UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

[Darius]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

Excellent post...

+1

 

[Darius]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

I never suspected you and I could be on the same page Chuck, but you are spot on. We are indeed becoming a nation of sheep.

All is well in non-sheep land until one of their sheep family falls ill. Then they 180 faster than Dick Cheney decided to support same sex marriage.

 

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

I am normally with you. Not this time. This is a math problem. We don't have the medical bandwidth necessary based on the exponential growth seen in China and Italy. Italy has more doctors and hospital beds per person than we do and they are now making decisions who gets the ventilator and maybe lives vs who just dies because they are out...

However as the math plays out our medical services have a chance if we can just slow this down a little. With a virus like this that does mean "social distancing". Merkel is probably correct by the time this is over 70% of us will probably have it, a smaller percent will have it enough to be tested, a smaller percent still will fill our hospitals beyond capacity and some will spend 10-12 days on a ventilator and maybe still die.

Unless you think it is better to cull the herd of the old and unfortunate that get a bad case... I wouldn't want to make the choice between two people asphyxiating who gets the chance to live and who dies... Would you?

My reaction here isn't emotional, it is a math problem, plus the sobering unfortunate experience working fatal car accidents.

See, I don't see this as a "math problem", JB. Too often, I think we use math (and by extension. probabilities) to justify what we do, and all I'm seeing here so far is a lot of folks speculating about worst-case scenarios that haven't come to pass, and most are saying likely won't come to pass. But we still see folks seemingly having the need to scare the bejeezus out of everyone to make whatever point they're trying to make. So I say it's a behavioral problem, using probability as a crutch. And if behavior is always going to be panic-stricken when confronted by something unusual, then we are in for some tough sledding in the future.

You've raised the issue of fatal car accidents (something I also deal with in my profession) - let's "work the math" with that. Over the last few years, the average number of US traffic fatalities has been in the mid-30,000's. That's an average of roughly 100 per day, every day, for years now. Do we decide that driving is too dangerous, and ban driving? Of course not. People have lives to live, things to do, etc. It's a weighted risk. And most people, with free will, accept that risk every day, everywhere. Life is risky.

To date, using the most updated CDC data I've been able to find, there have been 41 COVID-19 deaths in the US. I think most have been in Washington State, and in that state, a huge chunk of their deaths apparently arise from a single (1) nursing home, obviously with a high concentration of known heightened risk factors for the disease. World-wide, there are now at least 5,080 deaths, which includes hot-spots like China, Iran and Italy - and admittedly could be underreported to a degree. Fine. But the number no one wants to talk about is that 70,437 have already officially been deemed "recovered", and the alarmists admit the vast majority of folks who have been diagnosed but not recovered (yet) will recover. And life will eventually go on.

As a matter of personal disclosure, I'm at an age which is on the precipice of being an increased risk factor, although I'm lucky enough not to have any of the conditions that would lead to a heightened risk. So I'm definitely paying attention, but I'm not changing the way I live my life - except when people start prohibiting and restricting what I can do. That's annoying. I don't have any symptoms - and if I did, I would responsibly stay home and deal with it. But I don't. Yet my life now feels like I do.

There are a lot of people I know who are frustrated by this nanny-state mentality we are slipping into deeper and deeper as the years pass. But they're afraid to say boo. I'm tired of being one of them. "Give me liberty or give me death", I say. 'Cuz right now my "liberty" is not feeling very free nor lively.

I'd prefer to live my life now, thanks; I'll take a "hard pass" on multiple dress rehearsals for death.

JMHO.

 

[Darius]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

See, I don't see this as a "math problem", JB. Too often, I think we use math (and by extension. probabilities) to justify what we do, and all I'm seeing here so far is a lot of folks speculating about worst-case scenarios that haven't come to pass, and most are saying likely won't come to pass. But we still see folks seemingly having the need to scare the bejeezus out of everyone to make whatever point they're trying to make. So I say it's a behavioral problem, using probability as a crutch. And if behavior is always going to be panic-stricken when confronted by something unusual, then we are in for some tough sledding in the future.

