The Transfer Portal - "Beam me over there, Scotty."

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

There’s no doubt that this is great for players, who now have a bit of leverage where they had none.

Theres also no doubt that this will favor the bigger programs, allowing them a totally new profile of 1-2 year players.

 

[J.D.]

Well, recruiting older freshmen has helped the smaller programs compete. Perhaps this one time transfer rule will prove to tip the scale back in the other direction. We shall see what happens on the ice.

 

[Split-N]

I have zero problem with graduate transfers. If a player can pick up a degree and move on to get a master's (or at least a leg up towards one), then more power to him/her. But I have a big problem with the kind of unrestricted free agency into which the portal is morphing. The whole thing is being driven by P5 football and basketball, which has found a convenient way to dispose of their underperformers and replace them with kids who were previously overlooked or were significantly developed by coaching staffs at institutions with far fewer resources. So the rich get richer. And don't get me started with the new reality motivating some (not all) athletes to play for the name on the back of the sweater instead of the name on the front.

Also annoying is the fact that the very people who are pushing athlete rights completely discount, ignore, and dismiss as irrelevant the value of the underlying scholarship (currently north of $65K/yr at my undergrad school). There are unintended consequences to all of this "liberation," one of which is the athletes who don't have a legitimate degree to fall back on if they don't get drafted, don't get signed as a free agent, don't make the cut at the next level, and thus never make the "big money."

There are more than a few once-famous college athletes who ended up selling shoes or driving delivery trucks when the dream didn't materialize. It's a scandal and almost nobody cares.

I know it's rude, crude, and uncouth to quote yourself but I'm surprised this drew zero responses. Major issues, as I see them, bolded. Anybody care?

 

[Ralph Baer]

Well, recruiting older freshmen has helped the smaller programs compete. Perhaps this one time transfer rule will prove to tip the scale back in the other direction. We shall see what happens on the ice.

The larger programs have always been able to recruit the older players also, and no doubt many of those would jump at the opportunity. It takes little skill for the coaching staffs of larger schools to evaluate such players. All they have to do is convince the potential players that they should attend their school as opposed to another mega-school.

 

[Sean Pickett]

I know it's rude, crude, and uncouth to quote yourself but I'm surprised this drew zero responses. Major issues, as I see them, bolded. Anybody care?

It's my observation that people are less likely to reply when they agree with you then when they don't. Still, since you pleaded for a reply, I'll give you one. First, one, I really don't care, nor do I think think they are major issues. As for you complaints, I'll try to take them one by one:

I have a big problem with the kind of unrestricted free agency into which the portal is morphing. The whole thing is being driven by P5 football and basketball, which has found a convenient way to dispose of their underperformers and replace them with kids who were previously overlooked or were significantly developed by coaching staffs at institutions with far fewer resources. The rich get richer.

Currently the NCAA generally only makes football, basketball, men's hockey and baseball players sit out a year when they transfer, while the so-called one-time exception has been available to athletes in all other sports allowing them to play immediately. In my opinion, making the rule standard across all sports is a good thing (either all should sit out a year or all get to play immediately). And even with the sit out rule players have always transferred. However, before the portal opened up it was much harder for players to get the word out that they wanted to transfer, but once it was created it made it much easier. And some of the transfers have been by athletes on P5 teams who haven't gotten a chance to play regularly, while, as you state, some have been from smaller schools to P5 schools (or other "big" schools in their sport). Yes, the 'big" schools may get a few players that they overlooked originally, but they may also lose a few players on their own team they are overlooking. As for "disposing" of underperformers, that has also been going on for a long time. In the past they were replaced by freshmen, but now they can be replaced by more experienced players.

I personally think players being able to transfer without sitting out is a good thing, as there are many reasons why a player may want to do so. Maybe they wanted to get into one school, but were rejected by admissions (this has happened at BU a number of times that I know of). Instead they go to their second choice school, but now if they get good grades it may be possible to then transfer to their original choice. Others may want to transfer to what they consider a better school, or that has a better reputation. A BU poster put down a Michigan Tech degree vs a BU degree (whether or not it's fair). Others may want to transfer to an "easier" school so they don't have to study as hard and can just focus on playing.

Your complaint reminds me of a Bruins fan who complained when Ray Bourque asked to be (and was) traded to a team with a chance of winning the Stanley Cup back in 2000. That fan was adamant that a player should not be able to request/demand a trade, but that a team had the right (and even an obligation) to trade players in an effort to make a run at winning the Stanley Cup. I was unable to get this person to see the unfairness of his view and that the players also deserved rights.

And don't get me started with the new reality motivating some (not all) athletes to play for the name on the back of the sweater instead of the name on the front.

