UNH Men’s Hockey 22-23: the start of something new, or more of the same?

[HockeyRef]

Sometimes "everyone" can refer to people you might not even think of.

Before the Harvard game Souza was talking about keeping the player's moods upbeat in the locker room and he used Bill Belichick's "ignore the noise" maxim. Then he mentioned how he has to tell his own daughters the same thing. Not to listen to or read the stuff that is said about the program. I know there is sort of a rule on this board not to criticize the players, which is fine. At the same time, they chose to play here and most took scholarship money to do so.

But the coach's daughters had no say in who their parents are, or what they do to earn a living. They didn't sign on for this.

Just thought it was worth mentioning, given some of the bloodlust for the head coach's head.

To be honest.... Kind of meant players and those closest to the program. I would never bring family into any of this. Ever. Unfortunately? If one is going to step into the limelight those are the downsides and can be devastating. Sad that it 'comes with the territory' and if you read today's UL article about how the team is coping with it very hopeful they are focusing on what they are doing right. The team wants to win...here's a quote from Ryan Black (whom I think has done a great job and glad he's here):

“I just think it’s a long year and it’s a learning curve for all of us as a team,” said Black, who previously played at Division III Babson College, “and, hopefully, we can keep working, keep pounding the stone and turn it around. And then this will be experience for down the stretch — we get in those one-goal, two-goal games and we have a 2-0 lead. We know what we’ve done to let that slip and just need to make sure that we don’t let that happen again.”

Losing sucks, there's no way around it..and really think if they can put it all together on Sat v HC it will be a very good thing for them going forward. Not saying they are suddenly going to win the HE but, think they will find some traction perhaps. Like I said, turn the corner UNH.

You are so right tho...its hard on the family to hear things that are less than complimentary....thanks for this important food for thought.

Point taken.

PS Chuck to your points, I think this has been a huge 'wake up' call for Souza. He has had to find his own way, cut the coatstrings so to speak if he hasn't already. What he followed in his 'learning years while HC in waiting' I think he might just realize wasn't working then, and it sure isn't working now. Here's hoping, and, I do feel badly for him I know many of us, despite our trepidations about how it all went down, really do want to see him succeed...

 

[Darius]

'Ref, you say honesty, and while I don't disagree, I read a sense of desperation into this uncharacteristically frank quote. It's hard not to feel for the guy, and I don't doubt that getting this job was the culmination of a lot of hard work on the road chasing second-tier prospects for what were at least then two second-tier (and with Brown, arguably third-tier) programs, in hopes of finally landing where he's landed. I'm just not sure he ever made the mental adjustment to committing to sell his alma mater as the same first-tier program he played for a generation ago, and one that was still within reach of the first tier when he got started on his return to Durham. And once things started to go sideways on him a couple of years in, I'm not sure he was frank enough in his self-assessment to be able to effectuate the necessary changes in time to avoid the crash he's encountering right now. Maybe in being the beneficiary of Coach Umile's largesse, he underestimated the demands of the position, and what it would take to undo the damage his mentor caused over the last few years of his time in charge?

Maybe I'm reading way too much into a blisteringly frank quote muttered in a moment of intense frustration? But it seems like a quote from a guy who now has his eyes wide open, understands that it's gotten away from him, and will "double down" on working hard, which is admirable. What he also hopefully realizes is the need to work smarter, and with a more clear understanding of his role at the top of the program. If he can do that, even if he never gets a chance to right the ship here in Durham, it should set him up with a more clear understanding of what it takes to be successful in the next job in charge somewhere else, at this level or (more likely) below.

In the big picture, it's a cautionary tale to alums who dream the big dream of coming back home to coach after a successful playing career, it's no guarantee that you succeed like a Parker or York, or even a Umile or Bazin or Madigan. Truth be told, there are way more Souzas or Armys or O'Connells (or even Cedorchucks), who got that "chance of a lifetime" but didn't measure up. Not every fairy tale has a happy ending, sadly ...

I thought more the second than the first and perhaps the result of a frank discussion with AD Rich. Or... maybe the understanding that he had support from AD Scarano due to his tight relationship with Coach Umile and that support has to be earned with AD Rich?

 

[Felger]

I know it was unrealistic and never possible but Ryan Black should be the captain of this team

 

[Darius]

To be honest.... Kind of meant players and those closest to the program. I would never bring family into any of this. Ever. Unfortunately? If one is going to step into the limelight those are the unfortunate things that happen.
You are so right tho...its hard on the family to hear things that are less than complimentary....thanks for this important food for thought.