Yeah, math. So inaccurate. One man's caution is another man's panic.

You've raised the issue of fatal car accidents (something I also deal with in my profession) - let's "work the math" with that. Over the last few years, the average number of US traffic fatalities has been in the mid-30,000's. That's an average of roughly 100 per day, every day, for years now. Do we decide that driving is too dangerous, and ban driving? Of course not. People have lives to live, things to do, etc. It's a weighted risk. And most people, with free will, accept that risk every day, everywhere. Life is risky.

Seat belts, air bags, collision avoidance systems. All for wussies. if we were a real democracy there would be disable options for all of these anti-liberty features.

To date, using the most updated CDC data I've been able to find, there have been 41 COVID-19 deaths in the US. I think most have been in Washington State, and in that state, a huge chunk of their deaths apparently arise from a single (1) nursing home, obviously with a high concentration of known heightened risk factors for the disease. World-wide, there are now at least 5,080 deaths, which includes hot-spots like China, Iran and Italy - and admittedly could be underreported to a degree. Fine. But the number no one wants to talk about is that 70,437 have already officially been deemed "recovered", and the alarmists admit the vast majority of folks who have been diagnosed but not recovered (yet) will recover. And life will eventually go on.

Bold one: key point.
Bold two: don't want any more of these.
Bold three: do want more of these OR have a lower number because fewer are exposed.

As a matter of personal disclosure, I'm at an age which is on the precipice of being an increased risk factor, although I'm lucky enough not to have any of the conditions that would lead to a heightened risk. So I'm definitely paying attention, but I'm not changing the way I live my life - except when people start prohibiting and restricting what I can do. That's annoying. I don't have any symptoms - and if I did, I would responsibly stay home and deal with it. But I don't. Yet my life now feels like I do.

Me too. I am enjoying a personal choice WFH day today because 2/3 of our company is just back from a conference in Vegas and I have a boss who understands cautious reality.

There are a lot of people I know who are frustrated by this nanny-state mentality we are slipping into deeper and deeper as the years pass. But they're afraid to say boo. I'm tired of being one of them. "Give me liberty or give me death", I say. 'Cuz right now my "liberty" is not feeling very free nor lively.

Be careful what you ask for, we'd miss you.

I'd prefer to live my life now, thanks; I'll take a "hard pass" on multiple dress rehearsals for death.

There are no dress rehearsals. It just happens.

 

[After the Whistle]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

See, I don't see this as a "math problem", JB. Too often, I think we use math (and by extension. probabilities) to justify what we do, and all I'm seeing here so far is a lot of folks speculating about worst-case scenarios that haven't come to pass, and most are saying likely won't come to pass. But we still see folks seemingly having the need to scare the bejeezus out of everyone to make whatever point they're trying to make. So I say it's a behavioral problem, using probability as a crutch. And if behavior is always going to be panic-stricken when confronted by something unusual, then we are in for some tough sledding in the future.

Chuck you and others are correct in identifying the media as typically over playing any issue that will garner more reader/viewership, but math is very much the critical variable here. The problem is it isn't simple addition, it is multiplication. It simple terms for anyone who works, as in any industry from education to manufacturing, it is about capacity. In this case the capacity to respond. How real and significant will not be fully known and understand for a while but anyone with any sense should see that this can very easily overcome our current medical capacity on lots of different fronts. And the absence of a better ability to respond is a national embarrassment! The wealthiest country on earth and we lag behind in so many critical health care categories. Yeah we need an army and law enforcement but we need much better universal health care to rise to a priority just as we need infrastructure etc. We can all have different opinions on lots of things but come on .....

 

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

Darius, I suppose we all have different tolerances for risk. Using the motor vehicle fatality issue, I think that speaks for itself. Yes, even with all the improvements to safety, 100 people die every day in the US behind the wheel. We're now confronting the safety issue of "self-driving" cars, which supposedly will result in other changes. Maybe the idea of letting your car drive itself appeals to you? It doesn't appeal to me. The idea that my ability to drive my car myself could be taken away, because some pointy-headed safety advocate in Washington DC deems it in the global best interests of "safety" to only allow self-driving cars tp be sold, that's disturbing. Maybe you disagree? Regardless, it may not be imminent, but it's not difficult to see that issue coming before 2030.

