University of Maine 2024–2025: Freel-ing good

[Drew S.]

You've missed the point. There are two buckets of money.

BUCKET ONE: Revenue sharing. This money is what it sounds like, a sliver of the overall money earned by the athletic department in media payments, ticket sales, concessions, etc. This is reserved for schools that opt-in and is capped at $20.5M for the entire athletic department. Schools are not required to spend all $20.5M. Schools aren't even required to spend $1! There is going to be a wide gap between opt-in schools. It's unlikely many schools opting-in will be spending much on hockey. Some will (Denver, for sure). Some won't (I can't imagine Ohio State spends any of its $20.5M on hockey). Some will fall in the middle (Minnesota?).

BUCKET TWO: NIL. NIL is money paid from a third party to an athlete for endorsements (nominally). This is completely detached from the opt-in and opt-out decision. Every school can organize as much NIL as they want whether they opt-in or not. Maine could go to LL Bean and organize $40,000,000 in NIL money available to its athletes even though Maine opted out. There's no cap.

My point is that UConn, despite being an opt-in school, is unlikely to be making much money from Bucket One to its men's hockey players. They aren't going to have the full $20.5M, they are going to need to spend a lot of money on men's and women's basketball to keep those programs at a level to win national titles, they still have an FBS football program, and they have like 10 sports they are trying to win at. I'd imagine that any money being made available to Marques is coming from Bucket Two. And Maine can spend money from Bucket Two just like UConn.

There are going to be "Opt Out" hockey schools that have higher roster "payrolls" than "Opt In" hockey schools. North Dakota is going to outspend Notre Dame on ice hockey, for example.

Number two is changing and it’s going to look different than it does now. Players are going to have to report all deals over $600 and some third party needs to sign off on them.

 

[Sparkee]

Soltys is gone, would it be his replacement?

Soltys was recruiter that spent a lot of time on the road and studying film on players. He was less “on ice” coaching. That is why he evidently graduated to that GM role for Lake State.

It is rumored John O’Connor is headed to Maine. He was the recruiter for Mt. St. Charles in Rhode Island. So he would be more in the role of Soltys for Maine. He would have a lot of knowledge on recruits coming of age to be recruited at NCAA level as well as ones in juniors now.

Fortier was “on ice” coaching of the forwards and power play units. He is rumored to have gotten a head coach job in CHL somewhere. That link someone posted has been removed, so not sure where he was rumored to be going.

Bennett is an “on ice” coach that has a reputation of being good at developing his players. He also had to step down over accusations he was too hard on his players in practices. Though he had many/most former players coming to his defense. It likely was an entitled player and blind parents(similar to WhistleBB) that thought their kid deserved more playing time and sent in an anonymous email complaint triggering the whole thing.

Anyways it looks like O’Connor to replace Soltys, and Bennett to replace Fortier. That is if these rumors from Divver are true. Divver is right nearly 100% on his rumors it seems.

 

[McGoverners]

Number two is changing and it’s going to look different than it does now. Players are going to have to report all deals over $600 and some third party needs to sign off on them.

I may be wrong, but I believe that is part of the house settlement and the newly created College Sports Commission, which Maine is not participating in.

Maine remains free to be as shady with NIL as they would like.

EDIT: I was in fact wrong. According to the CSC website, all student athletes are subject to the new NIL rules. Though I imagine that will get challenged soon.

 

[Sparkee]

I may be wrong, but I believe that is part of the house settlement and the newly created College Sports Commission, which Maine is not participating in.

Maine remains free to be as shady with NIL as they would like.

EDIT: I was in fact wrong. According to the CSC website, all student athletes are subject to the new NIL rules. Though I imagine that will get challenged soon.

What are the parameters for a Division I men’s or women’s hockey program at an institution that does not opt in to the settlement?

Answer: The hockey programs will operate under the current structure of 18 equivalency scholarships for their hockey program. All existing Division I legislation remains in effect. However, one change will be that all student-athletes will need to report Name, Image and Likeness income exceeding $600.

