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TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
- Thread starter The Rube
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rufus
rock and roller
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
Maybe derivative is too strong a word, but just too much "been there, seen that". The gay love twist between Manson and the girl's father, with his shame and loathing about being the way he is. Seems the big twist in series' these days is to have a character be gay, or bisexual. Just saw it in Black Sails, don't need to see it again here. The way Duchovny got the guy to sit down and write out his confession for killing his wife, with the phony promise that he'd make a deal to keep him out of jail, etc., seen it in way too many cop shows to even be worth showing anymore. The by the book, anti-racist, human rights loving rookie who just happens to be married to a black woman, ho-hum.
Plus, Renly Manson is way too pretty-boy and not creepy enough to make an interesting Manson, and so far, the storyline about the missing girl and her joining his cult hasn't really developed into anything too interesting so far.
Think it would be probably more interesting if they were depicting events closer to the Tate killings, and the investigations after, but that wouldn't leave much room for possible multi-season series.
I also can't figure out if some of the music is just generic "Sixties hippie music" or is actually obscure stuff from that era I've never heard before.
Maybe derivative is too strong a word, but just too much "been there, seen that". The gay love twist between Manson and the girl's father, with his shame and loathing about being the way he is. Seems the big twist in series' these days is to have a character be gay, or bisexual. Just saw it in Black Sails, don't need to see it again here. The way Duchovny got the guy to sit down and write out his confession for killing his wife, with the phony promise that he'd make a deal to keep him out of jail, etc., seen it in way too many cop shows to even be worth showing anymore. The by the book, anti-racist, human rights loving rookie who just happens to be married to a black woman, ho-hum.
Plus, Renly Manson is way too pretty-boy and not creepy enough to make an interesting Manson, and so far, the storyline about the missing girl and her joining his cult hasn't really developed into anything too interesting so far.
Think it would be probably more interesting if they were depicting events closer to the Tate killings, and the investigations after, but that wouldn't leave much room for possible multi-season series.
I also can't figure out if some of the music is just generic "Sixties hippie music" or is actually obscure stuff from that era I've never heard before.
bigblue_dl
Armed
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
Heh. Renley Manson. I get it.
Heh. Renley Manson. I get it.
Spartanforlife4
Generic Catchy Message
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
Amazing a TV show can be one of the best and worst of all time, yet the Simpsons appear to be aiming for it.
Homer and Marge will separate. Probably get back together later that episode, but come on. Plus like a third of the characters won't even have their same voices. It's amazing to watch the classics on FXX and see how great it used to be, and compare it to how far it's fallen.
Amazing a TV show can be one of the best and worst of all time, yet the Simpsons appear to be aiming for it.
Homer and Marge will separate. Probably get back together later that episode, but come on. Plus like a third of the characters won't even have their same voices. It's amazing to watch the classics on FXX and see how great it used to be, and compare it to how far it's fallen.
St. Clown
Liberal Rebel Scum, apparently
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
The last couple seasons saw a real uptick in the quality of the show. Otherwise, yeah, there was a huge drop off in quality from the early seasons. The first 10 years they had very few bad episodes. From seasons 11-13, it was roughly 50/50 for the quality. Then it got really bad and I stopped watching the new stuff. Then I started hearing some good things a couple years ago, started watching the new episodes again, and they were mostly good. It's a much different feel than the early years, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.
The last couple seasons saw a real uptick in the quality of the show. Otherwise, yeah, there was a huge drop off in quality from the early seasons. The first 10 years they had very few bad episodes. From seasons 11-13, it was roughly 50/50 for the quality. Then it got really bad and I stopped watching the new stuff. Then I started hearing some good things a couple years ago, started watching the new episodes again, and they were mostly good. It's a much different feel than the early years, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
I didn't even think it was bad, I just lost interest about season 10. There was a time when it was the best show on television in a landslide. The last show that can say that is the first season of Mad Men, and it may never happen again. Speaking as somebody who tends to hate the modern, we really are living in the golden age of television, right now.
