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UNH 2024/2025 Goldberg Edition

2013hockeyfan said:
Exception here of course is UConn which followed seemed to follow the more rare "build it and they will come" model of Pegulla at Penn State and ASU. They did use a good deal of University/State money, though. Of course that was a $70m proj, dramatically larger than everything mentioned above aside from what's happening in Orono.
Click to expand...

There are definitely really good examples in less "frugal" states. I was honestly surprised that in Mass both UML and UMA upgrade projects were philanthropic gifts. I went down this rabbit hole because of a comment pages and pages back about Maine having a larger hockey budget (they don't) and the state investing heavily in Alfond (it isn't).

Look the State of New Hampshire drastically underfunds the University, provides ZERO dollars to the University for anything other than academics. Athletics, dinning, housing, etc. all those other parts of a University other than classroom education must be funded outside of the tiny amount the State annually provides. Personally I think this is incredibly short sited by the state as the University is a significant economic engine and with more support could be even better. What I think is right isn't always reality. The State regularly bocks at allowing the University to bond all sorts projects because the State might, maybe, be on the hook someday in the future.

As to Pegulla at Penn State it actually makes my point

"The facility was brought to fruition by an initial $88 million donation - the largest in University history - from Terry and Kim Pegula, who, through their gift, helped Penn State realize its goal of Division I hockey."

Which... wait for it ... is another example of "new arenas and renovations funded by private money at a state school". (Potluck - facts not opinion) Again I am not saying it is "right".

As a P.S. at ground breaking Terry Pegula increased the donation by $14M more to $102M.

And just for fun we all know the state of North Dakota funded building Ralph Englestad Arena... errr wait ... that was Casino money from Las Vegas donated to the State school to privately fund a new arena... who did that donation????

Wait, just for a little more fun. Uconn and the $70M Toscano Family Ice Forum, named for the lead donor Dan Toscano, the project was financed by PRIVATE DONATIONS. Yup the State of Connecticut contributed $0 (yes ZERO DOLLARS). Which... wait for it ... is another example of "new arenas and renovations funded by private money at a state school".

Now I will admit Uconn hockey has NEVER been successful and Pegula gave money to create a non existent program at Penn State. So these are both exceptions to win now get upgrades later. They are however other really good examples of "new arenas and renovations funded by private money at a state school".
 
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JB said:
Wait, just for a little more fun. Uconn and the $70M Toscano Family Ice Forum, named for the lead donor Dan Toscano, the project was financed by PRIVATE DONATIONS. Yup the State of Connecticut contributed $0 (yes ZERO DOLLARS).
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This is not true.

"About half the cost of the arena is covered by donations. The other half will be covered by sale of revenue bonds and university funds."

www.ctinsider.com

UConn unveils new arena on campus as Connecticut college hockey thrives: ‘Great thing’

The Huskies' new $70 million arena, after 10 years of planning, opens this weekend as Connecticut become college hockey hotbed.
www.ctinsider.com www.ctinsider.com
 
JB said:
I think you are the one being obtuse, using the Hubbard example.

Let's stick to Ice Hockey, you know the topic at hand, and Dick Umile was the highest paid state employee for years (more than the Governor or the UNH President). Why? Because he won.

Ben Barr just got a massive raise at Maine. Why because he is winning and turned that program around.

So there are 2 examples at State schools with similar Athletic department funding.
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Ever hear of the Alfond family? The Alfonds are to Maine athletics what Ralph Engelstad was the UND hockey. You're actually crediting Barr with bringing the Alfonds to UMaine hockey? So you're being silly. Please don't compare anything associated with UNH private fundraising to the Alfond family support of Maine athletics. It's pretty clear you have no idea what "builds facilities" at colleges.

As for pivoting away from Hubbard, how convenient of you to do so. Winning left him with nothing at UNH. He had to go elsewhere. The reason Umile got the big raise was because Umile was about to take the UMass job. So he had to put a gun to the head of UNH. UNH blinked. That's not an example of UNH giving a coach a contract when he deserved it.

www.uscho.com

Umile Turns Down UMass, Will Stay At UNH - College Hockey | USCHO.com

University of New Hampshire athletic director Judy Ray announced Wednesday that coach Dick Umile will remain at UNH, and that the university is working
www.uscho.com www.uscho.com

You don't know your history, JB.
 
