No I mean he wasn't in bench for game. Anyone know where he was? Yes I met him once. He seems a but strange
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Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
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No I mean he wasn't in bench for game. Anyone know where he was? Yes I met him once. He seems a but strange
Kdaddy1968
New member
Re: Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
After watching the UND game I am more convinced UVM would have fared much better out in that bracket. There is a huge difference between the top 3 and the rest of the league. Or in UVM's case Union and Wisc....
After watching the UND game I am more convinced UVM would have fared much better out in that bracket. There is a huge difference between the top 3 and the rest of the league. Or in UVM's case Union and Wisc....
HOCKEYGUY23
New member
Apparently Patrick was on the bench for the game. Didn't get to watch only listen. Probably hiding because we lost and he is supposed to be in charge of PP. Good job Patrick hope you get a new job somewhere else.
Get a clue! Patrick is in charge of PK which was pretty **** good. Wallack was PP. Patrick and Wallack are recruiting animals. Only here can people complain about a team that won 6 games two years ago and brought in these 2 guys and improved a ton each year.
That's brilliant, yeah let's hope Patrick leaves because our last 2 assistants were awesome. That's why the cupboard was so full!
Jayden_Stoff
Member
Re: Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
UVM will have to recruit better to be able to play with teams like Union and the tops teams in Hockey East. I'm a loyal fan but time for some honesty. A number of our D weren't fast enough to keep up with Unions forwards. Providence was but Union has great play making in addition to their speed. Also, a couple of our D were making really poor decisions with the puck. Every time they were on the ice I was nervous. So in terms of reciting D, I expect we need 4 coming in next year that can raise the game.
Sneddon will trade him in for a new guy next year. It will be interesting to see who else he goes after for greener pastures. I'm sorry but that entire game was a defensive disaster which I put right on the coach. We did not look prepared to play. I don't accept the moral victory and let Sneddon and the dos Equis look alike guy off the hook. Other than mccarthy and Paliotta I thought we had no game plan. Trust me folks it's gonna be a long year next year.
UVM will have to recruit better to be able to play with teams like Union and the tops teams in Hockey East. I'm a loyal fan but time for some honesty. A number of our D weren't fast enough to keep up with Unions forwards. Providence was but Union has great play making in addition to their speed. Also, a couple of our D were making really poor decisions with the puck. Every time they were on the ice I was nervous. So in terms of reciting D, I expect we need 4 coming in next year that can raise the game.
jcarter7669
Registered User
Re: Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
I think Mario has benefitted greatly from McCarthy, but he definitely is a keeper. The team needs finishers as well and both Mario and Reynolds are those guys. They aren't going to dig a lot of pucks out of the corners, but they know how to find the back of the net. The question for me is who steps up to be the guy digging for the puck and setting these guys up next year. I think Bradley, Fallon and Shaw all have that tenacity. I expect to see Fallon centering Mario and possibly Reynolds, although I think having Reynolds will give the team two lines that can score.
And I am optimistic that Mario will develop some in that regard as he progresses... he is a frosh with what 4 months of D-1 Hockey under his belt... He has some work to do yet, but he is just starting his college career.
As for Sneddon, I'm not sure he is going to bring this team to consistently being a top10 team, but I think he will continue to keep this team where we "Expect" it to be a top 10 team. So my take is... he isn't Jerry York, but he is better then the other choices...
Maybe in another few years we can get St. Louis to come be coach once he retires, until then I think Sneddon is it.
What's the players consensus on Sneddon? Is he a keeper? Probably the best recruiting class in a while (does he get the credit or do his assistants?).. He has never done much for me...
I think Mario has benefitted greatly from McCarthy, but he definitely is a keeper. The team needs finishers as well and both Mario and Reynolds are those guys. They aren't going to dig a lot of pucks out of the corners, but they know how to find the back of the net. The question for me is who steps up to be the guy digging for the puck and setting these guys up next year. I think Bradley, Fallon and Shaw all have that tenacity. I expect to see Fallon centering Mario and possibly Reynolds, although I think having Reynolds will give the team two lines that can score.
And I am optimistic that Mario will develop some in that regard as he progresses... he is a frosh with what 4 months of D-1 Hockey under his belt... He has some work to do yet, but he is just starting his college career.