 

[blackbears9]

Fortier was “on ice” coaching of the forwards and power play units. He is rumored to have gotten a head coach job in CHL somewhere. That link someone posted has been removed, so not sure where he was rumored to be going.

Anyways it looks like O’Connor to replace Soltys, and Bennett to replace Fortier. That is if these rumors from Divver are true. Divver is right nearly 100% on his rumors it seems.

The tweet didn't say where he was going, just said it's rumored he's getting a CHL head coaching gig. If I had to guess I would say Niagara IceDogs, Fortier follows them on twitter and they have an opening. I'm not sure why the tweet was taken down, but Fortier follows the account that posted in, maybe he asked them to take it down?

And one small thing to nitpick. It looks like Divver is reporting Bennett to Maine, he specifically said O'Conner was a rumor and he was not reporting it as a fact.

 

[Sparkee]

I think the fact that Maine can’t offer 26 scholarships, and is limited to 18, means many recruiting battles Maine starts out $15k in the hole. Can’t offer any revenue sharing so this likely grows the difference to $30k if the revenue sharing amounts to $15k per athlete. Which is roughly $400k per year share for Men’s hockey. And now with the NIL being governed, they likely offer similar NIL deals. So the $30k difference is $120k difference over four years. Parents absolutely would not like their kid choosing the school $120k more expensive unless there was a substantial development edge that gets their makes NHL much more likely for their kid. I don’t think Barr has that much more reputation than Cavanaugh, after all Cavanaugh just got HE coach of the year. This is how the recruiting battle is lost. It will play out over and again. Which sucks for us Maine fans the long Maine decides to opt out.

I have not heard an example like this where Maine comes out on top. Just talk about buckets and no concrete number to demonstrate it. Offer an example where Maine comes out ahead and I will be convinced. Until then I can’t see how Maine won’t be at a substantial recruiting disadvantage by opting out.

 

[blackbears9]

Jack Webb is confirming Fortier is gone.

https://x.com/Jackiemoon_25/status/1933238001707987335

 

[AMC]

I think the fact that Maine can’t offer 26 scholarships, and is limited to 18, means many recruiting battles Maine starts out $15k in the hole. Can’t offer any revenue sharing so this likely grows the difference to $30k if the revenue sharing amounts to $15k per athlete. Which is roughly $400k per year share for Men’s hockey. And now with the NIL being governed, they likely offer similar NIL deals. So the $30k difference is $120k difference over four years. Parents absolutely would not like their kid choosing the school $120k more expensive unless there was a substantial development edge that gets their makes NHL much more likely for their kid. I don’t think Barr has that much more reputation than Cavanaugh, after all Cavanaugh just got HE coach of the year. This is how the recruiting battle is lost. It will play out over and again. Which sucks for us Maine fans the long Maine decides to opt out.

I have not heard an example like this where Maine comes out on top. Just talk about buckets and no concrete number to demonstrate it. Offer an example where Maine comes out ahead and I will be convinced. Until then I can’t see how Maine won’t be at a substantial recruiting disadvantage by opting out.

Whether NIL contracts need to be reviewed or not, they are allowed to exist. There are still going to be huge NIL deals.

I'm not sure how Maine is starting $15,000 in the hole if they are recruiting a player that they want. If they are offering him a full scholarship, great, he gets a scholarship. It's not $15,000 less valuable because Maine isn't offering scholarships 19-26. Would Maine be at a disadvantage offering kid #18 a half scholarship when UConn or whoever is offering a full scholarship? Sure. Also, if parents always want to pay less money wouldn't Maine at a lower cost of enrollment always beat out $86,000/year Boston College if neither player is offered a full scholarship? It just doesn't work that way.

Also, I highly doubt UConn is funding 8 extra scholarships (say $240,000 total costs) and $15,000 to all 26 men's hockey players ($390,000) in revenue sharing. That's $630,000 in extra spending on men's hockey. UConn spent $3.2M on men's hockey the last year Sean Pickett has data for. They are just going to magically find a 20% increase in funding in the couch cushions? AND have money to spend to the max on men's and women's basketball? AND have money to put a credible FBS roster on the football field? While getting Big East level media money? I find that hard to believe. Opting in doesn't magically mean you have money to give to players. It has to come from somewhere, and hard decisions need to be made about how it is spent.