JB: Major capital projects are done at state schools by large scale government commitment. There's that word. Commitment. It involves the state legislature. It's not the product of one coach winning games. There's much more to it.

UNH currently has an excellent attendance record relative to other HE schools. The school will not really increase revenues by building/renovating the Whit. Revenues are not heavily tied to winning hockey game at UNH. So the key is you need political influence (lobbyists and friendly state reps) to get it done.
 
JB

You clearly don't know the Umass Lowell story. The Commonwealth of Massachusetts built Tsongas Arena (likely with help from the feds in tribute to Sen. Paul Tsongas) in the late 90s. The Commonwealth gifted it to UMass Lowell for $1 in about 2010 (ULowell was a lousy team and had been for more than a decade). UMass Lowell president Marty Meehan (former congressman) committed UMass Lowell to raise $5 million through a bond offering to renovate the facility for the hockey program.

Norm Bazin was hired a year later.

The renovation you mention was in about 20020 and was for the hoop team. Once again you simply don't know what you are talking about. The UMass Lowell hockey facility was all about politics.
 
Potluck said:
JB: Major capital projects are done at state schools by large scale government commitment. There's that word. Commitment. It involves the state legislature. It's not the product of one coach winning games. There's much more to it.

UNH currently has an excellent attendance record relative to other HE schools. The school will not really increase revenues by building/renovating the Whit. Revenues are not heavily tied to winning hockey game at UNH. So the key is you need political influence (lobbyists and friendly state reps) to get it done.
Click to expand...
You may be forgetting the most important part here. Winning creates more revenue from playing tournament games.
 
JB: Just to finish this off, UMass Mullins Center was funded by the State in its entirety. UMass didn't have hockey when it was built. It started up a program when it was completed. As for the recent locker room renovations, they cost a total of $2 million in 2021, which is a far cry from what UNH is trying to do.

You clearly did zero homework. Nearly all of your examples suggest that there is no link between college hockey facilities and on ice performance. Therefore, your suggestion the Mike Souza needs to "gladhand" donors and win more games to raise money for a Whit renovation is complete nonsense. Mike Souza needs an employer that has a commitment to improving the facility and the lobbyists and political connections to get it done.
 
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Jellsville USA said:
You may be forgetting the most important part here. Winning creates more revenue from playing tournament games.
Click to expand...
Well, let's take a look at that. If UNH had a winning team this year, best case scenario is it gets one or two additional home games. Nothing more. In addition, the HE home tourney games sometimes are played during spring break which kills attendance. Overall, one or two games per year (assuming winning) is small potatoes. I don't think teams get profit sharing bonus for playing in the HE tourney final four or the NCAAs. I always thought the NCAA covers team expenses but nothing more for tourney appearances.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.
 
2013hockeyfan said:
This is not true.

"About half the cost of the arena is covered by donations. The other half will be covered by sale of revenue bonds and university funds."

www.ctinsider.com

UConn unveils new arena on campus as Connecticut college hockey thrives: ‘Great thing’

The Huskies' new $70 million arena, after 10 years of planning, opens this weekend as Connecticut become college hockey hotbed.
www.ctinsider.com www.ctinsider.com
Click to expand...

The search I did had it all privately funded with an amanous donor giving $14M and the Toscano's as the lead donor. Can't find the article now and I am not digging.

Side note the "AI Overview" on my original search said "$0" and the article was one of the links. Now AI it says the state covered $4.5M and none of the linked resources has that amount.

So we have 1 recent facility partially upgraded/built with public funds.
 
Potluck said:
Ever hear of the Alfond family? The Alfonds are to Maine athletics what Ralph Engelstad was the UND hockey. You're actually crediting Barr with bringing the Alfonds to UMaine hockey? So you're being silly. Please don't compare anything associated with UNH private fundraising to the Alfond family support of Maine athletics. It's pretty clear you have no idea what "builds facilities" at colleges.

As for pivoting away from Hubbard, how convenient of you to do so. Winning left him with nothing at UNH. He had to go elsewhere. The reason Umile got the big raise was because Umile was about to take the UMass job. So he had to put a gun to the head of UNH. UNH blinked. That's not an example of UNH giving a coach a contract when he deserved it.

www.uscho.com

Umile Turns Down UMass, Will Stay At UNH - College Hockey | USCHO.com

University of New Hampshire athletic director Judy Ray announced Wednesday that coach Dick Umile will remain at UNH, and that the university is working
www.uscho.com www.uscho.com

You don't know your history, JB.
Click to expand...

