UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

[NCAA watcher]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

you are correct and I am embarrassed about my incorrect description (I would beg that being part of EU might get me partial credit)

 

[C-H-C]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

http://board.uscho.com/showthread.php?99859-UNH-Recruits-2012-2018&p=6250378&viewfull=1#post6250378



Providence is so stacked that it just deferred the BCHL's 4th leading scorer (Kawaguchi) (http://wcfcourier.com/sports/hockey...cle_0871127f-056a-564f-b8d4-57e0ec660b97.html) and top USHL defenseman, UNH alum Jake Ryczek. (We discussed UNH and Kawaguchi here last year, an ironic discussion given the past 12 months (*) They just got a late commitment from top Euro to play immediately, have BCHL's top scorer (Conway), and a late Ivy de-commit (Duhaime). As others have pointed out, Borek is good at getting volume, and right now is also getting skill. It will be interesed to see if Borek's love of deferrals of kids who really are ready to come to college ends up bouncing back at Borek, like it did with Vecchione and Laleggia. One thing in his favor is that PC is walking away from its ealy commit mistakes, which UNH did not do, and which really hamstung UNH in the past couple of years as the early mistakes were more common.


* http://board.uscho.com/showthread.p...-Beyond-2015&p=6166017&viewfull=1#post6166017

I watched Kawaguchi play online a number of times in the Chilliwack vs West Kelowna (with Liam Blackburn) BCHL playoff series. He is 19 years old, undersized, fast, and crafty (Micflikier-like). He's played three full seasons with Chilliwack, was their Captain this season, and looked to me like their second best forward next to Sukumaran (another PC commit). A good case could be made that he's ready to play Division I hockey next season. Although the Heisenberg spread sheet is not always up to date regarding which players have signed a National Letter of Intent, it indicates that Kawaguchi has not yet signed an NLI with Providence.

 

[Greg Ambrose]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Where's Cap Raeder?

A mutual friend told me that Cap doesn't follow college hockey much anymore. Supposedly he is a big Red Sox fan.

 

[bomberhockey]

you are correct and I am embarrassed about my incorrect description (I would beg that being part of EU might get me partial credit)

Watcher
Of course you were very very close, deduct 1/2 of a commit on your next breaking story. You're rating is 98.5%

 

[Aerman]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Wait, Finland's not in Europe anymore?

 

[NCAA watcher]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Cripse. Aerman, save me from my ignorance. I should have put 2 and 2 together from the GEICO final countdown ads. Somehow I thought of Scandanavia as being technically different from Europe. (This is what happens before UNH had that second language requirement.) I'll go sit in the penalty box for 2 minutes and feel shame.

 

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Sooo we picked up a DMan James Miller coming in '17... CHC via Twitter..wait...is this old news?

 

[Aerman]

Cripse. Aerman, save me from my ignorance. I should have put 2 and 2 together from the GEICO final countdown ads. Somehow I thought of Scandanavia as being technically different from Europe. (This is what happens before UNH had that second language requirement.) I'll go sit in the penalty box for 2 minutes and feel shame.

MORE than atoned for with Slapshot reference.

 

[Snively65]

Sooo we picked up a DMan James Miller coming in '17... CHC via Twitter..wait...is this old news?

On Watcher's May 3rd summary post, although maybe edited later?

 

[C-H-C]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Sooo we picked up a DMan James Miller coming in '17... CHC via Twitter..wait...is this old news?

James Miller committed on May 3rd:

6'1", 175 lbs. left-shot defenseman from Spruce Grove Alberta played in Canadian Junior Hockey League NHL Prospects game in January, 2016. Drafted in 6th round of 2013 WHL Bantam Draft. Have heard he likes to jump up into the offensive rush, has decent vision and good on the power play. Last season he took a lot of penalties (102 PIM). Grizzlys assistant coach Dustin Borbandy has said: "He sees the ice really well. Very agile, smart with the puck. He's very mobile and jumps into the rush. He's got a great, great shot and he's a huge asset when he uses those."

 

[NCAA watcher]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

I watched Kawaguchi play online a number of times in the Chilliwack vs West Kelowna (with Liam Blackburn) BCHL playoff series. He is 19 years old, undersized, fast, and crafty (Micflikier-like). He's played three full seasons with Chilliwack, was their Captain this season, and looked to me like their second best forward next to Sukumaran (another PC commit). A good case could be made that he's ready to play Division I hockey next season. Although the Heisenberg spread sheet is not always up to date regarding which players have signed a National Letter of Intent, it indicates that Kawaguchi has not yet signed an NLI with Providence.