Point taken.

'Ref, I think we all know where you are coming from. Your intentions are 100% respectful and from your good heart.

It is a reminder to all though that the team, staff, their families are people, all with the best intentions for the program. I know Coach's family used to attend games. If they still do, they don't need to hear "Fire Mike Souza" shouted from the stands. I believe both his daughters play hockey. Let's hope they have a positive impression of UNH. Maybe they'll be recruited to play for the women's team in a few years.

 

[Felger]

To be honest.... Kind of meant players and those closest to the program. I would never bring family into any of this. Ever. Unfortunately? If one is going to step into the limelight those are the downsides and can be devastating. Sad that it 'comes with the territory'

Oh believe me, I know you weren't in anyway referring to anyone other than coaches and players. Honestly, I had never thought of it until I heard the interview with Souza the other night. It just got me to thinking about unintended conequences. Although a handful of times I have looked at the bench and seen a head coach who seems to wear his stress on his sleeve....

 

[HockeyRef]

I know it was unrealistic and never possible but Ryan Black should be the captain of this team

This! We met his mom and dad at Clarkson and they could not be more excited and pleased he's playing for UNH...and he's in the mix all night. Time for HR to go see some D3 hockey at the alma mater, PSC (lol will always be PSC). Like I reported last year, I was taken by surprise to see Peter Laviolette's son out there...and they play some fun, fast paced hockey. In fact, going to look at the schedule now...

Good luck Soccer 'Cats, Women's Volleyball. An hour to the NCAA D1 Field Hockey Championship with HR fully expecting North Carolina to win after losing to Northwestern last season...who defeated Dan's Red Hawks in the qtrs if I have that right. For anyone who cares (lol) NC has appeared in 21 NCAA finals. And, I could kick myself, just realized the game is at Storrs CT which, if I had my act together, I would have gotten up to go see...ugh! Worth the 3 hr drive...ha! Speaking of Storrs, when our 'Cats play UConn we will be playing there at their new arena. Kind of bummed; loved going to the XL esp for that barbeque. From what I heard tho, it's 30 mins closer so maybe will make the trip?

 

[deltabravo62]

'Ref, I think we all know where you are coming from. Your intentions are 100% respectful and from your good heart.

It is a reminder to all though that the team, staff, their families are people, all with the best intentions for the program. I know Coach's family used to attend games. If they still do, they don't need to hear "Fire Mike Souza" shouted from the stands. I believe both his daughters play hockey. Let's hope they have a positive impression of UNH. Maybe they'll be recruited to play for the women's team in a few years.

I am fine with acknowledging that there are real people involved. But at some point the results have to speak for themselves, to the point that I and many others ask “what results?” I’m sorry, but if Mike Souza has the best intentions for the future of this program at heart, it’s time to realize he is doing long term damage bumbling along like this. Call me cold, call me a terrible fan, call me whatever you will. At this point he is taking this program down with him. He is not going to turn this program around, period. I hope he finds his way as a coach in some other form but the Great Umile Exit Plan (tm) is a failure.

 

[Chuck Murray]

I know it was unrealistic and never possible but Ryan Black should be the captain of this team

I'll admit, this thought occurred to me as well recently. With the perspective of a kid who played a full D-3 career in a winning scenario, yet who never gave up the D-1 dream, and took advantage of the shifting landscape of college hockey to make that a reality ... and then not just being there to make up the numbers, as they say ... I strongly suspect we will not have heard the last of this kid once the season is over. I'd think his story would be a compelling one to tell (and sell) as a future recruiter. And while in the big picture, the strategy of relying on kids from Babson (or UAH) to be impact players in a successful D-1 program is not likely to be a successful one, it's important not to diminish the accomplishment of those players, and to credit Black's prior AND current coaches in facilitating the opportunity for a deserving kid to contribute at the next level.

Sometimes the best coaches come from among the folks who didn't play or coach in the limelight, but had a clear vision of what they wanted to do to be successful, and a strength of character and communication to turn vision into reality by creating a motivating collective sense of purpose that others could readily adopt and believe in.

RB may have other plans/priorities, but I for one wouldn't be surprised if he catalogs his diverse college hockey experience into a leadership role in the future in the sport, possibly even in the college game. Hard not to root for the kid ...