Personally, I'm not into survival mode if that quality of life is going to be some mundane zombie-like existence. There seem to be a lot of folks who are chasing this Utopian nirvana where everything is "safe", and there are no risks to be taken, and we all sing Kumbaya 24/7/365 infinity … until an 8.0 earthquake, or some asteroid from space crashes into our planet and ends it all quickly.

I consider myself lucky, I've lived a fantastic life - fantastic to my standards, maybe unimpressive by others, but who cares - and I hope to live a few/lot more years. I'm an optimist, and I always think good things are out there, yet to come. But if it all ended today, from whatever, I'd have no regrets, other than missing out on more time here with folks I care about. And based on what I see and hear, my optimism about what's to come is more and more tempered, each and every day. Regular panics are not what I'm looking forward to, but based on how this is playing out, I can't help but think this is going to become the "new normal". And that's incredibly sad, to me anyway. JMHO.

 

[d.gerry]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

So does the current suspension of the NHL season increase the odds of Gildon's return?

 

[chickod]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

Darius, I suppose we all have different tolerances for risk. Using the motor vehicle fatality issue, I think that speaks for itself. Yes, even with all the improvements to safety, 100 people die every day in the US behind the wheel. We're now confronting the safety issue of "self-driving" cars, which supposedly will result in other changes. Maybe the idea of letting your car drive itself appeals to you? It doesn't appeal to me. The idea that my ability to drive my car myself could be taken away, because some pointy-headed safety advocate in Washington DC deems it in the global best interests of "safety" to only allow self-driving cars tp be sold, that's disturbing. Maybe you disagree? Regardless, it may not be imminent, but it's not difficult to see that issue coming before 2030.

Personally, I'm not into survival mode if that quality of life is going to be some mundane zombie-like existence. There seem to be a lot of folks who are chasing this Utopian nirvana where everything is "safe", and there are no risks to be taken, and we all sing Kumbaya 24/7/365 infinity … until an 8.0 earthquake, or some asteroid from space crashes into our planet and ends it all quickly.

I consider myself lucky, I've lived a fantastic life - fantastic to my standards, maybe unimpressive by others, but who cares - and I hope to live a few/lot more years. I'm an optimist, and I always think good things are out there, yet to come. But if it all ended today, from whatever, I'd have no regrets, other than missing out on more time here with folks I care about. And based on what I see and hear, my optimism about what's to come is more and more tempered, each and every day. Regular panics are not what I'm looking forward to, but based on how this is playing out, I can't help but think this is going to become the "new normal". And that's incredibly sad, to me anyway. JMHO.

I couldn't have expressed it any better. Do we really want "life" where everything is guaranteed and there is never any adversity to overcome or accomplishments to achieve? IMO that's called "automation" and that's where we're headed...until there is no need for humans anyway, since that would be redundant. Then, after a few thousand years, the machines will also become bored and will attempt to create sentient life once again, and then the cycle will begin anew.

 

[e.cat]

Darius, I suppose we all have different tolerances for risk. Using the motor vehicle fatality issue, I think that speaks for itself. Yes, even with all the improvements to safety, 100 people die every day in the US behind the wheel. We're now confronting the safety issue of "self-driving" cars, which supposedly will result in other changes. Maybe the idea of letting your car drive itself appeals to you? It doesn't appeal to me. The idea that my ability to drive my car myself could be taken away, because some pointy-headed safety advocate in Washington DC deems it in the global best interests of "safety" to only allow self-driving cars tp be sold, that's disturbing. Maybe you disagree? Regardless, it may not be imminent, but it's not difficult to see that issue coming before 2030.

Personally, I'm not into survival mode if that quality of life is going to be some mundane zombie-like existence. There seem to be a lot of folks who are chasing this Utopian nirvana where everything is "safe", and there are no risks to be taken, and we all sing Kumbaya 24/7/365 infinity … until an 8.0 earthquake, or some asteroid from space crashes into our planet and ends it all quickly.