As for Sneddon, I'm not sure he is going to bring this team to consistently being a top10 team, but I think he will continue to keep this team where we "Expect" it to be a top 10 team. So my take is... he isn't Jerry York, but he is better then the other choices...
Maybe in another few years we can get St. Louis to come be coach once he retires, until then I think Sneddon is it.
jcarter7669
Registered User
Re: Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
Privitera, will help with the D. Hamilton will be fine, another frosh that needs some work to be a little more defensive minded. Hopefully Paliotta will stay. The thing with D is it's rare to find a guy that is big and strong, offensive minded but still good defensively. Look at our guys... You have Hamilton and Bruneteau who are both very offensive minded and that can cost the team, but they are making that up in part with their offensive play. Pattyn, Walls, Luukko all are defensive guys, that while they may not make as many mistakes defensively they contribute nearly nothing offensively. Nor are they going to win a foot race with a speedy forward. Find a speedy guy and he isn't going to be strong enough to work guys off the puck... There are the occassional rare gems out there like Gostbrehere but they are rare.
A number of our D weren't fast enough to keep up with Unions forwards. Also, a couple of our D were making really poor decisions with the puck. Every time they were on the ice I was nervous. So in terms of reciting D, I expect we need 4 coming in next year that can raise the game.
Privitera, will help with the D. Hamilton will be fine, another frosh that needs some work to be a little more defensive minded. Hopefully Paliotta will stay. The thing with D is it's rare to find a guy that is big and strong, offensive minded but still good defensively. Look at our guys... You have Hamilton and Bruneteau who are both very offensive minded and that can cost the team, but they are making that up in part with their offensive play. Pattyn, Walls, Luukko all are defensive guys, that while they may not make as many mistakes defensively they contribute nearly nothing offensively. Nor are they going to win a foot race with a speedy forward. Find a speedy guy and he isn't going to be strong enough to work guys off the puck... There are the occassional rare gems out there like Gostbrehere but they are rare.
Kdaddy1968
New member
Re: Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
How much can these guys improve? I know the argument that they only have 1 year of D1 under their belt but half these guys are 20/21 as Freshman. Back in my day everyone was 18. Ian Boyce was 17 when he got to campus. St Louis 18, LeClair 18, Ducolon 18, etc..
With everyone coming in at 20, 21 is there that much room to improve? (Mario 21, Hamilton 20, etc)
How much can these guys improve? I know the argument that they only have 1 year of D1 under their belt but half these guys are 20/21 as Freshman. Back in my day everyone was 18. Ian Boyce was 17 when he got to campus. St Louis 18, LeClair 18, Ducolon 18, etc..
With everyone coming in at 20, 21 is there that much room to improve? (Mario 21, Hamilton 20, etc)
jcarter7669
Registered User
Re: Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
Age has nothing to do with the ability to be coached. These guys get access to a weight training program, they get coached at a different level, they are getting (or were last year) motivational instruction, for some it's the first time they've seen dedicated coaches... Hoffman was a 22 year old freshman that had never had a goalie coach before coming to UVM. Having a full season of experience and access to a goalie coach has resulted in his GAA going from 2.86 to 2.11 and his save% going from .904 to .925. That improvement isn't because he turned 23... but because he is part of a D-1 program where he can get the coaching he needs.
How much can these guys improve? I know the argument that they only have 1 year of D1 under their belt but half these guys are 20/21 as Freshman. Back in my day everyone was 18. Ian Boyce was 17 when he got to campus. St Louis 18, LeClair 18, Ducolon 18, etc..
With everyone coming in at 20, 21 is there that much room to improve? (Mario 21, Hamilton 20, etc)
Age has nothing to do with the ability to be coached. These guys get access to a weight training program, they get coached at a different level, they are getting (or were last year) motivational instruction, for some it's the first time they've seen dedicated coaches... Hoffman was a 22 year old freshman that had never had a goalie coach before coming to UVM. Having a full season of experience and access to a goalie coach has resulted in his GAA going from 2.86 to 2.11 and his save% going from .904 to .925. That improvement isn't because he turned 23... but because he is part of a D-1 program where he can get the coaching he needs.