 

[HockeyRef]

I'll admit, this thought occurred to me as well recently. With the perspective of a kid who played a full D-3 career in a winning scenario, yet who never gave up the D-1 dream, and took advantage of the shifting landscape of college hockey to make that a reality ... and then not just being there to make up the numbers, as they say ... I strongly suspect we will not have heard the last of this kid once the season is over. I'd think his story would be a compelling one to tell (and sell) as a future recruiter. And while in the big picture, the strategy of relying on kids from Babson (or UAH) to be impact players in a successful D-1 program is not likely to be a successful one, it's important not to diminish the accomplishment of those players, and to credit Black's prior AND current coaches in facilitating the opportunity for a deserving kid to contribute at the next level.

Sometimes the best coaches come from among the folks who didn't play or coach in the limelight, but had a clear vision of what they wanted to do to be successful, and a strength of character and communication to turn vision into reality by creating a motivating collective sense of purpose that others could readily adopt and believe in.

RB may have other plans/priorities, but I for one wouldn't be surprised if he catalogs his diverse college hockey experience into a leadership role in the future in the sport, possibly even in the college game. Hard not to root for the kid ...

And, to add onto this, I was rewatching our last W over Army...he scores the exact same goal he had against UMass Friday...no doubt the kids got game! I remember when we first saw him on the roster there was some doubt a D3 player could make it but he has definitely shown his doubters wrong...Seemed very level headed in the interview as well...

Ps...and in the spirit of Snively and his quizzes...which 2 former UNH field hockey players played in the Olympics with one of them winning a bronze medal...one of which coached at York High School as well and just happened to be the keynote speaker at the championship banquet at our school in 1996. The other player played on the 1985 Women's NCAA D1 Lax Championship team and coached the 'Cats as well. (I do not expect any answers...lol)

And FWIW dept current long time UNH field hockey coach Robin Balducci also played for this team (goalie) and I have to brag...she was a fhockey coach for a brief stint at Franklin High School and yours truly split with her both game 2-1. Ah those were the freaking days I still have the game ball...Interestingly she brought that team along and, they won back to back state championships after she left...so coaching...matters!

 

[Chuck Murray]

I am fine with acknowledging that there are real people involved. But at some point the results have to speak for themselves, to the point that I and many others ask “what results?” I'm sorry, but if Mike Souza has the best intentions for the future of this program at heart, it's time to realize he is doing long term damage bumbling along like this. Call me cold, call me a terrible fan, call me whatever you will. At this point he is taking this program down with him. He is not going to turn this program around, period. I hope he finds his way as a coach in some other form but the Great Umile Exit Plan (tm) is a failure.

This is an entirely reasonable and objective take on the situation. I think the "real people" thing was meant to extend to folks who aren't in the situation by their own choice. Admins, coaches AND IMO even the players are fair game.

 

[Darius]

This is an entirely reasonable and objective take on the situation. I think the "real people" thing was meant to extend to folks who aren't in the situation by their own choice. Admins, coaches AND IMO even the players are fair game.

Precisely. It’s on them if Coach and his family chose to read this board. His family might even expect to overhear reasonable criticism of the team when attending games. Coach and his wife know the deal, might even be using the situation as a life learning moment for the kids. Anything personal that they can’t avoid crosses the line. Yeah, reports of the “Fire Mike Souza” yell troubled me.

 

[deltabravo62]

Precisely. It’s on them if Coach and his family chose to read this board. His family might even expect to overhear reasonable criticism of the team when attending games. Coach and his wife know the deal, might even be using the situation as a life learning moment for the kids. Anything personal that they can’t avoid crosses the line. Yeah, reports of the “Fire Mike Souza” yell troubled me.

Not trying to snark here, honest question. Would you rather have vocal opposition of the current head coach or an empty building because the fans just threw their hands up and walked away? I understand there is a level of poor form in chanting for your head coach to be fired but patience in this process is wearing thin.

To me, vocal opposition says "we still care about this team, we just don't support you". While the other option says "we give up on this whole thing"

 

[Felger]

reports of the “Fire Mike Souza” yell troubled me.

The other thing is you have to wonder how that might impact the current players on the team? I mean it can't help the chemistry/mood in the locker room. Could have guys saying to themselves "gee, did I cost this guy his job?" (Even if that isn't the case.)

Look, people feel the way they do. I'm not going to tell them how to feel. If they're mad, they're mad. That's their right. I just think you can take things too far. Others may disagree.