I consider myself lucky, I've lived a fantastic life - fantastic to my standards, maybe unimpressive by others, but who cares - and I hope to live a few/lot more years. I'm an optimist, and I always think good things are out there, yet to come. But if it all ended today, from whatever, I'd have no regrets, other than missing out on more time here with folks I care about. And based on what I see and hear, my optimism about what's to come is more and more tempered, each and every day. Regular panics are not what I'm looking forward to, but based on how this is playing out, I can't help but think this is going to become the "new normal". And that's incredibly sad, to me anyway. JMHO.

Well said Chuck.

 

[e.cat]

So does the current suspension of the NHL season increase the odds of Gildon's return?

I was wondering the same thing!

 

[Darius]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

Darius, I suppose we all have different tolerances for risk. Using the motor vehicle fatality issue, I think that speaks for itself. Yes, even with all the improvements to safety, 100 people die every day in the US behind the wheel. We're now confronting the safety issue of "self-driving" cars, which supposedly will result in other changes. Maybe the idea of letting your car drive itself appeals to you? It doesn't appeal to me. The idea that my ability to drive my car myself could be taken away, because some pointy-headed safety advocate in Washington DC deems it in the global best interests of "safety" to only allow self-driving cars tp be sold, that's disturbing. Maybe you disagree? Regardless, it may not be imminent, but it's not difficult to see that issue coming before 2030.

Personally, I'm not into survival mode if that quality of life is going to be some mundane zombie-like existence. There seem to be a lot of folks who are chasing this Utopian nirvana where everything is "safe", and there are no risks to be taken, and we all sing Kumbaya 24/7/365 infinity … until an 8.0 earthquake, or some asteroid from space crashes into our planet and ends it all quickly.

I consider myself lucky, I've lived a fantastic life - fantastic to my standards, maybe unimpressive by others, but who cares - and I hope to live a few/lot more years. I'm an optimist, and I always think good things are out there, yet to come. But if it all ended today, from whatever, I'd have no regrets, other than missing out on more time here with folks I care about. And based on what I see and hear, my optimism about what's to come is more and more tempered, each and every day. Regular panics are not what I'm looking forward to, but based on how this is playing out, I can't help but think this is going to become the "new normal". And that's incredibly sad, to me anyway. JMHO.

Not at all.

Agreed, but I am into finding the sweet spot between mundane zombie-like existence and health.

Another new normal is on the horizon. I don't like it anymore than the post 911 changes. I would do away with the airport TSA lines in a heartbeat, but am willing to arrive at the airport much earlier than pre-911 for the good of society just like I am willing to alter my life for my personal health benefit and the greater good health of others. Personal liberty does not have to come at the expense of others.

 

[NCAA watcher]

For such individualists you guys sure do ***** and moan about what others are doing.
Nobody is making you do anything yet. It’s not even a speed limit where you can at least complain that those government probabilities guys won’t let you drive 200 mph or drive drunk just because you’re ok with the risks.

 

[Greg Ambrose]

If there is no tournament then does the streak continue next year if we make the tournament? Paranoia wreaking havoc on all these tournaments. Feel bad for the seniors who can’t finish the season. Think the NCAA offers another year?

Paranoia? How about being prudent? I suggest you start listening to the medical professionals instead of the quacks on Twitter.

I will also point out to all of you faux libertarians that from the day you were born there have governmental restrictions on your life. I’m going to presume that whoever delivered you was a medical professional of some sort, licensed and certified by the state confirming that they know what they are doing. Then a few short years later you start school. Whether it was public, private or home, what you were taught was overseen by by local and state authorities. And when you finally graduated into the world, you were required to pass some sort of curriculum mandated by the state. Off to college you go, facing more or less the same state mandates expectations you faced as a kid. Then the real world. I have no idea what any of you do for work but anyone working as a barber all the way up to a surgeon is required to be certified. What you eat, the air you breathe, the car you drive all have to meet standards of health and safety. If your desire is to go back to the days of every man (and it was men only) for himself, be my guest. But you’ll get sick eating food, breathing the contaminated air from the toxic waste dump next door or probably get hurt in accident because of manufactured defects in the car you drive. I’m not saying you folks fall under this umbrella, but it drives me to distraction how so many base their political, economic and social philosophy on a second rate piece of fiction.