Let's also be honest about where the "revenue sharing" money will come from for schools like Maine, who don't even get that Big East level media payout, let alone SEC or Big Ten money. It isn't from ticket sales, it isn't from sponsorships, it isn't from selling hats at Bear Necessities. It's from the academic side of the college. Maine, to its credit, doesn't actually soak the students for "athletic fees" on their tuition bills. But the vast, vast, vast majority of money that funds Black Bear athletics comes from "institutional transfers." Meaning money in the general budget moved over from academics to athletics. That's Maine's "revenue." If you want Maine to "Opt in" and have a pool of money, even half a million dollars, to spend on hockey revenue sharing, that's money that either comes from the State as funding for the University system, or its money that needs to be paid in tuition to make up for what isn't being spent because it's transferred to athletics.

Maine can opt in all you want. It isn't going to magically create actual money to give these guys.

 

[Dan]

Many schools have discussed opting out year one and reevaluating for year two, including - I believe - North Dakota.

Schools like UConn are opting in for basketball and football revenue sharing. I doubt difference making NIL money will trickle down for hockey programs at many schools.

Scholarships are important, but opting in for future years and matching those remains feasible.

 

[tylerzx2002]

Jack Webb is confirming Fortier is gone.

https://x.com/Jackiemoon_25/status/1933238001707987335

Kind of a bummer to see him and Soltys both leave, but sounds like between O'Connor and Bennett the program didn't fair too poorly in replacing them with good hockey minds.

Let's hope Forch keeps funneling talented players to Orono wherever he lands.

 

[AMC]

And that's what Maine is likely doing, too. No one knows what House is going to look like after all of these downstream legal challenges; the NCAA is trying to get some sort of Congressional exemption to labor laws and a salary cap; does Title IX even exist as a thing anymore is an open question....

If you are in an FBS conference you have to opt in. Even if you have no money to spend, you have to find some way to pay your football players. If you are in the Big East or Atlantic 10 you have to opt in to stay competitive in basketball. For everyone else, it's an open question on whether it is going to be necessary. Heck, do we even know if BC is going to spend any additional money on hockey? They are at the bottom of the ACC in basketball and football, and if Clemson and North Carolina and Louisville are going to spend $20.5M on basketball and football, can BC afford not to spend all $20.5M? Heck, BC might need to spend LESS on hockey.

No one knows anything concrete. What we do know is that Maine didn't wake up the day after the House settlement was signed with any extra money in its athletic department bank account. And I don't think a single one of us was saying "hey, Maine's spending a ton of discretionary money on extras" before. The Alfond money aside (which is targeted to facilities), this whole operation has been run on a shoestring for 30 years. If Maine says "we're opting in, we're adding 50 scholarships across all our sports, and we've got $15,000 to each athlete" where the heck is that money coming from? Is the state legislature going to free up an extra $3,000,000 or so to Maine athletics? Is the tuition bill going up for every student? Are we cutting sports?

 

[Drew S.]

I may be wrong, but I believe that is part of the house settlement and the newly created College Sports Commission, which Maine is not participating in.

Maine remains free to be as shady with NIL as they would like.

EDIT: I was in fact wrong. According to the CSC website, all student athletes are subject to the new NIL rules. Though I imagine that will get challenged soon.

I don’t think there is any doubt it will get challenged and athletes likely win. The only lasting solution will be either a CBA or free for all.

 

[rpi82]

I find your discussion very interesting. It's my understanding that outside NIL deals over $600 must be reported and there is some sort of approval process to ensure that they meet "fair market" criteria. What does that mean? Is "fair market" determined by what players at other schools are getting in outside deals or is it intended to ensure the amount they are being paid is somehow commensurate with the value they provide to the sponsoring organization. For example, if a Maine bank wants to pay a Black Bear player $200K to make commercials is that OK if BC has a player making $200K or do they have to show that the marketing value to the bank equals $200K (i.e. he's being paid for the value he delivers to the sponsor and not because the bank CEO wants to see Maine in the Frozen Four)? This still seems like a mess.

