I always thought 1974 was really bad. +7 on 8/23, -7 and 3rd place on 10/2.
And one final post mortem - both the Red Sox and the Washington Nationals finished in 3rd place.
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And one final post mortem - both the Red Sox and the Washington Nationals finished in 3rd place.
hockeyplayer1015
Capt
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
Honest, related question. How do you guys stack this collapse up against the Yankees also epic fail in 2004 ALCS? I'm having a pretty tough time figuring out which is worse.
Honest, related question. How do you guys stack this collapse up against the Yankees also epic fail in 2004 ALCS? I'm having a pretty tough time figuring out which is worse.
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
Oh, I think the Yankees epic fail was worse. And I don't mean that to be a wiseass, honestly. If the Sox had beaten NY in the ALCS in regular fashion (you know, 4 games to 2, no extra inning games, etc), yet still erasing the curse, etc. to go to the World Series, it wouldn't have been an epic fail on the Yankees part. They were up 3 games to nothing, including a severe 19-8 (was that the final of game 3?) beating, were winning Game 4 when the world shifted a little. It was one thing to lose that game, but then they lost the rest. For a chance to go to the World Series. This collapse was bad, but that failure was Red Sox-like. And I think that's what made it worse for Yankees fans. That's just me of course. What is your perspective?
Oh, I think the Yankees epic fail was worse. And I don't mean that to be a wiseass, honestly. If the Sox had beaten NY in the ALCS in regular fashion (you know, 4 games to 2, no extra inning games, etc), yet still erasing the curse, etc. to go to the World Series, it wouldn't have been an epic fail on the Yankees part. They were up 3 games to nothing, including a severe 19-8 (was that the final of game 3?) beating, were winning Game 4 when the world shifted a little. It was one thing to lose that game, but then they lost the rest. For a chance to go to the World Series. This collapse was bad, but that failure was Red Sox-like. And I think that's what made it worse for Yankees fans. That's just me of course. What is your perspective?
hockeyplayer1015
Capt
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
I think I agree with you in that 2004 was worse, however I'm also seeing it the other way too. 2004 essentially ended up being a 4 game losing streak. Yes, it had the WS berth on the line, against your main rival, etc... but it ends up being a 4 game losing streak. Boston in this collapse went something like 7-20 for September. However, I do feel that this year's collapse isn't quite as bad as 2004.
It is certainly an interesting debate, and something I'm surprised hasn't really come up yet on the hated 4 letter sports network.
I think I agree with you in that 2004 was worse, however I'm also seeing it the other way too. 2004 essentially ended up being a 4 game losing streak. Yes, it had the WS berth on the line, against your main rival, etc... but it ends up being a 4 game losing streak. Boston in this collapse went something like 7-20 for September. However, I do feel that this year's collapse isn't quite as bad as 2004.
It is certainly an interesting debate, and something I'm surprised hasn't really come up yet on the hated 4 letter sports network.
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
This was worse than '78 I think (although I don't remember that season) but not as bad as the Yanks 2004 collapse. The stakes were far higher in 2004 and that had never happened before in history. Had the Sox won and made the playoffs they most likely would have gotten crushed anyway so really they put themselves out of their misery earlier this year.
I read that in '78 the Yankees played like .800 ball at the end of the year or something ridiculous like that. In contrast the Rays should have blown by the Sox earlier than the last day of the season but had some trouble (with the Yanks) along the way.
This was worse than '78 I think (although I don't remember that season) but not as bad as the Yanks 2004 collapse. The stakes were far higher in 2004 and that had never happened before in history. Had the Sox won and made the playoffs they most likely would have gotten crushed anyway so really they put themselves out of their misery earlier this year.
I read that in '78 the Yankees played like .800 ball at the end of the year or something ridiculous like that. In contrast the Rays should have blown by the Sox earlier than the last day of the season but had some trouble (with the Yanks) along the way.
Kepler
Cornell Big Red
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
Absolutely. The Yankee collapse is in a league of its own.
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
One factor that impacts our FAIL is that it wasn't just 5-6 days where we got caught up in a little miracle. The Yanks collapsed, don't get me wrong, and they got crushed in game 7, didn't even make a show of it.
The sox had 30 days to win one more stinkin game and they couldn't...they didn't get stung by the eventual WS champs, they lost to one of the worst teams in baseball multiple times over the last 3 series...they had multiple chances to change the mojo, multiple chances to put it away..they got smoked by the Rays, at home, in a series that could have ended it weeks ago. And they played .800 baseball for 4 months...they were easily the 2nd best team in baseball for the year, they weren't lucky to be at the top and suddenly hit midnight...they were the best and just ****ed it away.
So, from a 3-0 standpoint, sure the Yankees fell further, but the Sox collapse might have been worse.
Step away from the open window
One factor that impacts our FAIL is that it wasn't just 5-6 days where we got caught up in a little miracle. The Yanks collapsed, don't get me wrong, and they got crushed in game 7, didn't even make a show of it.
