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The "I Can't Believe There's No Abortion Thread" Part Deux: Electric Boogaloo

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Handyman said:
Compromise is why we are great. Being closer to center is what stopped us from failing like The Europans always do. The pendulum swings both ways. You can talk up the Labour Party all you want let's not forget that England had Thatcher in charge in our lifetime as well. For as bad as we treat lgbtq+ I don't think we forced chemical castration on them like England did for years. Extremes on one end of the spectrum lead to extremes the other way.

And the French sure do have great workers rights...of course that is offset by them giving handjobs to every fascist strongman to ever exist. Oh and their far lefties threatened to fuck Macron and put a full on Nazi in power just for the lulz so no offense but fuck them.

Our way is slow and methodical and frustrating as fuck...and it worked until one party decided they hated being part of it. Progress was slow but it happened.

No country or system is was or will be perfect. When people are engaged I will take ours. YMMV
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There’s always been 1/3 of the country that’s hated being part of the system. Problem is we can’t get rid of that 1/3 with our system and they’re always going to be dragging us down.

Kepler is correct in that they are a cancer. Problem is it takes a 3/4 vote for chemo and they have 1/3 of the vote. Now they’ve metastasized, are destroying us and we can do nothing to get rid of them short of blowing the whole thing up.
 
Oh I will take their work life over ours every day. But their antisemitism is way more fatal so there is that as well.

Americans hate jews...Europeans slaughter them. THROUGHOUT HISTORY!
 
Handyman said:
Oh I will take their work life over ours every day. But their antisemitism is way more fatal so there is that as well.

Americans hate jews...Europeans slaughter them. THROUGHOUT HISTORY!
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Not what I’m talking about.


Let’s put it this way: If the Democrats hold the House and somehow get a Senate majority where Manchin and Sinema are irrelevant what does that realistically do? Another two years of holding the Nazis at bay?

Let’s say they’re able to enlarge the Supreme Court and pass a new Voting Rights Act, that’s ten years maybe?

To actually push this country forward and make those changes permanent requires amendments, and that’s near impossible for the left to do while the right is mere inches away from enshrining everything they want permanently.

The Nazis haven’t broken the system, they’re using it for it’s intended purpose.
 
Jimjamesak said:
I’d actually say America’s biggest problem is it never pushes forward hard enough, at least on the left wing side.

The French may hate everyone else in the world including themselves but their left wing parties enacted the best worker protections in the world.

The British may long for the “sun never sets” days but when the Labour Party goes into power they have no problem ramming through their policies.

Everything in America is always a compromise and it’s always kept us from achieving something great. The Constitution, Reconstruction, the “Progressive era”, the New Deal, all full of compromises meant to keep conservatives from being too upset.

Yeah, other countries suck for various reasons. America sucks because we built our system to make sure we suck no matter what happens.
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Totally disagree. We started sucking when we made it impossible for people to compromise and work with each other. In the past we had opposites who compromised to get change done. I cannot understand why people can't figure out that trying to ram proposals thru that are considered radical on an issue. IT DOES NOT WORK WELL. We do much better when we change things incrementally with a plan to continually chip away at it.

The Dems don't get stuff done because they are not blind followers. They debate, argue and don't agree. The GOP decrees what is acceptable and those in the Party do what they are told. They don't debate, compromise or think of the consequences other than to know that the Koch brothers will field a candidate to decimate their next bid for office.

Before the requirement to blindly follow everyone debated and they managed to find some acceptable routes to compromise. You give me this, I will bend on that. Now they get all the grift but are only beholden to the lobbyists- not each other. No way to consider what the majority of the constituents or country wants. They need to be extreme to make it out of the primary.
 
Jimjamesak said:
Not what I’m talking about.


Let’s put it this way: If the Democrats hold the House and somehow get a Senate majority where Manchin and Sinema are irrelevant what does that realistically do? Another two years of holding the Nazis at bay?