Again, this is nothing new in college sports, let alone professional sports. Top football players sit out bowl games so as not to get hurt and/or hurt their presumed draft position. Other athletes leave school early for pro contracts. BU had this problem a decade ago: some players left for greener pastures that they never found, while others left and found what they were looking for. At least now those players may stay in college and continue to work towards a degree while showcasing their talent in front of college hockey fans, if not those of their original school. I also don't believe it's binary choice that you either play for the name on the front of the jersey or the back of the jersey.

Also annoying is the fact that the very people who are pushing athlete rights completely discount, ignore, and dismiss as irrelevant the value of the underlying scholarship (currently north of $65K/yr at my undergrad school). There are unintended consequences to all of this "liberation" and that is the athletes who don't have a legitimate degree to fall back on if they don't get drafted, don't get signed as a free agent, don't make the cut at the next level, and thus never make the "big money."

There are more than a few once-famous college athletes who ended up selling shoes or driving delivery trucks when the dream didn't materialize. It's a scandal and almost nobody cares.

I do agree that most of those pushing for athlete rights ignore the value of a scholarship. I've been tracking attendance costs for the private schools with DI hockey and the costs are in the $50-$70 thousand range for most of them (18 of 21). However, many athletes don't get full rides, as scholarships are split up. Of the 28 public schools with DI hockey from 2010-20 an average of 25 players per team a year received aid from 17.85 scholarships. For 2020 Ohio State awarded a total of 410.49 scholarships among 733 athletes, although for men's basketball it was 13 for 13, women's basketball was 15.5 for 16 and football was 85 for 99.

I'm not sure why you think it's a scandal. Again, this has been the case for a long time and it's not just athletes who don't get degrees. A quick search shows that the six-year graduation rate for 4 year schools is in the 55%-60% range nationally. In fact, most athletes do get degrees, even if some of them are not "legitimate."

As for caring, lI don't see it as a sandal and I already said I not care.

Sean

 

[Bill]

Ashton Calder, Lake State's leading scorer, is transferring to North Dakota.

 

[DavidNardolillo]

The larger programs have always been able to recruit the older players also, and no doubt many of those would jump at the opportunity. It takes little skill for the coaching staffs of larger schools to evaluate such players. All they have to do is convince the potential players that they should attend their school as opposed to another mega-school.

I agree, but I think it is still hard for big program coaches to pass up the chance to have high NHL draft picks on your team, even if only for a year or two. The experience of UMass getting Makar to stay for a second year was a difference-maker. Even though he wasn't around when the ultimate goal was achieved, just getting that extra year from him and getting to the championship game undoubtedly created additional momentum for the project.

Of course, some small programs struck gold by taking risk on young or undersized players that other programs undervalued and/or had asked to play juniors first. Shane Gostisbehere at Union, who was a true freshman directly out of boarding school, springs to mind. He should have won the Hobey Baker the year Union won the NCAAs.

 

[DavidNardolillo]

I do agree that most of those pushing for athlete rights ignore the value of a scholarship.

I agree with your analysis but I also think the main "athlete rights" arguments are reactions to aspects of basketball and football that aren't broadly in play with hockey--such as massive TV revenue and significant interference with academic studies due to team commitments and travel. Those features can certainly affect one's perception of scholarship value.

 

[J.D.]

He should have won the Hobey Baker the year Union won the NCAAs.

Over Gaudreau? No.

 

[Lemonade]

Ashton Calder, Lake State's leading scorer, is transferring to North Dakota.

ND will be carrying 50 players at this rate.

 

[DavidNardolillo]

Over Gaudreau? No.

My hot take for the day! Your mileage may vary; I have no problem with that. Gaudreau was superb at BC, but Union doesn't win the National Championship without Gostisbehere. I'm undoubtedly biased from watching him confound RPI in person for several season and one of my alma maters in the championship game. The minutes he logged combined with his exceptional skating and puck handling skills allowed him to dictate the tempo of the games. A remarkable season.

 

[DavidNardolillo]

ND will be carrying 50 players at this rate.

I wonder if there will be another wave of players into the portal as the transfers are confirmed and other players are told they are not needed. Already a ton of players in there, so maybe not, and I assume some players will just hang up the skates and not use the remaining eligibility.

 

[Siouxfaninseattle]

ND will be carrying 50 players at this rate.

UND lost 12 players after last season - 8 seniors, 3 early departures to the pros and 1 to the transfer portal. They have picked up 5 players from the portal. I think they will be a tad short of 50 players.

 

[The Sicatoka]

UND lost 12 players after last season - 8 seniors, 3 early departures to the pros and 1 to the transfer portal. They have picked up 5 players from the portal. I think they will be a tad short of 50 players.