 

[e.cat]

Not at all.

Agreed, but I am into finding the sweet spot between mundane zombie-like existence and health.

Another new normal is on the horizon. I don't like it anymore than the post 911 changes. I would do away with the airport TSA lines in a heartbeat, but am willing to arrive at the airport much earlier than pre-911 for the good of society just like I am willing to alter my life for my personal health benefit and the greater good health of others. Personal liberty does not have to come at the expense of others.

I'm not sure Chuck said anything about his "personal liberty" trumping others well being.

BTW I like TSA lines. I feel much safer boarding a plane when they do the checks. Yeah some of it is annoying. My wife got randomly pulled out of the line at Shannon airport in Ireland when we were coming back home and had to unzip her pants and they looked. That was a tad over the top.

 

[Dan]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

Chuck,

Your posts in this thread are among the most selfish statements I have ever read. You are not the victim of COVID-19. You are not the victim of the cancellation of college and professional sports as a result of national and global response to COVID-19. You lament partisan, perpetually offended culture of society today and you continue to be the most partisan and most offended person on any number of topics you bring to this board. The world does not revolve around you and your fellow citizens are not required to react to issues they face in a manner that pleases you...

People have died from this virus (5,080 is not a number I sneeze at when the alternative is my personal entertainment) and more certainly will - many will become infected and many are at risk. The number of future deaths/at risk patiencts would have undoubtedly risen exponentially had common sense steps not (finally) been taken to slow the spread of this virus across the country. All you've expressed in your posts is that it might not effect you personally and as a result you don't care. Why don't you just throw out a number as to how many lives are worth your ability to watch/attend sporting events in your golden years? How many lives have to be prevented by shutting down large events around the country to make it worthwhile for all of us to have inconvenienced you so greatly?

These are largely preventable deaths - if the right steps are taken - so if you're going to casual toss around numbers in the 5,000s as an inconvenience than you should probably take a long look in the mirror. Its not up to everyone else to accept the same level of risk that you are willing to accept. And it is not your right to put them at risk because you are not concerned. Unlike the people making this decision, you have zero responsibility at stake. Its easy for you condescend to all of us - as well as the people who actually have to combat this virus and make difficult decisions they don't want to make - from your couch. And that is certainly the only way you can make yourself the center of a global situation...

Setting the more important health risks aside, lets touch on the issue of cancelled collegiate activities so important to this board. As you know I work in college athletics - what I have worked so hard for is now out the window. My student-athletes have lost seasons of competition. I have seen colleagues and their student-athletes lose their seasons on the eve of potential championship competition. As hard as it is for all of them, I have yet to see any handle this situation without maturity, class and empathy for those who are dealing with much worse...

In your first post, not only do you fail to recognize the sacrifice made by the athletes actually competing in the sports you demand you are allowed to watch as one of your 'liberties'. In your subsequent post you denigrate their sacrifice, express disdain for them and mock their ability to accept these decisions with grace as 'soft' behavior. You could learn a lot from them in how they've handled one of the most difficult situations of their young lives...

Your attempts to misdirect the conversation into risks of everyday life are laughable. Analogies to the flu or automotive deaths are entirely transparent. Yes, people die from both and do so every day. Using that as a rationalization to argue against making common sense efforts to minimize risk and prevent preventable deaths in other ways is disgusting, especially when considering how much effort has been put into lowering death tolls related to the flu and to driving, giving us the numbers we have now. Your making straw-men arguments are designed to win a debate, politically instigate and convince yourself its okay to be so careless, nothing more...

If you don't want people to play the victim, than stop playing the victim. No one is forcing you to drive an automated car and no one is attacking your rights and liberties by putting sports on hold.

