Yeah, it's a complete mess right now. I have a feeling we won't have any idea what the rosters actually will be until sometime around August or September.
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Wisconsin Hockey 20-21 Give Us A Reason To Believe
- Thread starter Timothy A
- Start date
Yeah, it's a complete mess right now. I have a feeling we won't have any idea what the rosters actually will be until sometime around August or September.
Timothy A
Let's go RED!
To quote one of my favorite GIFs, OH FO SHO.
I would get tired of a defense that is effective mainly because of a highly effective trap scheme. But defenses can be outstanding without regard to the trap if the D men are very good in their own zone and start the transition so well. An offense may seem to be flowing well, but it starts with D men on the transition. North Dakota has been exciting in recent years, and I think the biggest part of that is the top notch D men they have had. These guys have been most valuable, IMO, because they can control the puck behind the red line and start the transition game so effectively. Having good D men also means the forwards can have a more aggressive forecheck. Just like having a shaky goaltender, if you don't trust your defense, the offense just cannot open up. The forwards are an important part of the defense, but it can be the result of a solid forecheck and taking their roles in the D zone seriously.
I know this is all obvious enough and that Badger fans don't need to be told, especially by a UND fan, but f&#k me, it's the off season.
solovsfett
Registered User
Try winning one without sound defensive hockey. Oh wait, you believe sound defense is a "pansy way to play":
Trap hockey sucks. From The NJ Devils in 95 to Mike Eaves. Wisconsin won 5 titles before Eaves with great offense and defense and didn’t have to play the boring ass trap. Sorry. What Nodak, BC, Minnesota, BU or Denver teams played trap defensive boring hockey on their way to north of 20 titles combined? oh yeah, Union and Yale didn’t play it either. So combine those titles with Wisconsin, Duluth and Michigan and your north of 40 right? Damn near every title has been won by teams who can pick em’ up and put em’ down. Fact.
so...
digitalbooya
Well-known member
Thinking that Nodak, BC, Minnesota, BU and Denver don't play some form of the trap is simply ridiculous. Hint: every team plays some form of neutral zone trap. Is every team Jacque Lemaire style? No. But every team runs some form of neutral zone trap, otherwise the neutral zone would be a fly zone and that team would suck.
Titles since 2006:
UMD ~ 3
BC ~ 3
NoDak ~ 1
BU ~ 1
Denver ~ 1
Wisconsin ~ 1
Providence ~ 1
Union ~ 1
Yale ~ 1
MSU ~ 1
Michigan ~ 0
Minnesota ~ 0
Tied for 3rd most titles in the last 15 years Mr. "The only thing that matters is the NCAA title."
You make it sound like North Dakota is winning the title every other year... When in reality the only two programs with more than one title are UMD and BC and they took many years to establish their dominance. We are just in the early stages of recovering from the worst season in badger hockey history. Literally rebuilding the program. Tell me, when was the last time BC or UMD or North Dakota or Denver had to deal with rebuilding their program from the ground up? This expectation of instant success is insanity. Remember your boy Scott Sandelin took 15 YEARS to establish his dominant program.
Timothy A
Let's go RED!
The thing is teams have to know how to defeat the trap/system they are facing. That's where the coaching comes in. UW seemed clueless on how to beat it. BSU looked very much like the UW women who defeat the attack in the N zone, then just dump it right back in or carry it in. On the dump in, the D have to turn and chase, you win the race or the 1 on 1 battle for the puck, or block the blind escape pass up the boards, then you gain possession and create havoc.
I think more importantly than winning the ncaa is just making the ncaa tourney. That means you are a way above average team who wins 2 games for every 1 you lose. We all can live with that all day I do believe. Then anything can happen, you are 2 wins from the frozen 4, 4 wins from the title. But you HAVE to get in just about every year, maybe 4 out of every 5 years.
I think more importantly than winning the ncaa is just making the ncaa tourney. That means you are a way above average team who wins 2 games for every 1 you lose. We all can live with that all day I do believe. Then anything can happen, you are 2 wins from the frozen 4, 4 wins from the title. But you HAVE to get in just about every year, maybe 4 out of every 5 years.
WiscTJK
Well-known member
Let's take a vote now. Review this article and let me know if you think Granato will shift to a more defensive style:
https://madison.com/wsj/sports/coll...cle_fed7f97f-3f7e-51c6-a929-0c8ceec62544.html
I will say no, based on previous years, but I hope to be completely wrong. I would love to see a more physical, defensive style.
https://madison.com/wsj/sports/coll...cle_fed7f97f-3f7e-51c6-a929-0c8ceec62544.html
I will say no, based on previous years, but I hope to be completely wrong. I would love to see a more physical, defensive style.
ExileOnDaytonStreet
Drunkard
Well he at least needs to shift to a more <responsible> style. This “who cares if you leave an unmarked man on your goalie’s back door and it’s Lebedeff’s fault if they take advantage of it” nonsense needs to end.
I can’t recall if it was a Milewski article or tweet, but something he wrote gave me the idea that Edmonton was going to wait out some results on how bad the wrist is and decide on “entry-level for this year” vs “AHL ATO followed by entry-level for next year”.
