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Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
- Thread starter dxmnkd316
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Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
This is fine. The Mr. Trump thread can reserved for his Nuremberg Laws.
This was technically about the campaign but it's just as valid for how the Klan Kaiser is going to govern.
This is a smarter take on it. tl; dr, it's woo.
This is fine. The Mr. Trump thread can reserved for his Nuremberg Laws.
This was technically about the campaign but it's just as valid for how the Klan Kaiser is going to govern.
This is a smarter take on it. tl; dr, it's woo.
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St. Clown
Liberal Rebel Scum, apparently
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
Prior to the start of his first term, I give him a 25% chance of running for re-election. Depending upon how haggard he looks as the term presses forward will determine whether or not I drop that value. It will not go up.
Prior to the start of his first term, I give him a 25% chance of running for re-election. Depending upon how haggard he looks as the term presses forward will determine whether or not I drop that value. It will not go up.
dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
I'd say 50:50.
On one hand, his ego and thirst for titles (not necessarily power) could drive him to a second term.
On the other, he could easily hate the job so much because he's going to be bored, things aren't going to go his way, and he's going to need to ask for help. Without the help, he might go down as one of the worst presidents in history.
I'd say 50:50.
On one hand, his ego and thirst for titles (not necessarily power) could drive him to a second term.
On the other, he could easily hate the job so much because he's going to be bored, things aren't going to go his way, and he's going to need to ask for help. Without the help, he might go down as one of the worst presidents in history.
St. Clown
Liberal Rebel Scum, apparently
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
That's the thing, the top people in government aren't interested in helping him. He's going to see so much resistance every step of the way that he's going to refuse his party's urging to run for a second term and the blame shall be set entirely at other people's feet.
That's the thing, the top people in government aren't interested in helping him. He's going to see so much resistance every step of the way that he's going to refuse his party's urging to run for a second term and the blame shall be set entirely at other people's feet.
dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
Yeah, that could easily happen as well. This has been impossible to predict (unless you're Michael Moore, I guess... Blind clock or something) from the day he came down the gaudy escalator. I don't think we can predict anything
Yeah, that could easily happen as well. This has been impossible to predict (unless you're Michael Moore, I guess... Blind clock or something) from the day he came down the gaudy escalator. I don't think we can predict anything
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
So to re-ask my question from the other thread...
Many have complained that the Obama two terms did a lot of un-constitutional stuff.
Can anyone be very specific about that? Especially things that were unique and not just carried over from the Bush years.
What rights have people lost over the last 8 years?
So to re-ask my question from the other thread...
Many have complained that the Obama two terms did a lot of un-constitutional stuff.
Can anyone be very specific about that? Especially things that were unique and not just carried over from the Bush years.
What rights have people lost over the last 8 years?
dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
Weren't part of his immigration order struck down in court? (Which isn't to say he's any worse or better than previous presidents)
Weren't part of his immigration order struck down in court? (Which isn't to say he's any worse or better than previous presidents)
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
I lost my right to prevent gay people from getting married, just like my pappy lost his right to prevent people of different races from getting married.
Clearly, the scope of our rights keeps shrinking.
I lost my right to prevent gay people from getting married, just like my pappy lost his right to prevent people of different races from getting married.
Clearly, the scope of our rights keeps shrinking.
FlagDUDE08
Banned
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
Not to mention, they're still holding out on the electoral college "going rogue"...
Not to mention, they're still holding out on the electoral college "going rogue"...
dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
Keep repeating the question.
Keep repeating the question.
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
And that's kind of my point- the righties keep pointing out that Obama has been the worst ever many times, and R's are so much better. Apparently forgetting that Bush got smacked down a few times, too.
But I also want it to go beyond some policies that were done "on his own", and also address rights that apparently been lost.
Be specific.
I'm sure that the 2nd will be brought up, and the fact that nothing happened in the last 8 years won't be even brought up. Just the "feeling" of losing it.
And that's kind of my point- the righties keep pointing out that Obama has been the worst ever many times, and R's are so much better. Apparently forgetting that Bush got smacked down a few times, too.
But I also want it to go beyond some policies that were done "on his own", and also address rights that apparently been lost.
Be specific.
I'm sure that the 2nd will be brought up, and the fact that nothing happened in the last 8 years won't be even brought up. Just the "feeling" of losing it.
unofan
Well-known member
Yes, but by an equally divided court, so it didn't set precedential value.
Russell Jaslow
Registered User
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
Yeah, I was waiting for that card to be attempted to be played.
Besides the fact the Electoral College had effectively been neutered (from what the Founding Fathers envisioned it to be), the only way they go "rogue" is if we suddenly find out Trump committed a heinous crime, treason, or gives the Nazi salute at his next rally.
Not to mention, they're still holding out on the electoral college "going rogue"...
Yeah, I was waiting for that card to be attempted to be played.
Besides the fact the Electoral College had effectively been neutered (from what the Founding Fathers envisioned it to be), the only way they go "rogue" is if we suddenly find out Trump committed a heinous crime, treason, or gives the Nazi salute at his next rally.
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Russell Jaslow
Registered User
Russell Jaslow
Registered User
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
This doesn't exactly answer your question, but it is interesting how Presidents change once they are in office. I'm not talking about a campaign promise here and there (like "Read my lips, no new taxes!"), no matter how damaging breaking such a promise can be politically. I'm talking about general philosophies and platforms change.
Take Obama for instance (and this is just an example because it happens to everyone). He was generally anti-war, or at least anti-Iraq war, and wanted to get out of the Middle East conflicts as quickly as possible. He wanted to shutdown Guantanamo (though, he did kind of sort of try, so I'll give him a pass on that), was generally against the use of drones, leaned towards the liberal version of privacy rights, wanted to knock down the Patriot Act, and wanted to reform immigration.