Let’s say they’re able to enlarge the Supreme Court and pass a new Voting Rights Act, that’s ten years maybe?

To actually push this country forward and make those changes permanent requires amendments, and that’s near impossible for the left to do while the right is mere inches away from enshrining everything they want permanently.

The Nazis haven’t broken the system, they’re using it for it’s intended purpose.
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I was responding to DGFs comment not yours.
 
leswp1 said:
Totally disagree. We started sucking when we made it impossible for people to compromise and work with each other. In the past we had opposites who compromised to get change done. I cannot understand why people can't figure out that trying to ram proposals thru that are considered radical on an issue. IT DOES NOT WORK WELL. We do much better when we change things incrementally with a plan to continually chip away at it.

The Dems don't get stuff done because they are not blind followers. They debate, argue and don't agree. The GOP decrees what is acceptable and those in the Party do what they are told. They don't debate, compromise or think of the consequences other than to know that the Koch brothers will field a candidate to decimate their next bid for office.

Before the requirement to blindly follow everyone debated and they managed to find some acceptable routes to compromise. You give me this, I will bend on that. Now they get all the grift but are only beholden to the lobbyists- not each other. No way to consider what the majority of the constituents or country wants. They need to be extreme to make it out of the primary.
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Pushing through radical proposals got us things like Social Security and the Nineteenth Amendment. Compromise got us things like the Affordable Care Act and Taft-Hartley.

Compromise is fine on mundane things like appropriations and the day to day stuff, it’s the major things that need a “fuck you we’re doing it this way” attitude. At some point you need to stop debating, stop arguing and just fucking do.

The problem is our system allows too much power to the minority and it has too many loopholes that allow the minority to exploit that power to their own benefit.

It’d be nice for this country to have an election where we could actually have the will of the people be fully expressed for once.
 
Jimjamesak said:
Pushing through radical proposals got us things like Social Security and the Nineteenth Amendment. Compromise got us things like the Affordable Care Act and Taft-Hartley.

Compromise is fine on mundane things like appropriations and the day to day stuff, it’s the major things that need a “fuck you we’re doing it this way” attitude. At some point you need to stop debating, stop arguing and just fucking do.

The problem is our system allows too much power to the minority and it has too many loopholes that allow the minority to exploit that power to their own benefit.

It’d be nice for this country to have an election where we could actually have the will of the people be fully expressed for once.
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I would agree with some of this. In the past there was a capability to cram things thru while still managing to compromise on other things. At this point all we have is a spitting match- the ACA was horrible but one of the major reasons for failure was the GOP ability to completely block funding, implementation and enforcement of many things when they got the majority.

I honestly don't see this form of govt being successful again unless we have some huge disaster that kills off a majority of the current blind followers (which ever side they are on). The inability and or refusal to think is like a cancer.
 
leswp1 said:
Totally disagree. We started sucking when we made it impossible for people to compromise and work with each other.
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"We" didn't do that. The GOP went Nazi and you cannot "work with" Nazis you unless you become Nazi Lite.
 
Kansas continues its slow climb back from the abyss of 10 years ago, soundly rejecting a constitutional amendment that would've opened the door to banning abortion. The state Supreme Court had found the state constitution guaranteed the right.

The GOP backers intentionally put it on primary day, thinking lower turnout would help them. Oops. The amendment drove turnout, with nearly 20% more votes on that question than the combined gubernatorial primary races.
 
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How binding is this? I know Florida voters chose to restore voting rights to felons and state won’t implement as designed; also know some states refuse to expand Medicaid even after voters voted for it
 
Deutsche Gopher Fan said:
How binding is this? I know Florida voters chose to restore voting rights to felons and state won’t implement as designed; also know some states refuse to expand Medicaid even after voters voted for it
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The vote was to ban it was because the state Supreme Court said the right to abortion is in the state constitution. So pretty binding.
 
Yeah not much recourse. The GQP screwed up just like they did in Minnesota with Gay Marriage.
 
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