Kdaddy1968
New member
Re: Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
So then why not come in at 18? If they aren't getting coaching where they play now then what is the point?
Age has nothing to do with the ability to be coached. These guys get access to a weight training program, they get coached at a different level, they are getting (or were last year) motivational instruction, for some it's the first time they've seen dedicated coaches... Hoffman was a 22 year old freshman that had never had a goalie coach before coming to UVM. Having a full season of experience and access to a goalie coach has resulted in his GAA going from 2.86 to 2.11 and his save% going from .904 to .925. That improvement isn't because he turned 23... but because he is part of a D-1 program where he can get the coaching he needs.
So then why not come in at 18? If they aren't getting coaching where they play now then what is the point?
Re: Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
If you look at average ages of the Canadian freshman they are all 19-20. It appears as tho they are either not being recruited until later or are not being brought in until their junior teams allow them to. Just a thought. Also I agree with jcarter that there needs to be balance in the forward and defence. Not every team in Div 1 has just one style of player, you need speed and skill but you also need size and strength. Not even in the NHL do you get a lot of players with both. But my point before was that you coaches ,ie head or asst. to bring every player up to the next level. Every player on every team wants more than anything to play pro at some point and that is a coaches job to prepare them not hold them back while only giving that opportunity to their favourites. Every player brings something to the table and should be utilized.
If you look at average ages of the Canadian freshman they are all 19-20. It appears as tho they are either not being recruited until later or are not being brought in until their junior teams allow them to. Just a thought. Also I agree with jcarter that there needs to be balance in the forward and defence. Not every team in Div 1 has just one style of player, you need speed and skill but you also need size and strength. Not even in the NHL do you get a lot of players with both. But my point before was that you coaches ,ie head or asst. to bring every player up to the next level. Every player on every team wants more than anything to play pro at some point and that is a coaches job to prepare them not hold them back while only giving that opportunity to their favourites. Every player brings something to the table and should be utilized.
So then why not come in at 18? If they aren't getting coaching where they play now then what is the point?
jcarter7669
Registered User
Re: Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
Because they aren't ready... they weren't identified because they were playing in a league that is not scouted much... any number of reasons. Take Puskarich for example, he played in the USHL when he was young and didn't produce much... he was 16-17 years old playing against much bigger, older, stronger guys. He then went to the NAHL and played... After a season of that he went to the BCHL, and he was recruited by UVM. so he comes in at 20-21
Santaguida is 21... hockeydb has no record before he was 19... when he played for the ojhl? The following year he moved to the BCHL and was recurited by Vermont.
Shaw is 21, played two seasons in the BCHL... meaning he was recruited as soon as he started playing that year. So these kids are going to the BCHL at 18, being recruited and coming in at 20-21. Consider that most programs are not bringing in kids immediately but lining them up for a year or two down the road. To bring in an 18 year old, you need to sign him up at 16 and that's a gamble coaches are trying to get away from.
Hoffman being an example of leagues... he played as an 18,19,20 y.o. in the SJHL. As a 21 y.o. he moved to the AJHL, a league VT recruits... he was brought in the following year... as a 22 y.o.
Another thing, kids start school later now, most of them are 18-19 when they actually graduate High School. A lot of them are still filling out, so why not let them fill out for a year in the USHL or some other top league so that for the 4 years you have them they aren't waiting on a growth spurt.
So then why not come in at 18? If they aren't getting coaching where they play now then what is the point?
Because they aren't ready... they weren't identified because they were playing in a league that is not scouted much... any number of reasons. Take Puskarich for example, he played in the USHL when he was young and didn't produce much... he was 16-17 years old playing against much bigger, older, stronger guys. He then went to the NAHL and played... After a season of that he went to the BCHL, and he was recruited by UVM. so he comes in at 20-21
Santaguida is 21... hockeydb has no record before he was 19... when he played for the ojhl? The following year he moved to the BCHL and was recurited by Vermont.