I didn't even think it was bad, I just lost interest about season 10. There was a time when it was the best show on television in a landslide. The last show that can say that is the first season of Mad Men, and it may never happen again. Speaking as somebody who tends to hate the modern, we really are living in the golden age of television, right now.
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
We really are. AND the tv people are realizing that you can't run a series, no matter how good, for too long. 6~ seasons seems to be the magic number. I think series like Walking Dead, Breaking Bad, SOA, etc...ones that push that envelope that the networks never even came close to, helped a bunch. People don't want cookie-cutter BS. They want edgy, whether it's over the top action, or slow burn drama, or whatever. They want complexity.
We really are. AND the tv people are realizing that you can't run a series, no matter how good, for too long. 6~ seasons seems to be the magic number. I think series like Walking Dead, Breaking Bad, SOA, etc...ones that push that envelope that the networks never even came close to, helped a bunch. People don't want cookie-cutter BS. They want edgy, whether it's over the top action, or slow burn drama, or whatever. They want complexity.
bigblue_dl
Armed
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
It is the depth of stories (Breaking Bad, True Detective) and the simply massive undertakings (Game of Thrones) that are making TV better than ever. When would have you ever thought that someone would even try to capture a story as massive as Game of Thrones in a TV show? These huge, ambitious projects combined with studios/networks that believe in the shows are what are really making this great TV.
It is the depth of stories (Breaking Bad, True Detective) and the simply massive undertakings (Game of Thrones) that are making TV better than ever. When would have you ever thought that someone would even try to capture a story as massive as Game of Thrones in a TV show? These huge, ambitious projects combined with studios/networks that believe in the shows are what are really making this great TV.
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
Exactly. SURPRISE! People want to be challenged mentally; they want to think about what is going to happen next, they want to know how even minor characters might act in the story. TV is just a visual book. This isn't some comic strip like Judge Parker or Family Circus, like most network shows have been in the past. These new series are not tidy. They don't wrap up in an hour.
Exactly. SURPRISE! People want to be challenged mentally; they want to think about what is going to happen next, they want to know how even minor characters might act in the story. TV is just a visual book. This isn't some comic strip like Judge Parker or Family Circus, like most network shows have been in the past. These new series are not tidy. They don't wrap up in an hour.
RaceBoarder
Waiting for the Snow to fly...
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
There was a book titled "Everything Bad Is Good For You" that I had to read for a Sociology (?) 101 type class at NMU. The point being made here was a major point in the book... And that was using TV shows from the early 2000s like CSI and Law & Order... Since that point in time, shows have gotten that much deeper... Another idea with this is having different shows happening in the same world (comic book shows like Arrow/Flash)...
St. Clown
Liberal Rebel Scum, apparently
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
When Joss Whedon was doing TV, he got a lot of push back from the TV execs because he had story arcs that would last an entire season, and prior seasons would impact the characters in future seasons. During his time making season 5 of Angel, you could see a noticeable change in how stories were told. In order to get the fifth season greenlit, he had to agree that all stories would be self-contained within an episode; each episode had a beginning, middle and conclusion. He discussed it in the commentary on the DVDs, talking about how for all of his shows they would create some minor B-story that would follow that very scheme, but the season was itself the full, single story. IMO, that single storytelling device/plot displayed his comic book background more than anything else. They were still able to craft that protracted storyline device to some degree, but it was toned down from seasons past.
