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Patty Kazmaier 2024

PuckLover said:
Listicles attract so much attention. This is the opinion of people that apparently includes some that post on random message boards. Lots get made about it. Probably less should. And it mostly seems like a list of very good players. But I thought it was interesting the #1 and 2 players in +/- in the nation (admittedly a flawed stat, but pretty reasonable to identify exceptional players when they are outliers to the upside) were left off. Both pass the eye test to me. And one is from the clear best team in the nation who had no players so honored. The other was from a team that had three honorees, and to my mind this one was a if not the key offensive cog to their success - more so than any of the other three. Anyway, hat tip to Curl and Barnes who would have made my list (solely based on their play - not sure if there are off ice issues that were strikes against them).
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My favorite Britta Curl stat: she is 10-0 in NCAA tournament games. Three trips to the tournament, three national championships. And with a chance to keep the streak going, and go four-for-four.

Others have won three championships, but maybe not going undefeated through their NCAA 'career'?
 
robertearle said:
Others have won three championships, but maybe not going undefeated through their NCAA 'career'?
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There are players from both UW and UM who lost in one final to prevent them going 4 for 4. I don't remember anyone other than UMD players winning their first three (although, those teams had fewer NCAA Tournament wins along the way).
 
ARM said:
There are players from both UW and UM who lost in one final to prevent them going 4 for 4. I don't remember anyone other than UMD players winning their first three (although, those teams had fewer NCAA Tournament wins along the way).
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To finish undefeated, you'd need someone who won three, and missed the tournament altogether in their 4th year. Seems pretty unlikely.
 
robertearle said:
To finish undefeated, you'd need someone who won three, and missed the tournament altogether in their 4th year. Seems pretty unlikely.
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UMD did that; it was still only a four-team tourney in 2004, and it was three ECAC teams + UM. So Tricia Guest, and maybe Satu Kiipeli.
 
Patty Kazmaier top 3 finalists announced: Izzy Daniel (senior, F, Cornell), Casey O'Brien (senior, F, Wisconsin), and Kirsten Simms (sophomore, F, Wisconsin)
2 from Wisconsin!

Very small logos of the PWHL, NHL, and NCAA are in the bottom right of the graphic on the article. In the stories about them on pattykaz.com, top-10 finalists Sarah Fillier, Gwyneth Philips, and Danielle Serdachny mentioned their interest in entering the PWHL this year.
 
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BowWowWow said:
Patty Kazmaier top 3 finalists announced: Izzy Daniel (senior, F, Cornell), Casey O'Brien (senior, F, Wisconsin), and Kirsten Simms (sophomore, F, Wisconsin)
2 from Wisconsin!
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I am very shocked by this. Before the season I'd have guess Harvey would be the one from WI, if any at all. To have 2 is shocking. It would have been fascinating had Harvey not been hurt to see how all of this would have played out.
 
bodyup88 said:
Harvey vs. Simms next year unless Abbey Murphy reduces her penalties by about 80%
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And maybe she highlights her off ice work? I'm not sure how much it plays into it, but reading through all the 10 canidates blurbs in this announcement post on pattykaz.com https://www.pattykaz.com/news_article/show/1303008 - The formula is pretty uniform: Stats, followed by Accolades, followed by Humanitarian efforts. Abby's posting is void of the Humanitarian efforts. I'm sure she's doing something, just need to make sure it's highlighted.
 
Windchill22 said:
And maybe she highlights her off ice work? I'm not sure how much it plays into it, but reading through all the 10 canidates blurbs in this announcement post on pattykaz.com https://www.pattykaz.com/news_article/show/1303008 - The formula is pretty uniform: Stats, followed by Accolades, followed by Humanitarian efforts. Abby's posting is void of the Humanitarian efforts. I'm sure she's doing something, just need to make sure it's highlighted.
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MN has a little bit of experience marketing PK candidates, I think they would have put it out there if it was there to be put out. Perhaps she just isn't into that stuff. It's ok, it's her choice. I wouldn't hold it against her.

Izzy has so many fewer points than the other 2 it's hard to think she'll win it, we shall see.
 
I think points/game is a bit more relevant, but the quality of analytics around women's hockey is so poor I'm sure there are some voters that don't get that. That's apparently even the case on this board. Daniel remains third by that measure but modestly (last column below):
1Kirsten Simmshttps://www.ncaa.com/sites/default/f.../wisconsin.svgWisconsinSo.363239711.97
2Casey O'Brienhttps://www.ncaa.com/sites/default/f.../wisconsin.svgWisconsinSr.382247691.82
3Izzy Danielhttps://www.ncaa.com/sites/default/f...gl/cornell.svgCornellSr.322035551.72


Daniel's case is more made by the fact her output was generated without being surrounded by current and future Olympians. That's not true for the Wisconsin duo. They play a tougher schedule, objectively, but also pick up charity points on plays created by teammates that Daniel doesn't benefit from. Wisconsin without Simms is still Wisconsin, Wisconsin without O'Brien is still Wisconsin. Cornell without Daniel is a middle of the pack ECAC team. All three are great players.
 