Shaw is 21, played two seasons in the BCHL... meaning he was recruited as soon as he started playing that year. So these kids are going to the BCHL at 18, being recruited and coming in at 20-21. Consider that most programs are not bringing in kids immediately but lining them up for a year or two down the road. To bring in an 18 year old, you need to sign him up at 16 and that's a gamble coaches are trying to get away from.
Hoffman being an example of leagues... he played as an 18,19,20 y.o. in the SJHL. As a 21 y.o. he moved to the AJHL, a league VT recruits... he was brought in the following year... as a 22 y.o.
Another thing, kids start school later now, most of them are 18-19 when they actually graduate High School. A lot of them are still filling out, so why not let them fill out for a year in the USHL or some other top league so that for the 4 years you have them they aren't waiting on a growth spurt.
Jayden_Stoff
Member
Re: Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
I'm keeping an eye on the 'early departures'. Nothing on Paliotta yet. Obviously it'd be great for the team if he stays but he seemed to take his game up a notch this year. I'll be pleasantly surprised if he's back next year.
What's the usual time between end of season and signed? I noticed a Quinnipiac player already departed.
I'm keeping an eye on the 'early departures'. Nothing on Paliotta yet. Obviously it'd be great for the team if he stays but he seemed to take his game up a notch this year. I'll be pleasantly surprised if he's back next year.
What's the usual time between end of season and signed? I noticed a Quinnipiac player already departed.
Kdaddy1968
New member
Re: Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
I think you have to take some chances and get a few early to balance out the team, there is risk but there is reward as well. Those teams that had the 18 year olds did ok esp with the Quebec players. Maybe give Ducharme a call...
Because they aren't ready... they weren't identified because they were playing in a league that is not scouted much... any number of reasons. Take Puskarich for example, he played in the USHL when he was young and didn't produce much... he was 16-17 years old playing against much bigger, older, stronger guys. He then went to the NAHL and played... After a season of that he went to the BCHL, and he was recruited by UVM. so he comes in at 20-21
Santaguida is 21... hockeydb has no record before he was 19... when he played for the ojhl? The following year he moved to the BCHL and was recurited by Vermont.
Shaw is 21, played two seasons in the BCHL... meaning he was recruited as soon as he started playing that year. So these kids are going to the BCHL at 18, being recruited and coming in at 20-21. Consider that most programs are not bringing in kids immediately but lining them up for a year or two down the road. To bring in an 18 year old, you need to sign him up at 16 and that's a gamble coaches are trying to get away from.
Hoffman being an example of leagues... he played as an 18,19,20 y.o. in the SJHL. As a 21 y.o. he moved to the AJHL, a league VT recruits... he was brought in the following year... as a 22 y.o.
Another thing, kids start school later now, most of them are 18-19 when they actually graduate High School. A lot of them are still filling out, so why not let them fill out for a year in the USHL or some other top league so that for the 4 years you have them they aren't waiting on a growth spurt.
I think you have to take some chances and get a few early to balance out the team, there is risk but there is reward as well. Those teams that had the 18 year olds did ok esp with the Quebec players. Maybe give Ducharme a call...
jcarter7669
Registered User
Re: Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
There aren't any 18 y.o. anymore... they are at least 19, schools don't take kids until they are a year older now. Demko was pretty much the lone exception this year...
And UVM has recruited some young players and almost exclusively have gotten burned on them. I don't care if UVM is recruiting kids at 18, giving them a year or two to develop. It's the smart thing to do and what everyone does. Look no further then McCarthy, why did he come to UVM... because Jerry York wanted him to season a second year and he didn't want to. You have to line kids up for scholarships and needs, the days of recruiting seniors in HS to matriculate directly to college in the fall are long gone. Doesn't happen anymore... because age doesn't matter, but player maturity does from a physical and emotional standpoint. Would you really want to waste a scholarship on a kid that hasn't even finished growing and filling out? In a year he is filled out but now you have him for 3 years instead of 4. Isn't it better to wait a year, bring him in and then start working with him?
For whatever reason UVM has moved away from the Quebec area. I'm guessing but my bet is that the best players, the ones you would want to take a chance on are all going to QMJHL ... Are geography has forced us in a sense ... the MA kids go somewhere in Boston... the MN kids play out west... the Quebec kids go play in the QMJHL if they are any good.