When Joss Whedon was doing TV, he got a lot of push back from the TV execs because he had story arcs that would last an entire season, and prior seasons would impact the characters in future seasons. During his time making season 5 of Angel, you could see a noticeable change in how stories were told. In order to get the fifth season greenlit, he had to agree that all stories would be self-contained within an episode; each episode had a beginning, middle and conclusion. He discussed it in the commentary on the DVDs, talking about how for all of his shows they would create some minor B-story that would follow that very scheme, but the season was itself the full, single story. IMO, that single storytelling device/plot displayed his comic book background more than anything else. They were still able to craft that protracted storyline device to some degree, but it was toned down from seasons past.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
I think it's a lot of things, many of them economic. The proliferation of outlets and production companies has given lots of new, non-traditional content providers a chance. The studio system aimed at the lowest common denominator to get the largest overall audience, and shows were deliberately dumbed down ("don't lose your demographic!"). That still probably happens on the major networks, but there are enough niche providers now that good stuff can get through. Targeted advertising had improved, too, so if you want to reach say younger, more highly educated people you want there to be outlets that serve them, creating a virtuous cycle. I also suspect that technology has lowered the entry costs for producing material, like it has in music. You can probably do post-production on your laptop with specialized software now, whereas in the past you needed the studio and had to be willing to water down your product.
tl; dr: It's easier to bypass the morons now.
I think it's a lot of things, many of them economic. The proliferation of outlets and production companies has given lots of new, non-traditional content providers a chance. The studio system aimed at the lowest common denominator to get the largest overall audience, and shows were deliberately dumbed down ("don't lose your demographic!"). That still probably happens on the major networks, but there are enough niche providers now that good stuff can get through. Targeted advertising had improved, too, so if you want to reach say younger, more highly educated people you want there to be outlets that serve them, creating a virtuous cycle. I also suspect that technology has lowered the entry costs for producing material, like it has in music. You can probably do post-production on your laptop with specialized software now, whereas in the past you needed the studio and had to be willing to water down your product.
tl; dr: It's easier to bypass the morons now.
bigblue_dl
Armed
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
edit: dammit, Handy, you deleted before I could respond.
Here's my response, regardless.
...and Bud Light is the best selling beer, soccer is the most popular sport in the world, and 50 Shades of Gray sold millions of copies. Just because millions of people like something, doesn't make it good. Luckily, companies/people realize that there is a market for high quality TV, craft beer, hockey, and...well, anything but 50 Shades of Gray. In addition to that, and more importantly, they have figured out a way to make money doing so, so those of us that don't have poor tastes can enjoy these things as well.
edit: dammit, Handy, you deleted before I could respond.
Here's my response, regardless.
...and Bud Light is the best selling beer, soccer is the most popular sport in the world, and 50 Shades of Gray sold millions of copies. Just because millions of people like something, doesn't make it good. Luckily, companies/people realize that there is a market for high quality TV, craft beer, hockey, and...well, anything but 50 Shades of Gray. In addition to that, and more importantly, they have figured out a way to make money doing so, so those of us that don't have poor tastes can enjoy these things as well.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
You know I hear that excuse all the time and you know what, it is total BS. That is art house, hipster logic. That is the same stuff people use to deride popular music or summer blockbuster movies and play up how awesome some lesser known band or indie director is...until such time as that band/director becomes more popular, sells more records/makes higher budget movies and then all of a sudden they "sold out". Just like popularity /= quality popularity /= crap either.
Maybe YOU dont like it, maybe I dont like it but guess what plenty of others do. I may think Kepler has no taste (mostly in jest) cause he watches the Bachelor but more people watch that than a lot of the stuff I watch. How are they wrong and you are right...just cause you say so? (or I say so) Sorry but no.
There is always small niche groups and it is always good when studios or record labels or whoever learn to cater to them. (I have said the NHL should have been doing this for years instead of trying to go broad cater to those who love the sport and let it grow) Dont think for a second though that the cute little boutique studios or the craft beer companies wouldnt give anything to grow their market share to the likes of Warner Brothers or Budweiser. If they thought there was a chance to do it they would...and then plenty of people would flip the script and say "I liked it back in the day when it was better" even though little has changed.