I think.
Meanwhile were getting a grad transfer from BGSU: Max Johnson. Over 100 points in four years there. Don’t know much else.
I can’t recall if it was a Milewski article or tweet, but something he wrote gave me the idea that Edmonton was going to wait out some results on how bad the wrist is and decide on “entry-level for this year” vs “AHL ATO followed by entry-level for next year”.
I think.
Meanwhile were getting a grad transfer from BGSU: Max Johnson. Over 100 points in four years there. Don’t know much else.
ExileOnDaytonStreet
Drunkard
LordofBrewtown
Registered User
Was that the #1 vs #2 matchup when they handed out posters (or was that a different year)? If so, that's probably the loudest/best atmosphere I ever experienced at the Kohl center. Was awesome
Timothy A
Let's go RED!
“Next year we might have to be a team that’s going to grind it out, be more patient, score more goals on the forecheck, be a grittier team, be a dirtier team around the net, things like that,” he said. “We’re going to have to adjust to what’s needed to help us be successful.”
If he's saying it, then he is setting the table to having to follow thru. I think if you watched the OSU series where they dressed 8 F's, that was the future. Stange was great that series and Matty D can be a special playmaker in the line of Linus but more physical.
I guess I vote yes.
Timothy A
Let's go RED!
Points by year:
Fr 13-17-30
So 19-24-43
Jr 6-19-25
Sr 10-14-24
Kinda trending in the wrong direction but he brings a lot of experience to the table from the hard playing wcha. From Lakeville MN. If he could crack 30 pts that would be sweet.
Timothy A
Let's go RED!
Not sure Watts to think of that. Doesn't think Rowe can be the guy? Garrity is strictly a practice guy? Wants to be able to yank Rowe and have someone else to go to? No confidence vote on Grannon? I was really hoping to ride Rowe for 3 years and have some consistency in the net. If the teams plays a better defensive game TG won't have to to so yank happy though he should be benching skaters who screw up and leave the goalies alone.
ExileOnDaytonStreet
Drunkard
I am baffled by this Moe business.
Does Granato really have that little faith in Rowe/Grannan? Is this really where we need to be putting scholarships when we have probably 5 of our top 6 forwards gone next year?
Does Granato really have that little faith in Rowe/Grannan? Is this really where we need to be putting scholarships when we have probably 5 of our top 6 forwards gone next year?
WiscTJK
Well-known member
Me as well. Are they going to carry 4 goalies? Rowe, Grannan (NLI), Garrity and Moe?
How they working 4 goalies into scholarship money? Maybe Rowe is starter, Moe is 2nd and Garrity is 3rd and push Grannan back a year?
A couple of random thoughts....
I wonder if Grannan comes to UW next year. He has a .874 save percentage in the USHL with Sioux Falls which is actually better than his save percentage with the USNTDP the past two seasons. None of those teams are/were very good though.
Granato may now understand you need older players to win, but you cannot change your team overnight. He is finally bringing in players with some junior experience who are more physically mature and no longer bringing in players directly from high school who are not ready to play like Gorniak and R. Donovan. That should make a difference. The guys being added seem more likely to be good four year players than early departures other than Ceulemans this year. Also an interesting move adding Max Johnson and Jared Moe.
Players moving up a line or two suddenly have different roles and more playing time. Their stats in some sense are not only a reflection of their abilities but their roles and playing time so if given more opportunities in different roles I think there are some guys on the roster who can “up” their points.
Ceulemans will definitely bring an offensive presence from the blue line the team did not have this season, and it sounds like Laatsch is good on the power play.
I wonder if Grannan comes to UW next year. He has a .874 save percentage in the USHL with Sioux Falls which is actually better than his save percentage with the USNTDP the past two seasons. None of those teams are/were very good though.
Granato may now understand you need older players to win, but you cannot change your team overnight. He is finally bringing in players with some junior experience who are more physically mature and no longer bringing in players directly from high school who are not ready to play like Gorniak and R. Donovan. That should make a difference. The guys being added seem more likely to be good four year players than early departures other than Ceulemans this year. Also an interesting move adding Max Johnson and Jared Moe.
Players moving up a line or two suddenly have different roles and more playing time. Their stats in some sense are not only a reflection of their abilities but their roles and playing time so if given more opportunities in different roles I think there are some guys on the roster who can “up” their points.
Ceulemans will definitely bring an offensive presence from the blue line the team did not have this season, and it sounds like Laatsch is good on the power play.
solovsfett
Registered User
Let’s be honest here. I said 30 years, not an arbitrary 2006 start date. In any given 15 year span a team can get hot and win it all. Consistently winning titles over time is the goal. Not one and done.
we must define trap differently because I have yet to see a team from Denver, Nodak, Duluth, Minnesota that can’t straight up fly up and down the ice. In fact, it was getting embarrassed by a team that can really skate that led to Mike eaves little meltdown in grand forks (along with Leavitt’s chirping).
and I don’t care about worst year in program history. For Christ sake, how many coaches has Nodak had since the 70’s? And I think every coach from the 80’s forward has one at least one title. Maybe burd can chime in on that.
so, no excuses here. No way.
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