I think you have to take some chances and get a few early to balance out the team, there is risk but there is reward as well. Those teams that had the 18 year olds did ok esp with the Quebec players. Maybe give Ducharme a call...
There aren't any 18 y.o. anymore... they are at least 19, schools don't take kids until they are a year older now. Demko was pretty much the lone exception this year...
And UVM has recruited some young players and almost exclusively have gotten burned on them. I don't care if UVM is recruiting kids at 18, giving them a year or two to develop. It's the smart thing to do and what everyone does. Look no further then McCarthy, why did he come to UVM... because Jerry York wanted him to season a second year and he didn't want to. You have to line kids up for scholarships and needs, the days of recruiting seniors in HS to matriculate directly to college in the fall are long gone. Doesn't happen anymore... because age doesn't matter, but player maturity does from a physical and emotional standpoint. Would you really want to waste a scholarship on a kid that hasn't even finished growing and filling out? In a year he is filled out but now you have him for 3 years instead of 4. Isn't it better to wait a year, bring him in and then start working with him?
For whatever reason UVM has moved away from the Quebec area. I'm guessing but my bet is that the best players, the ones you would want to take a chance on are all going to QMJHL ... Are geography has forced us in a sense ... the MA kids go somewhere in Boston... the MN kids play out west... the Quebec kids go play in the QMJHL if they are any good.
Kdaddy1968
New member
Re: Vermont 2013-2014 Season Thread : The Golden Year
I am still going to go back to Quebec. There are bound to be one or two you can line up at 17/18. There was too much history for UVM up there. Boyce, Perrin, St Louis , Ducharme.
I am no saying fill the whole team but 1 or 2 a year from Quebec should be doable even with the issues around that area (and I know there are some big issues that hurt UVM in particular.
And what is the point of waiting for a kid to fill out if you aren't coaching him? (per your comment on Hoffman not having any coaching). I would prefer to have a pipeline of kids some of whom come in at 18 and stay with the program. Better to coach at 18 or 20?
There aren't any 18 y.o. anymore... they are at least 19, schools don't take kids until they are a year older now. Demko was pretty much the lone exception this year...
And UVM has recruited some young players and almost exclusively have gotten burned on them. I don't care if UVM is recruiting kids at 18, giving them a year or two to develop. It's the smart thing to do and what everyone does. Look no further then McCarthy, why did he come to UVM... because Jerry York wanted him to season a second year and he didn't want to. You have to line kids up for scholarships and needs, the days of recruiting seniors in HS to matriculate directly to college in the fall are long gone. Doesn't happen anymore... because age doesn't matter, but player maturity does from a physical and emotional standpoint. Would you really want to waste a scholarship on a kid that hasn't even finished growing and filling out? In a year he is filled out but now you have him for 3 years instead of 4. Isn't it better to wait a year, bring him in and then start working with him?
For whatever reason UVM has moved away from the Quebec area. I'm guessing but my bet is that the best players, the ones you would want to take a chance on are all going to QMJHL ... Are geography has forced us in a sense ... the MA kids go somewhere in Boston... the MN kids play out west... the Quebec kids go play in the QMJHL if they are any good.
I am still going to go back to Quebec. There are bound to be one or two you can line up at 17/18. There was too much history for UVM up there. Boyce, Perrin, St Louis , Ducharme.
I am no saying fill the whole team but 1 or 2 a year from Quebec should be doable even with the issues around that area (and I know there are some big issues that hurt UVM in particular.
And what is the point of waiting for a kid to fill out if you aren't coaching him? (per your comment on Hoffman not having any coaching). I would prefer to have a pipeline of kids some of whom come in at 18 and stay with the program. Better to coach at 18 or 20?
Coach Patrick was instrumental in getting the Privitera brothers to commit. His USHL connections are valuable.
There is a reason they were available to Uvm. I agree the pk was way better this year. But a lot of that is defensive maturity from the defenseman.
Apparently Patrick was on the bench for the game. Didn't get to watch only listen. Probably hiding because we lost and he is supposed to be in charge of PP. Good job Patrick hope you get a new job somewhere else.
Oh. I didn't see him at all. But I wasn't watching that close either.
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