You know I hear that excuse all the time and you know what, it is total BS. That is art house, hipster logic. That is the same stuff people use to deride popular music or summer blockbuster movies and play up how awesome some lesser known band or indie director is...until such time as that band/director becomes more popular, sells more records/makes higher budget movies and then all of a sudden they "sold out". Just like popularity /= quality popularity /= crap either.
Maybe YOU dont like it, maybe I dont like it but guess what plenty of others do. I may think Kepler has no taste (mostly in jest) cause he watches the Bachelor but more people watch that than a lot of the stuff I watch. How are they wrong and you are right...just cause you say so? (or I say so) Sorry but no.
There is always small niche groups and it is always good when studios or record labels or whoever learn to cater to them. (I have said the NHL should have been doing this for years instead of trying to go broad cater to those who love the sport and let it grow) Dont think for a second though that the cute little boutique studios or the craft beer companies wouldnt give anything to grow their market share to the likes of Warner Brothers or Budweiser. If they thought there was a chance to do it they would...and then plenty of people would flip the script and say "I liked it back in the day when it was better" even though little has changed.
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Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
You only decide what "good" is for one person - yourself. You do not decide for everyone else. And no one else decides for you. I'm not sure what's so difficult about this concept, but some people do not seem to get it. You liking something does not make it "good" for everyone, just as millions of people liking something doesn't make it "good" for you. This is why the phrase "to each their own" exists. Accept that people have different tastes - not better, not worse - and move on.
edit: dammit, Handy, you deleted before I could respond.
Here's my response, regardless.
...and Bud Light is the best selling beer, soccer is the most popular sport in the world, and 50 Shades of Gray sold millions of copies. Just because millions of people like something, doesn't make it good. Luckily, companies/people realize that there is a market for high quality TV, craft beer, hockey, and...well, anything but 50 Shades of Gray. In addition to that, and more importantly, they have figured out a way to make money doing so, so those of us that don't have poor tastes can enjoy these things as well.
You only decide what "good" is for one person - yourself. You do not decide for everyone else. And no one else decides for you. I'm not sure what's so difficult about this concept, but some people do not seem to get it. You liking something does not make it "good" for everyone, just as millions of people liking something doesn't make it "good" for you. This is why the phrase "to each their own" exists. Accept that people have different tastes - not better, not worse - and move on.
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Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
Tell that to New Glarus. They actually refuse to increase their market share.
I do agree that just because something is popular, it does not make it quality. Reality shows, for example, are not though-provoking shows that challenge the mind in any way whatsoever. Are some reality shows "good" as in "entertaining?" Sure, if that's your thing. But again, that doesn't mean those shows are quality.
Tell that to New Glarus. They actually refuse to increase their market share.
I do agree that just because something is popular, it does not make it quality. Reality shows, for example, are not though-provoking shows that challenge the mind in any way whatsoever. Are some reality shows "good" as in "entertaining?" Sure, if that's your thing. But again, that doesn't mean those shows are quality.
bigblue_dl
Armed
Re: TV: The League Of Anarchy Is A Bunch Of Justified Mad Men
And just because something isn't high quality doesn't mean you can't like it or enjoy it. I definitely think that there is a difference between preferences of a person and the quality of something.
Hell, millions of people loved Sharknado, there's nothing wrong with that. It does not make it a quality movie.
Tell that to New Glarus. They actually refuse to increase their market share.
I do agree that just because something is popular, it does not make it quality. Reality shows, for example, are not though-provoking shows that challenge the mind in any way whatsoever. Are some reality shows "good" as in "entertaining?" Sure, if that's your thing. But again, that doesn't mean those shows are quality.
And just because something isn't high quality doesn't mean you can't like it or enjoy it. I definitely think that there is a difference between preferences of a person and the quality of something.
Hell, millions of people loved Sharknado, there's nothing wrong with that. It does not make it a quality movie.
ExileOnDaytonStreet
Drunkard
Tell that to New Glarus. They actually refuse to increase their market share.
Hell, they even go so far as to discontinue ANY beer that isn't Spotted Cow.
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