If you don't like people playing the partisan sheep, than stop being so **** partisan. Perhaps drastic decisions could have been avoided if the COVID-19 virus was respected a serious concern from the start and we weren't subjected to partisan rants about how it was entirely a hoax, that things were fine and that it was all a deep-state creation to kill the market and bruise the president's ego. If we had handled it like adults, maybe you'd still be able to watch 20 year old kids work their asses off so that they could adequately skate around for your god-given, inalienable right to be entertained...

We've gotten to a point where these decisions have had to be made. One Utah Jazz player infected with COVID-19 means the entire league is infected if they keep playing (and who knows how many staff, fans, etc). The same is true for any collegiate athlete/sport, which means the likely and substantial spread through the rest of the citizenry as a result and eventually to people with significant risk. And I know you'd never request that after fulfilling their duty of entertaining you they be quarantined/isolated from the rest of the population, putting their lives on hold - you know, civil liberties and all...

These decisions are the only ones that could be made, for your benefit even if you deny it. In many ways the government exists to protect people like you from themselves (as well as everyone you might take down with you while you exercise your 'freedoms') - but assuming you know more than those schooled, trained and paid to do so, tell me, what is the worst thing that happens if you're right? You're inconvenienced for a couple of weeks/months? Now think about what is the worst thing that could happen if you're wrong...

You revel in this 'panic' because it gives you another opportunity to come to these boards and tell us how smart, tough minded and righteous you are. If you didn't, you'd stop watching the news that is gearing all its platforms towards telling you people are panicking. It is not panic to make decisions in the best interest of other people. It is not panic to take steps to prevent the preventable.

Five thousand deaths (and who knows how many more) might be a measly and easily dismissable number for you, but its easy for me to recognize my current good fortune in this situation. Despite the end of my season, and the pain of my student-athletes, I have no serious connection to the virus at this time (family, athletes, friends). Out of empathy, it is my experience, that the vast majority of those actually sacrificing their athletic seasons (after months and years of hard work) are disappointed, but willing to do whatever is deemed necessary to minimize the risk towards those seriously affected moving forward. And no one gives a rat's *** about your ability to watch on TV or eat popcorn in the stands, or your personal opinion on the viability of them sacrificing their season...

 

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

For such individualists you guys sure do ***** and moan about what others are doing.
Nobody is making you do anything yet. It’s not even a speed limit where you can at least complain that those government probabilities guys won’t let you drive 200 mph or drive drunk just because you’re ok with the risks.

'Watcher, I beg to disagree. Every time someone shuts down something, things that are part of everyday life, that is altering my everyday existence, and the choices I get to make. I'm not some stark raving libertarian, mind you, and I'm certainly not saying that anyone is advocating for Talladega Motor Speedway driving on normal roads. Maybe you are just more comfortable letting folks dictate the terms of your life? Most of the time, we all seem to manage to do OK despite our differences.

But this time around, we're literally seeing a few people catch a cold, and the rest of us are getting thrown into isolation, even when we don't have any symptoms. No one - not one person -- under the age of 50 has died from this in the US, yet we're now closing schools. This all just flows from the same folks who now cancel school when there's an inch or two of snow on the ground, or a layer of ice on the roads. Whether it's attributable to an extremely overcautious groupthink mindset, OR because those folks worry incessantly about the next ambulance chaser coming down the pike with a personal injury lawsuit, I dunno. Maybe both??

Regardless, now too many regular folks are delving further and further into panic-driven actions, like buying out grocery stores, and creating shortages of some staples. And every time someone - whether it's our President or folks on this forum - try to talk sense and urge folks not to delve into panic, it comes back in the other direction in waves of "you are a <fill-in-the-blank>-ist".

Almost twenty (20) years ago, we literally were under coordinated attack from a foreign enemy on our home soil, and thousands of people were killed in the blink of an eye. There was some panic - what else might be coming next? - and it was warranted, even if the follow-up attacks never came to fruition. We (US) recovered and rebounded quickly, and that served as a shining example of what this country still can be … if we let it be.