I think Kawaguchi is an example of the difficult situation facing college recruiters. As C-H-C noted last year, there really would not be a lot of space for UNH to offer him. Meanwhile, Providence has made space for upgrades in recruits, cutting loose Cam Lee (for Ryczek), Matt Alvaro, Tom Aldworth, Jake Henderson, Ted Hart, Terrance Amorso and Dylan McLaughlin, and Ori Abramson in just the past 4 years.
UNH has started this a bit. It is annoying to see Borek be able to walk away from his mistakes, saddle UNH while taking advantage of his cap flexibility.

So, do you join the dark side and overrecruit, or do you lock yourself out of getting good recruits by being virtuous?

 

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

James Miller committed on May 3rd:

Thanks...I have been too busy I guess to pick up on it all...sigh...oh well. Hope this is good news for us!

 

[E.J. Smith]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

I think Kawaguchi is an example of the difficult situation facing college recruiters. As C-H-C noted last year, there really would not be a lot of space for UNH to offer him. Meanwhile, Providence has made space for upgrades in recruits, cutting loose Cam Lee (for Ryczek), Matt Alvaro, Tom Aldworth, Jake Henderson, Ted Hart, Terrance Amorso and Dylan McLaughlin, and Ori Abramson in just the past 4 years.
UNH has started this a bit. It is annoying to see Borek be able to walk away from his mistakes, saddle UNH while taking advantage of his cap flexibility.

So, do you join the dark side and overrecruit, or do you lock yourself out of getting good recruits by being virtuous?

Good question, I don't know the answer.

I would add that cutting kids loose isn't without it's down side. You become known for that among the parents, players, advisors of the world - not to mention rival coaches using it against you - and it can sow some doubt into the minds of potential recruits. The flip side of that being the egos involved that lets those potential recruits think "would never happen to me, just those poor kids who aren't as good as I am."

 

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Good question, I don't know the answer.

I would add that cutting kids loose isn't without it's down side. You become known for that among the parents, players, advisors of the world - not to mention rival coaches using it against you - and it can sow some doubt into the minds of potential recruits. The flip side of that being the egos involved that lets those potential recruits think "would never happen to me, just those poor kids who aren't as good as I am."

Bingo - nailed it.

I've never liked the trend in recent years of seeing players recruited at younger and younger ages. I understand why some do it, and so long as your competitors are doing it, there's always going to be some pressure on the non-participants not to fall too far behind and miss out on the cream of the crop. But the difference between kids in their mid-teens and a couple of years later can be huge, as some early bloomers just don't develop as much as projected/expected, and others who've not been on the radar at earlier ages develop and sometimes pass them by. So I think you almost have to have a degree of flexibility in your recruiting approach, yet you also have to be disciplined enough not to offer every kid who moves the needle for you at age 16, and just assume you can walk away from half of 'em when the time comes.

Providence seems to be walking a fine line with some of their recent decommits. As long as they stay at or near the top competitively, I think they'll probably get away with it - precisely for the reason highlighted in EJ's last post - but if they start to slip, then I think they're risking "paying the price" with all that ammunition they're giving to competing recruiters' programs to use against them. That's when Coach Leaman probably decides he's run his course at PC, and then he can leave the carnage behind for his would-be successor to deal with. How ironic would it be if in that scenario, a certain Scott Borek was tabbed to take over and deal with the messy aftermath.

 

[Snively65]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

Souza teammate Colin Hemungway has returned to BC and will be an assistant coach with Surey. While Surrey is a weak team, it will be nice presumably to have eyes and ears in BC.

Colin Hemingway's great goal: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8z3Yk99yrak

 

[E.J. Smith]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

I've never liked the trend in recent years of seeing players recruited at younger and younger ages. I understand why some do it, and so long as your competitors are doing it, there's always going to be some pressure on the non-participants not to fall too far behind and miss out on the cream of the crop. But the difference between kids in their mid-teens and a couple of years later can be huge, as some early bloomers just don't develop as much as projected/expected, and others who've not been on the radar at earlier ages develop and sometimes pass them by. So I think you almost have to have a degree of flexibility in your recruiting approach, yet you also have to be disciplined enough not to offer every kid who moves the needle for you at age 16, and just assume you can walk away from half of 'em when the time comes.

I’m fully aware that they’re doing it for self-serving reasons and not for the good of college hockey and I absolutely despise the sleazy, bullying way they’re going about it but I am in favor of the basic premise behind the Big 10’s push to move college hockey to younger, more traditional college-aged players. That would alleviate some of the de-commit issues as it would shorten the time gap between recruiting and arrival on campus. It would be more of what you see is what you get.

(It could happen but I don’t think even crazy hockey coaches are going to seriously recruit 9 and 10 year olds who aren’t even close to hitting puberty. I could be wrong….)