So wait Ben Barr didn't invent the name Alfond? I am completely amazed, I thought they just named the build because Ben Barr did a brainstorming and came up with Alfond. Ben then went back in time (because he can time travel too) modified all the records and made us all believe it was named that way the entire time. No sh!t Harold Alfond donated heavily to UMaine. After he made a fortune making shoes in Maine (Dexter shoe). Do you think it is a simple coincidence that the Alfond Foundation decided now, when the team is on an up swing is the time to donate.

You know who in the past donated a lot to UNH the Whittemore family.

Yes, Umile used another offer to leverage a better deal. When did he turn down that offer? March of 2000 after 4 straight NCAAs, 2 of them frozen fours. So yup he wanted a better contract was WINNING and got leverage. Clearly UNH made a different decision on Hubbard, if I had to guess sold out 6501 seat arenas at increase ticket prices probably had something to do with the math.

I am noting in most cases winning is how you get better pay, better facilities, etc. etc. It worked for Hubbard, I am guessing he is getting paid better in North Carolina, UNH just made a different decision for any number of reasons.

Another example Ben Barr just got a big raise, I think it is because Maine is on a big upswing and winning. Maybe they just like his wonderful personality, I don't know you would need to ask Maine fans, but I am going with the winning.
 
Potluck said:
JB: Just to finish this off, UMass Mullins Center was funded by the State in its entirety. UMass didn't have hockey when it was built. It started up a program when it was completed. As for the recent locker room renovations, they cost a total of $2 million in 2021, which is a far cry from what UNH is trying to do.

You clearly did zero homework. Nearly all of your examples suggest that there is no link between college hockey facilities and on ice performance. Therefore, your suggestion the Mike Souza needs to "gladhand" donors and win more games to raise money for a Whit renovation is complete nonsense. Mike Souza needs an employer that has a commitment to improving the facility and the lobbyists and political connections to get it done.
Click to expand...

Zero homework. You are funny.

I gave specific examples of recent investments in "new arenas and renovations funded by private money at a state school".

I didn't comment on building the Tsongas Arena because it was built as much for the city of Lowell as the university hence why it had the AHL Lock Monsters. Oddly when the AHL team announced it was going to be leaving a the end of 2010 that is when the University worked with the State to take over the space. I am sure the State was happy to not deal with it any longer. I did not dig where the $5M in 2010 upgrades came from, donations, bonds, etc. that might be a case for you.

Likewise I didn't comment on the Mullins as it was really built primarily for basketball. If you have been in that building you know the hockey site lines are kinda sucky because it was built for a ball going in a 10 foot hoop. "It replaced the Curry Hicks Cage, the 1930s-era basketball gymnasium, as the home of the Minutemen basketball teams. In addition, it allowed the hockey team, which had been downgraded to club status since the late 1970s, to be elevated to Division I status." From the Mullins Center website. "in addition" and also, but not the primary reason.

All of my original examples of renovations (UML, UMA, UMaine) and building the Whittemore are tied to better performance and included Hockey.

I applaud you for actually going and getting examples for your point of view, even if I find them flawed because the cases had additional circumstances (A10 Bball, AHL etc.). Why don't you go find some bonds States have backed for $70-100M for new hockey facilities, particularly for teams doing poorly the lost 5-10 years. Maybe Michigan did it for MSU before that turn around, or MTU before that one, pretty sure those are both the coach doing well with what they have too.

I still hold that I have clearly shown that new arenas and renovations are funded by private money at a state school, regularly, often, commonly, routinely, potentially even the norm the last 25 years. Additionally more often than not based on better performance.

My experience in life is money follows winners not whiners.
 
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e.cat said:
The facilities convo is irrelevant to me. Just win baby!
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exactly
the team that the wins the most is the one that gets off the bus with the best players
Hopefully eligibility of junior players helps lower end teams
Otherwise allowing 26 scholarships just boosts major recognized national programs
 
Was really hoping this group could put together one, maybe two.. maybe three….. hell, maybe four more wins. Thought the seniors would rally and make some magic happen. They certainly tried. DiMatteo played amazing. Best of luck to the graduating class. See what next season holds.
 
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