But now we're only hearing the downside, sometimes from the usual suspects, and "caution"-driven fear and panic rules over any effort to inject a sense of balance into the reality of the situation.

I'm sorry to repeat this, but I will. As a people, we've all just become so, so collectively soft.

 

[theprofromdover]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

Chuck,

Your posts in this thread are among the most selfish statements I have ever read. You are not the victim of COVID-19. You are not the victim of the cancellation of college and professional sports as a result of national and global response to COVID-19. You lament partisan, perpetually offended culture of society today and you continue to be the most partisan and most offended person on any number of topics you bring to this board. The world does not revolve around you and your fellow citizens are not required to react to issues they face in a manner that pleases you...

People have died from this virus (5,080 is not a number I sneeze at when the alternative is my personal entertainment) and more certainly will - many will become infected and many are at risk. The number of future deaths/at risk patiencts would have undoubtedly risen exponentially had common sense steps not (finally) been taken to slow the spread of this virus across the country. All you've expressed in your posts is that it might not effect you personally and as a result you don't care. Why don't you just throw out a number as to how many lives are worth your ability to watch/attend sporting events in your golden years? How many lives have to be prevented by shutting down large events around the country to make it worthwhile for all of us to have inconvenienced you so greatly?

These are largely preventable deaths - if the right steps are taken - so if you're going to casual toss around numbers in the 5,000s as an inconvenience than you should probably take a long look in the mirror. Its not up to everyone else to accept the same level of risk that you are willing to accept. And it is not your right to put them at risk because you are not concerned. Unlike the people making this decision, you have zero responsibility at stake. Its easy for you condescend to all of us - as well as the people who actually have to combat this virus and make difficult decisions they don't want to make - from your couch. And that is certainly the only way you can make yourself the center of a global situation...

Setting the more important health risks aside, lets touch on the issue of cancelled collegiate activities so important to this board. As you know I work in college athletics - what I have worked so hard for is now out the window. My student-athletes have lost seasons of competition. I have seen colleagues and their student-athletes lose their seasons on the eve of potential championship competition. As hard as it is for all of them, I have yet to see any handle this situation without maturity, class and empathy for those who are dealing with much worse...

In your first post, not only do you fail to recognize the sacrifice made by the athletes actually competing in the sports you demand you are allowed to watch as one of your 'liberties'. In your subsequent post you denigrate their sacrifice, express disdain for them and mock their ability to accept these decisions with grace as 'soft' behavior. You could learn a lot from them in how they've handled one of the most difficult situations of their young lives...

Your attempts to misdirect the conversation into risks of everyday life are laughable. Analogies to the flu or automotive deaths are entirely transparent. Yes, people die from both and do so every day. Using that as a rationalization to argue against making common sense efforts to minimize risk and prevent preventable deaths in other ways is disgusting, especially when considering how much effort has been put into lowering death tolls related to the flu and to driving, giving us the numbers we have now. Your making straw-men arguments are designed to win a debate, politically instigate and convince yourself its okay to be so careless, nothing more...

If you don't want people to play the victim, than stop playing the victim. No one is forcing you to drive an automated car and no one is attacking your rights and liberties by putting sports on hold.

If you don't like people playing the partisan sheep, than stop being so **** partisan. Perhaps drastic decisions could have been avoided if the COVID-19 virus was respected a serious concern from the start and we weren't subjected to partisan rants about how it was entirely a hoax, that things were fine and that it was all a deep-state creation to kill the market and bruise the president's ego. If we had handled it like adults, maybe you'd still be able to watch 20 year old kids work their asses off so that they could adequately skate around for your god-given, inalienable right to be entertained...

We've gotten to a point where these decisions have had to be made. One Utah Jazz player infected with COVID-19 means the entire league is infected if they keep playing (and who knows how many staff, fans, etc). The same is true for any collegiate athlete/sport, which means the likely and substantial spread through the rest of the citizenry as a result and eventually to people with significant risk. And I know you'd never request that after fulfilling their duty of entertaining you they be quarantined/isolated from the rest of the population, putting their lives on hold - you know, civil liberties and all...