 

[UncleRay]

Maine’s not dropping football. They should, but won’t. You can satisfy title IX multiple ways, including equal spending. Or equal scholarship opportunities. Cutting football, but adding M soccer, and taking the football budget and splitting it between all the men’s sports, would keep the proportions.

And I agree. Stop pasting AI slop into this thread.

Don't forget what Chat GPT means in French: Cat, I farted.

 

[Sparkee]

Whether NIL contracts need to be reviewed or not, they are allowed to exist. There are still going to be huge NIL deals.

I'm not sure how Maine is starting $15,000 in the hole if they are recruiting a player that they want. If they are offering him a full scholarship, great, he gets a scholarship. It's not $15,000 less valuable because Maine isn't offering scholarships 19-26. Would Maine be at a disadvantage offering kid #18 a half scholarship when UConn or whoever is offering a full scholarship? Sure. Also, if parents always want to pay less money wouldn't Maine at a lower cost of enrollment always beat out $86,000/year Boston College if neither player is offered a full scholarship? It just doesn't work that way.

Also, I highly doubt UConn is funding 8 extra scholarships (say $240,000 total costs) and $15,000 to all 26 men's hockey players ($390,000) in revenue sharing. That's $630,000 in extra spending on men's hockey. UConn spent $3.2M on men's hockey the last year Sean Pickett has data for. They are just going to magically find a 20% increase in funding in the couch cushions? AND have money to spend to the max on men's and women's basketball? AND have money to put a credible FBS roster on the football field? While getting Big East level media money? I find that hard to believe. Opting in doesn't magically mean you have money to give to players. It has to come from somewhere, and hard decisions need to be made about how it is spent.

Let's also be honest about where the "revenue sharing" money will come from for schools like Maine, who don't even get that Big East level media payout, let alone SEC or Big Ten money. It isn't from ticket sales, it isn't from sponsorships, it isn't from selling hats at Bear Necessities. It's from the academic side of the college. Maine, to its credit, doesn't actually soak the students for "athletic fees" on their tuition bills. But the vast, vast, vast majority of money that funds Black Bear athletics comes from "institutional transfers." Meaning money in the general budget moved over from academics to athletics. That's Maine's "revenue." If you want Maine to "Opt in" and have a pool of money, even half a million dollars, to spend on hockey revenue sharing, that's money that either comes from the State as funding for the University system, or its money that needs to be paid in tuition to make up for what isn't being spent because it's transferred to athletics.

Maine can opt in all you want. It isn't going to magically create actual money to give these guys.

I clearly stated the difference in tuition is from Maine offering half scholarship. I assumed $30,000 for tuition for a state school like UConn and Maine. If we say Maine gives out 10 full rides, and 16 half scholarships, then they are at 18 full rides equivalent. This means for 16 of the recruiting battles Maine is starting out 15k in the hole because UConn can annd will offer them full rides. This is the bulk of the disadvantage to not opting in. Your roster depth suffers, and you become less competitive due to roster depth issues.

No doubt opting in means more money needed from UMaine to support the opt in. I am proposing getting rid of the anchor by cutting the football program. It is a big money sink hole currently. Not for big schools, but for Maine it is. When you look at UMaine you don’t think of football school. You think of a hockey power that was in hibernation but is back. That is how people from outside of Maine think of Maine. Very few people outside of Maine would even know if Maine had a football program. Maine’s identity is its hockey program. So to keep that going I don’t have problems with Maine axing football as I mentioned previously. This way the money we had to spend on football can be redistributed amongst two new men’s sports(soccer, volleyball, and expanded track). This frees up roughly $3M that can be used for revenue sharing obligation, revenue sharing to current players, and 26 scholarships each for men’s and women’s hockey.

 

[Sparkee]

And that's what Maine is likely doing, too. No one knows what House is going to look like after all of these downstream legal challenges; the NCAA is trying to get some sort of Congressional exemption to labor laws and a salary cap; does Title IX even exist as a thing anymore is an open question....