 

[Darius]

Not trying to snark here, honest question. Would you rather have vocal opposition of the current head coach or an empty building because the fans just threw their hands up and walked away? I understand there is a level of poor form in chanting for your head coach to be fired but patience in this process is wearing thin.

To me, vocal opposition says "we still care about this team, we just don't support you". While the other option says "we give up on this whole thing"

Either is embarrassing. Of the two choices, honest answer, I’d rather have vocal opposition.

 

[HockeyRef]

I think (and I can be guilty of this) that we often forget that these players, even though they are in a D1 hockey program, receive scholarships, are still student athletes, not NHL players. They want and deserve respect and support from their fans. I'm not thrilled about how its going any more than the rest and while I agree a coaching change is in order if things do not improve (and fast) it has to hurt to hear their coach called out with 'Fire Souza' as they skate off the ice trying to process their most recent shortcomings. I'm not going to games for the coach; never have, never will....I get it that the 'fire souza' is not directed at them and hope they know that.

You've got a point there Felger that I had not considered when you mention they could internalize this as their fault...again, good food for thought. Remember they came here because they believed in the coach and what UNH could potentially offer them in more than just on the ice. Giving them the thought that they made the wrong choice...etc...would be unfortunate, but I also think they could sort that piece? That said, you can't control the environment, and, like it or not, to use an overused phrase, 'it comes with the territory'.

And...after all of that said, I'd hate to see a completely empty 'Whitt...that would be awful if every games attendance was like this past Tuesdays...

Ps...great D1 fh game UNC completes the undefeated season, while the 'cardiac 'Cats (where have we heard this) Northwestern made it interesting tying the game with under 2 mins to go...2022 field hockey season is officially over!

 

[Darius]

The other thing is you have to wonder how that might impact the current players on the team? I mean it can't help the chemistry/mood in the locker room. Could have guys saying to themselves "gee, did I cost this guy his job?" (Even if that isn't the case.)

Look, people feel the way they do. I'm not going to tell them how to feel. If they're mad, they're mad. That's their right. I just think you can take things too far. Others may disagree.

Good point. Unlike professional teams that sometimes find “us in the locker room against the world” motivation, the players are part of “the world”. Especially with the yell coming from the student section.

 

[Chuck Murray]

The other thing is you have to wonder how that might impact the current players on the team? I mean it can't help the chemistry/mood in the locker room. Could have guys saying to themselves "gee, did I cost this guy his job?" (Even if that isn't the case.)

Look, people feel the way they do. I'm not going to tell them how to feel. If they're mad, they're mad. That's their right. I just think you can take things too far. Others may disagree.

If you accept that the college years are supposed to be the threshold to adulthood for these players, then what better real-life experience can you gain than to live through the consequences of p!$$ poor management? I've seen a few managers come and go in my career, for a whole host of varying reasons (including incompetence), and it's part of the big-boy/big-girl world. If you're a human, of course there should be some level of introspection. Personally, regardless of scenario, I've always started any post-mortem with a long hard look in the mirror.

If you see the college experience otherwise, those folks can toddle off to their safe spaces and take up yoga ...

 

[HockeyRef]

Good point. Unlike professional teams that sometimes find “us in the locker room against the world” motivation, the players are part of “the world”. Especially with the yell coming from the student section.

Friday night's yell came from fans sitting to my right, not the student section, just to give clarification FWIW dept. No idea if it was a student, or 'adult'. The students behind us were shocked and one said "that is so mean". Again, can't control the environment...

Ps Chuck, have always hated yoga...

 

[deltabravo62]

My assertion is that we are very close to the tipping point of the attendance taking a huge nose dive. This is not something that a road win against Holy Cross is going to fix either. Given that a good number of people who go to home games likely don't pay a lot of attention to what happens outside of the Whitt. I would personally imagine that seeing attendance split in half would be a bigger morale crusher than hearing a handful of fans calling for your coaches job. If it gets to the point that you can hear the calls ringing through the arena then maybe there is something to be said there. The ones this week were a small number of people that I doubt anyone on the bench heard.

 

[Darius]

Friday night's yell came from fans sitting to my right, not the student section, just to give clarification FWIW dept. No idea if it was a student, or 'adult'. The students behind us were shocked and one said "that is so mean". Again, can't control the environment...

Ps Chuck, have always hated yoga...

Thanks. That makes it better. Sort of.

We should all practice yoga. Breathe.