I don't know much of anything about Daniel, so I'll leave that to others.

Between Simms And O'Brien, I'm going to point to Simm's eight "game winning" goals, and O'Brien's faceoff win percentage. Simms has a knack for big goals at "big" times in games, and O'B has pretty much the best win percentage for any "main" faceoff person in the WCHA. There's a big faceoff late in the game, O'B is on the ice taking it.

If I had a vote, it's probably going to O'Brien.
 
O'Brien is 3rd on the team in +/-, and Simms is 6th. A flawed stat, but Curl's team leadership in that stat is a meaningful indicator of her contributions, in my opinion, and Harvey being 2nd in spite of her games missed... I discount Jungel's being ahead of Simms since she's ridden on Harvey's coattails, but when talking about the other two compared to Harvey - can you be the best player in college hockey if you aren't the best on your team?
 
PuckLover said:
O'Brien is 3rd on the team in +/-, and Simms is 6th. A flawed stat, but Curl's team leadership in that stat is a meaningful indicator of her contributions, in my opinion, and Harvey being 2nd in spite of her games missed... I discount Jungel's being ahead of Simms since she's ridden on Harvey's coattails, but when talking about the other two compared to Harvey - can you be the best player in college hockey if you aren't the best on your team?
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Meghan Duggan in 2011 and Brianna Decker in 2012, with Hilary Knight on the team?
 
robertearle said:
I don't know much of anything about Daniel, so I'll leave that to others.
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Regarding #12 for Cornell, she has been impressive to watch in the ~4 games I've seen her in, she's such a good playmaker and scorer (scary to watch when that's against Yale).

She has 2 goals and 2 assists in 2 games against Clarkson this year. She had 1 goal and 4 assists against Yale, though no points yet this season against Colgate.
 
robertearle said:
Hilary Knight is the best player I've seen up close and live.
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There is a significant element of luck to winning the Kazmaier. In Knight's case, you need to have a great season, and you also need to not have it be that someone else's year appears better. In 2011, Coach Johnson, Duggan, and Knight were all returning from the Olympics. Johnson had Duggan, with Decker and Brooke Ammerman on the first line most of the time. That allowed him to have a second scoring line featuring Knight. When he needed a little bit more offensive pop within a game, he'd swap Knight in for Ammerman on the top group with Duggan and Decker. The strategy was great for the Badgers, but because Knight wasn't playing with another future Kaz winner like Duggan was full time, her numbers weren't the same that season.

I'm not saying that Duggan didn't deserve the award. Earlier in her career, she had been the player taking on the less glorified role for the good of the team. And in the year that she won, her contribution to the Badgers went far beyond her offensive production. Knight was always an elite offensive talent, even back to her rookie year. For the 2011 team, Duggan was so much more. I went to St. Cloud that year to watch Wisconsin and Mercyhurst play in a showcase event that SCSU hosted. It was kind of a battle of two Meghans who were in the Kaz picture, as Agosta was in her final year with the Lakers. Duggan was everywhere. Yes, she produced offensively, but she meant so much to the team defensively, winning possession of the puck, in the transition game, on special teams, etc. Every time something good was happening for UW, Duggan was in the middle of it.

Knight could have won that year. She could have won in 2012. Had you gone strictly by a highlight package of the candidates, then she likely wins both years. But at least for 2011, I understand why Duggan won over Knight, and I don't think that the committee got it wrong. I understand that's not what you're saying, robertearle. Sometimes, the award doesn't go to the best player.
 
ARM said:
. For the 2011 team, Duggan was so much more.
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For whatever reason, I have certain mental images of some players stuck in my head, specific plays, or more general impressions. For Duggan, it is her making a diving poke check at the offensive blue line, either to hold the zone or to break up a potential break the other way. It feels like she must have done it once a game.

They just announced that she is going to be the commencement speaker at this year's graduation ceremonies.
 
robertearle said:
Badger season tickets since 2009. Decker was great, Duggan was great. Hilary Knight is the best player I've seen up close and live.
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It's totally mind blowing that Knight never won it. I understand why, but one would just assume a person of her stature in the women's game would have won it. I guess she got buried on those deep UW teams LOL.
 
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