Correct.

UND has a roster that (as was noted) is down 6 forwards, 4 defense, and 2 goalies.

Getting 2 forwards, 2 defense, and a goalie, from the portal ... so far ... was restoring the early departures and rebalancing the roster (8 seniors is too many for a single class in a normally 26 slot roster). I'm thinking UND is still looking for another goalie.

 

[DavidNardolillo]

Correct.

UND has a roster that (as was noted) is down 6 forwards, 4 defense, and 2 goalies.

Getting 2 forwards, 2 defense, and a goalie, from the portal ... so far ... was restoring the early departures and rebalancing the roster (8 seniors is too many for a single class in a normally 26 slot roster). I'm thinking UND is still looking for another goalie.

Are the UND seniors not using their extra year of eligibility? Or did the coaching staff tell them there would not be a space for them?

 

[The Sicatoka]

Are the UND seniors not using their extra year of eligibility? Or did the coaching staff tell them there would not be a space for them?

Seniors Kawaguchi, Adams, Mismash, Kierstad, Keane all signed pro deals.
Senior Thome portal'd to St. Thomas (his hometown).
Senior Bast is looking for a pro deal. (His brother is an incoming freshman.)
The last senior (Rieger) was the eighth D and has his accountancy degree completed.
Underclassmen Pinto, Bernard-Docker, Scheel all signed pro deals.
One underclassman (sophomore Blaisdell) is in the portal.

UND tends to allow players that are underperforming after sophomore year to pursue other options. (Was that weasel-wordy enough?)

When Thome went to the portal he said he might be back if Scheel went pro. Scheel went pro, but Thome went to St. Thomas anyway. Getting Zach Driscoll in the portal from BSU probably weighed in that. (And losing two and gaining one is why I think UND is still looking for a goalie. The guys in juniors aren't ready, even behind Driscoll.)

The joke on the UND forum is Brad Berry and staff is earning the salary this year.

 

[IronRange]

I wonder if there will be another wave of players into the portal as the transfers are confirmed and other players are told they are not needed. Already a ton of players in there, so maybe not, and I assume some players will just hang up the skates and not use the remaining eligibility.

Heard stories from multiple top D3 schools that their phones are constantly ringing from D1 players in the portal who aren't getting looks.

 

[The Sicatoka]

I can't imagine what's tougher right now:

- being an average senior looking for a landing spot to burn the Covid year
- being an average underclassman looking for a landing spot to get more time
- being an incoming freshman and wondering if you're going to be pushed back a year (for a returning senior)*

*even worse would be to be aged out of juniors

 

[Dan]

There are NCAA sports that have not had transfer penalties for some time and it has not created the storm of transfers we're seeing this year, or in the numbers many fear we'll see in the future. I remain convinced a lot of this will slow down as the extra COVID seasons phase out year over year...

Across all sports were beginning to see more and more recruiting larger DI programs off the rosters of mid-major programs and that IS a problem, IMO. I'm not talking about kids transferring up. I'm talking about coaches scouting other DI rosters and alerting that prospect to a promised opening on their roster...

If we want to limit that problem, then we should punish those responsible not opportunities available to all student-athletes. This is a problem created by the loose morals of the adults in the room - not the kids - and there need to be STRICT punishments for coaches caught encouraging transfers or initiating contact - in any way - w/ players before they enter the portal...

 

[NCAA watcher]

There are NCAA sports that have not had transfer penalties for some time and it has not created the storm of transfers we're seeing this year, or in the numbers many fear we'll see in the future. I remain convinced a lot of this will slow down as the extra COVID seasons phase out year over year...

Across all sports were beginning to see more and more recruiting larger DI programs off the rosters of mid-major programs and that IS a problem, IMO. I'm not talking about kids transferring up. I'm talking about coaches scouting other DI rosters and alerting that prospect to a promised opening on their roster...

If we want to limit that problem, then we should punish those responsible not opportunities available to all student-athletes. This is a problem created by the loose morals of the adults in the room - not the kids - and there need to be STRICT punishments for coaches caught encouraging transfers or initiating contact - in any way - w/ players before they enter the portal...

Well, tortious interference with contract is the exact remedy you are talking about. It prevents a third party from causing the student athlete to breach their contract with the University.

[checks notes]

Oh, the NCAA refuses to commit to contract with the student athletes, and hence there is open game for them, unlike the coaches who have contracts and therefore can't be wooed every off season. Odd that the coaches think its OK to get guarantees, but the NCAA says student athletes can't be guaranteed a scholarship past that season.

If there's a problem in the NCAA, you can usually trace it back to the NCAA rules trying to screw over the student athletes.