If you are in an FBS conference you have to opt in. Even if you have no money to spend, you have to find some way to pay your football players. If you are in the Big East or Atlantic 10 you have to opt in to stay competitive in basketball. For everyone else, it's an open question on whether it is going to be necessary. Heck, do we even know if BC is going to spend any additional money on hockey? They are at the bottom of the ACC in basketball and football, and if Clemson and North Carolina and Louisville are going to spend $20.5M on basketball and football, can BC afford not to spend all $20.5M? Heck, BC might need to spend LESS on hockey.

No one knows anything concrete. What we do know is that Maine didn't wake up the day after the House settlement was signed with any extra money in its athletic department bank account. And I don't think a single one of us was saying "hey, Maine's spending a ton of discretionary money on extras" before. The Alfond money aside (which is targeted to facilities), this whole operation has been run on a shoestring for 30 years. If Maine says "we're opting in, we're adding 50 scholarships across all our sports, and we've got $15,000 to each athlete" where the heck is that money coming from? Is the state legislature going to free up an extra $3,000,000 or so to Maine athletics? Is the tuition bill going up for every student? Are we cutting sports?

Yes, cutting football if we have to in order to make it work.

 

[NorthMike]

Soltys was recruiter that spent a lot of time on the road and studying film on players. He was less “on ice” coaching. That is why he evidently graduated to that GM role for Lake State.

It is rumored John O’Connor is headed to Maine. He was the recruiter for Mt. St. Charles in Rhode Island. So he would be more in the role of Soltys for Maine. He would have a lot of knowledge on recruits coming of age to be recruited at NCAA level as well as ones in juniors now.

Fortier was “on ice” coaching of the forwards and power play units. He is rumored to have gotten a head coach job in CHL somewhere. That link someone posted has been removed, so not sure where he was rumored to be going.

Bennett is an “on ice” coach that has a reputation of being good at developing his players. He also had to step down over accusations he was too hard on his players in practices. Though he had many/most former players coming to his defense. It likely was an entitled player and blind parents(similar to WhistleBB) that thought their kid deserved more playing time and sent in an anonymous email complaint triggering the whole thing.

Anyways it looks like O’Connor to replace Soltys, and Bennett to replace Fortier. That is if these rumors from Divver are true. Divver is right nearly 100% on his rumors it seems.

Its all rumor except for Soltys right now and maybe bennet, hard to say.

I will tell you that Soltys was on the ice a fair amount, I caught pieces of around 20 practices this last season and he was on the ice as much as Fortier was. He was a coach.

 

[NorthMike]

Kind of a bummer to see him and Soltys both leave, but sounds like between O'Connor and Bennett the program didn't fair too poorly in replacing them with good hockey minds.

Let's hope Forch keeps funneling talented players to Orono wherever he lands.

Forch was a good locker room guy for the team and has as a pretty good eye for talent and who fits in where. I feel like he was key in implementing Barrs culture plans.
Bennett ? will see if he will be the same role or an expanded one even. He is getting up there age. Hope he has more to offer than Leach (a good hockey guy) did under Red.
Barr has always spoken very highly of Rick.
Well I was always told not to burn any bridges on the way out you never know who your next boss could be.
Hockey coaching is a small world.
Time to shut up, don e with the vodka tonic.

 

[Sparkee]

Its all rumor except for Soltys right now and maybe bennet, hard to say.

I will tell you that Soltys was on the ice a fair amount, I caught pieces of around 20 practices this last season and he was on the ice as much as Fortier was. He was a coach.

It became less rumor when Jack Webb confirmed most of it(see below). Now the only thing is if O’Connor is really on the coaching staff at Maine.

https://x.com/Jackiemoon_25/status/1933238001707987335

 

[NorthMike]

Ok one more post
This matter with marques not coming to orono.
All this speculating its nil, opt in, opt out, tuition paid or not, money.
Maybe its just he and Barr didnt see eye to eye about the culture and what Ben wants from players
Maybe Ben passed on him or was luke warm, thats why there are face to face meetings, right.
I wouldn't read into it much, there's lots of these deals that go on.