But what really happened? The Patriot Act may have been neutered, but surveillance of private citizens by agencies like the NSA increased during his tenure as we learned from Snowden.
He increased the use of drone warfare exponentially. In fact, in some cases in some areas of the world, his only strategy was drone warfare. As one headline read a few years ago in a very interesting article, "How Obama Became a Hawk."
As for immigration, here's a stat that will surprise most people because it hasn't been publicized that much. And as Casey Stengel would say, you can look it up. The Obama administration actually deported more aliens than the previous three administrations put together. In some ways, he was more Trump like towards illegal immigrants than the two Bush's.
Of course, attitudes and beliefs change when you are responsible for protecting 280 million people...
This doesn't exactly answer your question, but it is interesting how Presidents change once they are in office. I'm not talking about a campaign promise here and there (like "Read my lips, no new taxes!"), no matter how damaging breaking such a promise can be politically. I'm talking about general philosophies and platforms change.
Take Obama for instance (and this is just an example because it happens to everyone). He was generally anti-war, or at least anti-Iraq war, and wanted to get out of the Middle East conflicts as quickly as possible. He wanted to shutdown Guantanamo (though, he did kind of sort of try, so I'll give him a pass on that), was generally against the use of drones, leaned towards the liberal version of privacy rights, wanted to knock down the Patriot Act, and wanted to reform immigration.
But what really happened? The Patriot Act may have been neutered, but surveillance of private citizens by agencies like the NSA increased during his tenure as we learned from Snowden.
He increased the use of drone warfare exponentially. In fact, in some cases in some areas of the world, his only strategy was drone warfare. As one headline read a few years ago in a very interesting article, "How Obama Became a Hawk."
As for immigration, here's a stat that will surprise most people because it hasn't been publicized that much. And as Casey Stengel would say, you can look it up. The Obama administration actually deported more aliens than the previous three administrations put together. In some ways, he was more Trump like towards illegal immigrants than the two Bush's.
Of course, attitudes and beliefs change when you are responsible for protecting 280 million people...
Wisko McBadgerton
Teaching you how to Bucky.
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
Hey, these guys are up to 40 signatures already!
Yeah, I was waiting for that card to be attempted to be played.
Besides the fact the Electoral College had effectively been neutered (from what the Founding Fathers envisioned it to be), the only way they go "rogue" is if we suddenly find out Trump committed a heinous crime, treason, or gives the Nazi salute at his next rally.
Hey, these guys are up to 40 signatures already!
Re: Trump First Term I: I for One Welcome Our New Trumpy Overlord
First, I have no idea precisely what the "many" have claimed. However, in a previous thread (in which I described Obama as average or above average, as I recall) I pointed out my two main concerns about the Obama presidency.
First, we had a dumpster fire of a system for paying for healthcare in this country before he took office. I personally believe all the ACA did was pour gas on that fire, as opposed to solving any real problems for any appreciable length of time (I don't believe temporarily adding people to the list of insureds, only to see them be forced off, with others, in the next couple of years because of outrageous premium prices is really an improvement.)
Second, I think Obama's practice of "if Congress won't act, I will" sets a dangerous precedent and is arguably unconstitutional. Another example beyond the aforementioned immigration action includes some appointments of judges under the NLRA which were later set aside as being unlawful. There were also some portions of the ACA that were legislated that certain things had to be done by certain times, and when it became politically expedient to shift those deadlines, he did so unilaterally without Congress, who really has to do the legislating.
His acts weren't so brazen as taking peoples guns away, declaring that certain segments of society no longer have the right to marry, or that type of thing. But I don't know that anyone has actually accused him of doing those things, although some may have accused him of wanting to do certain acts.
My concern about the Obama acts that I delineated is not so much the immediate impact on our "constitutional rights" but a slow erosion of some of the protections our form of government has had in place to prevent rule by dictatorship. Every president would love the authority to just declare what the law is. To the extent that any president chips away at that limitation, it is ultimately a bad thing.
Your original question/premise was that "many" (unnamed) complain that Obama has committed numerous unconstitutional acts, so you want to know what "rights" have been taken away.
First, I have no idea precisely what the "many" have claimed. However, in a previous thread (in which I described Obama as average or above average, as I recall) I pointed out my two main concerns about the Obama presidency.
First, we had a dumpster fire of a system for paying for healthcare in this country before he took office. I personally believe all the ACA did was pour gas on that fire, as opposed to solving any real problems for any appreciable length of time (I don't believe temporarily adding people to the list of insureds, only to see them be forced off, with others, in the next couple of years because of outrageous premium prices is really an improvement.)
Second, I think Obama's practice of "if Congress won't act, I will" sets a dangerous precedent and is arguably unconstitutional. Another example beyond the aforementioned immigration action includes some appointments of judges under the NLRA which were later set aside as being unlawful. There were also some portions of the ACA that were legislated that certain things had to be done by certain times, and when it became politically expedient to shift those deadlines, he did so unilaterally without Congress, who really has to do the legislating.
His acts weren't so brazen as taking peoples guns away, declaring that certain segments of society no longer have the right to marry, or that type of thing. But I don't know that anyone has actually accused him of doing those things, although some may have accused him of wanting to do certain acts.
My concern about the Obama acts that I delineated is not so much the immediate impact on our "constitutional rights" but a slow erosion of some of the protections our form of government has had in place to prevent rule by dictatorship. Every president would love the authority to just declare what the law is. To the extent that any president chips away at that limitation, it is ultimately a bad thing.
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