The other part of the de-commit discussion that I find very lame is the “the kid didn’t continue to develop so we moved on” garbage you hear in EVERY case. That is so weak. Yup, sometimes it’s true. But just as often it’s you did a bad job scouting and now you’ve simply found someone better or even worse de-committing is baked into the system from the start and you commit a kid early knowing he’s probably just a placeholder, kind of like shorting the market to minimize your down side while you continue to look for better deals, except it’s 16 year old kids and not a unit of stock. Scummy.

 

[E.J. Smith]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

If only society could develop a way to enforce promises. Have the coaches have to live up to their commitments and they'll stop giving them away to 16 year olds.

But it is unfair to give the kids rights greater than those of the adults who also have to earn their non-guaranteed salaries, renewable year to year at the whims of the A.D.

that one is dripping...

 

[C-H-C]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

One way to encourage both coaches and young recruits to honor their commitments would be to allow 17-year-olds to sign a National Letter of Intent.

 

[HockeyRef]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

One way to encourage both coaches and young recruits to honor their commitments would be to allow 17-year-olds to sign a National Letter of Intent.

What is the age now, 18 I presume? Have discovered what a fickle,complicated world this hockey recruiting machine is...the ave fan has no idea (and neither do I really but I know more now than I did; maybe ignorance is bliss haha)....Sometimes I wish I was that fan who just waits to see who shows up and doesn't give it another thought. Anyhoo....nice to know how the game is 'somewhat' played.

 

[Chuck Murray]

Re: UNH Commits & Recruiting: 2016 and Beyond

I’m fully aware that they’re doing it for self-serving reasons and not for the good of college hockey and I absolutely despise the sleazy, bullying way they’re going about it but I am in favor of the basic premise behind the Big 10’s push to move college hockey to younger, more traditional college-aged players. That would alleviate some of the de-commit issues as it would shorten the time gap between recruiting and arrival on campus. It would be more of what you see is what you get.

(It could happen but I don’t think even crazy hockey coaches are going to seriously recruit 9 and 10 year olds who aren’t even close to hitting puberty. I could be wrong….)

The other part of the de-commit discussion that I find very lame is the “the kid didn’t continue to develop so we moved on” garbage you hear in EVERY case. That is so weak. Yup, sometimes it’s true. But just as often it’s you did a bad job scouting and now you’ve simply found someone better or even worse de-committing is baked into the system from the start and you commit a kid early knowing he’s probably just a placeholder, kind of like shorting the market to minimize your down side while you continue to look for better deals, except it’s 16 year old kids and not a unit of stock. Scummy.

Excellent post, and can't disagree with your basic premise. It's why the term "20 year old freshman" is seemingly synonymous with college hockey, and really nothing else. Whether it's to capitalize on the excess supply coming out of Canada and/or giving prep schools another raison d'etre, it's hard to justify a kid matriculating at 20 or *graduating* at 24 (or even running out of eligibility at 25 in some cases). Heck - our youngest graduates UNH this weekend at age 20, and our eldest graduated several years ago with a Masters at age 22. A good slice of the hockey program's players are virtually just getting started at those ages. And when the best answer you get to the question "Why?" is "Just because" then maybe it's time to go back to the drawing board and get a better answer.

I'm also not a huge fan of the so-called "redshirt" either. I think (assume?) that's been around for most of my lifetime, but it seems like just another device for the schools to maximize an asset's lifespan within their programs. While redshirting isn't a big factor in most D-1 hockey programs, it seems to be the tool of choice for the big-time football factories. Tighten all of that stuff up, and *maybe* the NCAA can make a convincing argument they're prioritizing the "C" (collegiate) instead of the $$$$$.

What is the age now, 18 I presume? Have discovered what a fickle,complicated world this hockey recruiting machine is...the ave fan has no idea (and neither do I really but I know more now than I did; maybe ignorance is bliss haha)....Sometimes I wish I was that fan who just waits to see who shows up and doesn't give it another thought. Anyhoo....nice to know how the game is 'somewhat' played.

Totally agree, HR. It's why I try to only be generally aware of the recruiting game (while respecting those who know the various ins and outs down cold) for D-1 hockey ... which was admittedly a lot easier in the first half of Coach's UNH career, when they had things working and you just trusted that most of the new kids would find their D-1 footing and keep the program moving forward competitively. Now that it's not happening, I suppose it's only human to want to see what's gone wrong with the process and understand how to fix it. I'm running out of time to see UNH back in the mix at the top of D-1, and they still seem to be either stuck in neutral or falling slowly deeper into the competitive quicksand. So I guess then it's all about me.