with old friends and meeting new people who share common interests!

 

[Fishman'81]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

I agree - we would have seen a game reminiscent of the NHL's "dead-puck era" of the late '90's when teams were playing conservatively and only tried to score on turnovers by the opposition (no offensive interest or creativity = boring hockey!).

Since I am only about an hour (driving) from Buffalo I made the trip both Thursday and Saturday. I still had a great time catching up with old friends and meeting new people who share common interests!

I'd hate to go back to that era, but it already seems that we have.

If there a disincentive for young talent to play college hockey, or to stick-around for more than a year or two, we're stuck with older Junior washouts.

Not a lot of fun to watch.

 

[brassbonanza]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

Championships won by Western schools: 52
Championships won by Eastern schools: 19

Longest winning streak by Western schools: 12 (1955-66)
Longest winning streak by Eastern schools: 4 (2012-15)

# of NCAA titles won by NCHC since league was formed: 4 out of 6

Hockey East schools need to change their recruiting strategy. Period.

HE this year had:
- National coach of the year
- National player of the year
- National rookie of the year
- National goalie of the year
- Two FF teams
- One NCG team

There's definitely a gap between HE and the NCHC, and there's some tweaks some programs need to make but the gap is not nearly as large as you make it seem.

 

[The Rube]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

As someone who has been going to UMD games since the early 80's as a little kid, I don't know how we've gotten to where we are today. There were some dark years between 1986, 1993, and 2003-2004, until we finally got it going in 2009. Personally, first one was surreal and last year was really a validation for the program, but last night was just enjoying the ride. We are going to lose some guys early and Sandelin deserves a shot at the NHL, so who knows where it all goes from here. Back to my original question I've thought about how we went from being a second tier program and one described by my Gopher friends as their ugly stepchild, to now the best program in the nation and this is what I have as factors:
1. The obvious Sandelin figuring it out. There were some valleys in his tenure and I think the lowest was pulling scholarships from guys and still feel it was a bad look.
2. A shift towards Minnesota kids and not just older Canadian players who didn't develop much from their freshman year.
3. Amsoil Arena feels like a big time venue as opposed to the DECC.
4. The biggest factor in my opinion the development of the Hermantown program. That school has been the gift that has just kept on giving us top tier talent.

I hope St. Cloud and Mankato wins one soon!

Had season tix in 1993. I wondered why the hell I spent that money.

 

[Slap Shot]

Re: 2019 Frozen Four: NCHC vs. Hockey East

I'd hate to go back to that era, but it already seems that we have.

If there a disincentive for young talent to play college hockey, or to stick-around for more than a year or two, we're stuck with older Junior washouts.

Not a lot of fun to watch.

Not seeing a higher trend in MN kids skipping college than at any time in recent past. Some data to consider:

-Draft picks playing in college hockey and comparisons the past 20 years
-# of players in the NHL with college experience, average # of seasons played for the same time period
-Etc.

As for it being a "dead puck" era they really need to consider reducing the size of the goalie equipment. Would be curious to see average # of goals scored per game the past 10 years as well to validate if scoring is trending downward.

[edit]

Sorry for the lack of formatting but if teams are actually trending older are they finding more success because of it?:

Rank Team Ave Age PWR KRACH
1 Alaska-Anchorage 22y 9m 60 60
2 Canisius 22y 8m 54 54
3 Minnesota State 22y 7m 3 3
4 American Int'l 22y 7m 31 40
5 Army 22y 6m 52 56
6 Bemidji State 22y 5m 35 35
7 Air Force 22y 5m 43 48
8 Sacred Heart 22y 5m 40 49
9 Alabama-Huntsville 22y 5m 58 57
10 Mercyhurst 22y 4m 53 55
11 Northern Michigan 22y 3m 24 27
12 RIT 22y 3m 36 46
13 Nebraska-Omaha 22y 3m 47 37
14 Michigan Tech 22y 2m 42 42
15 Lake Superior 22y 2m 22 21
16 Robert Morris 22y 2m 49 52
17 Ferris State 22y 2m 57 53
18 Bentley 22y 2m 39 47
19 Maine 22y 2m 30 30
20 Colgate 22y 2m 50 45
21 Merrimack 22y 1m 55 51
22 Ohio State 22y 1m 9 7
23 Alaska 22y 1m 48 43
24 Arizona State 22y 1m 10 15
25 Dartmouth 22y 0m 37 38
26 Brown 22y 0m 25 28
27 Rensselaer 21y 11m 51 44
28 Holy Cross 21y 11m 56 58
29 Colorado College 21y 11m 23 23
30 Penn State 21y 11m 16 12
31 Clarkson 21y 11m 5 9
32 Niagara 21y 11m 45 50
33 St. Cloud State 21y 11m 1 1
34 Union 21y 11m 18 20
35 Vermont 21y 11m 41 36
36 Yale 21y 10m 29 31
37 Miami 21y 10m 38 34
38 Mass.-Lowell 21y 10m 21 22
39 Bowling Green 21y 9m 15 18
40 Northeastern 21y 9m 6 6
41 Western Michigan 21y 9m 17 13
42 North Dakota 21y 6m 19 19
43 Massachusetts 21y 6m 4 4
44 Cornell 21y 6m 11 11
45 Minnesota-Duluth 21y 6m 2 2
46 Princeton 21y 5m 44 39
47 St. Lawrence 21y 5m 59 59
48 New Hampshire 21y 5m 34 33
49 Michigan State 21y 5m 32 29
50 Quinnipiac 21y 4m 7 8
51 Providence 21y 4m 14 16
52 Harvard 21y 3m 13 14
53 Minnesota 21y 3m 20 17
54 Notre Dame 21y 1m 12 10
55 Connecticut 21y 1m 46 41
56 Michigan 20y 11m 28 25
57 Denver 20y 11m 8 5
58 Boston College 20y 10m 33 32
59 Wisconsin 20y 10m 27 24
60 Boston University 20y 6m 26 26

Denver was 4th youngest, 8th in PWR and 4th in KRACH.
Quinnipiac 11th youngest, 7th and 8th.
UMD 16th, 2nd and 2nd.
Cornell 17th, 11th and 11th
UMASS 18th, 4th and 4th.

MSUM and OSU (3rd oldest and 22nd) that finished Top 10 for PWR and KRACH.

Finally leaving out MSUM the average age rank for Top 16 teams in PWR was 41st oldest out of 60 teams - in other words on the younger end of the spectrum.