These decisions are the only ones that could be made, for your benefit even if you deny it. In many ways the government exists to protect people like you from themselves - but assuming you know more than those schooled, trained and paid to do so, tell me, what is the worst thing that happens if you're right? You're inconvenienced for a couple of weeks/months? Now think about what is the worst thing that could happen if you're wrong...

You revel in this 'panic' because it gives you another opportunity to come to these boards and tell us how smart, tough minded and righteous you are. If you didn't, you'd stop watching the news that is gearing all its platforms towards telling you people are panicking. It is not panic to make decisions in the best interest of other people. It is not panic to take steps to prevent the preventable.

Five thousand deaths (and who knows how many more) might be a measly and easily dismissable number for you, but its easy for me to recognize my current good fortune in this situation. Despite the end of my season, and the pain of my student-athletes, I have no serious connection to the virus at this time (family, athletes, friends). Out of empathy, it is my experience, that the vast majority of those actually sacrificing their athletic seasons (after months and years of hard work) are disappointed, but willing to do whatever is deemed necessary to minimize the risk towards those seriously affected moving forward. And no one gives a rat's *** about your ability to watch on TV or eat popcorn in the stands, or your personal opinion on the viability of them sacrificing their season...

Chuck is a pedantic bore with slightly better language skills that Trump.

 

[chickod]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

Chuck is a pedantic bore with slightly better language skills that Trump.

Of course, you're just a genius who is smarter than everyone else and continually feels the need to reinforce that point, while doing the exact thing that you condemn him for.

 

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

Dan, I don't have the time or the patience to respond line-by-line to your so-predictable screed. You're not the only coach whose season is now being impacted (me too). I'm not playing the victim card, and it's hilarious to see you trying to argue that.

You're entitled to your opinion, as are Darius and 'Watcher and Greg and e.cat and everyone else.

My opinion is, we as a people are collectively soft. 40 folks - in our country - have died so far. Maybe I'm wrong, and maybe in the end there will be hundreds of thousands of victims. I don't think so, with all due respect. The victims are a lot closer in age to me than they are to yours, and the youngest US victim is still over 50 years old. I say this is an overreaction. You can disagree.

Truth is, you were raised in a different generation, and your "normal" is different to mine, as mine is different from my dad's, and his was from my grandfather (who BTW survived chemical warfare in the trenches during WW1). Clue - as life has gotten easier, the threshold for what constitutes a "crisis" for the current generation has fallen, and fallen steadily. I guess that's a good thing, and I'm not advocating for a return to the bygone days of the Model T and the Spanish Flu. But we are badly in need of some perspective here, and I don't see where the groupthink is going to allow that to happen anytime soon.

If I'm wrong, I'll admit it. If you're wrong, rather than curl up in a ball and make believe the discussion never happened, I hope you'll be kind enough to admit you panicked, and learned from it?

 

[Dan]

Re: UNH Hockey: Where Do We Go From Here....

Dan, I don't have the time or the patience to respond line-by-line to your so-predictable screed. You're not the only coach whose season is now being impacted (me too). I'm not playing the victim card, and it's hilarious to see you trying to argue that.

You're not fooling anyone but yourself. But that is your right...

You're the softest, partisan among us. Kudos for already laying the ground work for your victory lap. If 100,000+ don't die you were right and any response was meaningless? I could just as easily argue that 4 million would have died if we'd let you attend the Frozen Four and now we've saved all those lives. Lol...

I have nothing to apologize for because I'm not panicking. I haven't seen any panic (we certainly shop at different grocery stores). I see intelligent (read educated in this field) people making proactive decisions to prevent the serious spread of a virus that could effect the most vulnerable among us at minimal invasion to the rest of us. And yes, I'm able to do that even though I might brush it off rather easily as a 30-something in excellent health.

I also see you playing partisan and breathlessly espousing over and over that your liberty is at stake, while making sure to hammer home the point, that anyone who succumbs to this disease is simply not your problem. The reality is you have been at worst, minorly inconvenienced - you just wanted something to complain about.

You are the easily offended, soft, perpetual whiner you despise.