The sox had 30 days to win one more stinkin game and they couldn't...they didn't get stung by the eventual WS champs, they lost to one of the worst teams in baseball multiple times over the last 3 series...they had multiple chances to change the mojo, multiple chances to put it away..they got smoked by the Rays, at home, in a series that could have ended it weeks ago. And they played .800 baseball for 4 months...they were easily the 2nd best team in baseball for the year, they weren't lucky to be at the top and suddenly hit midnight...they were the best and just ****ed it away.
So, from a 3-0 standpoint, sure the Yankees fell further, but the Sox collapse might have been worse.
Step away from the open window
P
Priceless
Guest
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
Adrian Gonzalez lets us know who is really at fault for the epic collapse.
Finally! An athlete that isn't afraid to praise God when they win and blame God when they lose!
Adrian Gonzalez lets us know who is really at fault for the epic collapse.
Finally! An athlete that isn't afraid to praise God when they win and blame God when they lose!
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Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
This. Emphasis mine.
Did you hear Papelbon's interview in the locker room? He was kind of incoherent.
And as for My Red Sox Boyfriend saying it wasn't in God's plan...I believe it was God's plan for this to happen to weed out all the Pink Hats. Maybe they'll go away now.
This. Emphasis mine.
Did you hear Papelbon's interview in the locker room? He was kind of incoherent.
And as for My Red Sox Boyfriend saying it wasn't in God's plan...I believe it was God's plan for this to happen to weed out all the Pink Hats. Maybe they'll go away now.
walrus
Wind up workin' in a gas station
MountieBoyOz
Eater of Worlds
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
So refreshing...
Anyways, do you Sox fans want Theo and Francona gone? How big of a house cleaning do you want?
So refreshing...
Anyways, do you Sox fans want Theo and Francona gone? How big of a house cleaning do you want?
ARM
Fan of chipmunk-like mascots.
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
I was around for '78, and I'd guess that was harder for Red Sox fans because a) it involved losing a final game to the Yanks; b) the team that profited was the NYY; c) it happened at Fenway; d) the Sox were still living under "The Curse."
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
I wouldn't.
Drew shouldn't be back. Lackey can go although I don't know the cost implications of that. Other than that, unless theo and Tito simply can't work together I bring them back; ditto for Wake and Paps. sure people want to respond harshly...after a week and viewed in context of who would be better for the jobs...i wouldn't bring in a new GM or manager.
I think we need at least one sub that is crazy, and one relief pitcher that talks to the rosin bag, not a bunch of low key guys.
I wouldn't.
Drew shouldn't be back. Lackey can go although I don't know the cost implications of that. Other than that, unless theo and Tito simply can't work together I bring them back; ditto for Wake and Paps. sure people want to respond harshly...after a week and viewed in context of who would be better for the jobs...i wouldn't bring in a new GM or manager.
I think we need at least one sub that is crazy, and one relief pitcher that talks to the rosin bag, not a bunch of low key guys.
P
Priceless
Guest
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
Theo needs to get Scott Cashman drunk and offer John Lackey for a bag of batting practice baseballs.
Theo needs to get Scott Cashman drunk and offer John Lackey for a bag of batting practice baseballs.
mookie1995
there's a good buck in that racket.
the yankee collapse of losing four straight to allow the sox to advance to the ws was the most epic fail of all time. luckily for bc football fans it happened here, removing the "worst collapse that happened in new england" from them for the reg season ending defeat they suffered vs syracuse, 17-43. if bc had beaten, AT HOME, that pathetic team they would have made their only BCS game in their final big east season. instead they choked away that chance.
P
Priceless
Guest
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
Games 6 and 7 of that collapse were in New York
The Red Sox need to get more from the rotation. Players with 4 or more starts/Players with 24+ starts:
Boston 9/3
Tampa 7/4
Yankees 6/5
Detroit 6/4
Texas 5/5
Arizona 9/4
Milwaukee 6/5
Phillies 7/3
St Louis 6/4
The Red Sox also received 23 starts from Wakefield, who started the season in the bullpen. The losses of Buchholz and Dice-K really hurt. Say what you will about Dice-K, but he averaged 25 starts and 146 IP coming into this season. They were #1 in almost every offensive category, but 28th in quality starts.
Get rid of Lackey, use JD's $14M to find a 4/5 starter and hope Crawford and Gonzalez start living up to those contracts.
the yankee collapse of losing four straight to allow the sox to advance to the ws was the most epic fail of all time. luckily for bc football fans it happened here, removing the "worst collapse that happened in new england" from them for the reg season ending defeat they suffered vs syracuse, 17-43. if bc had beaten, AT HOME, that pathetic team they would have made their only BCS game in their final big east season. instead they choked away that chance.
Games 6 and 7 of that collapse were in New York
The Red Sox need to get more from the rotation. Players with 4 or more starts/Players with 24+ starts:
Boston 9/3
Tampa 7/4
Yankees 6/5
Detroit 6/4
Texas 5/5
Arizona 9/4
Milwaukee 6/5
Phillies 7/3
St Louis 6/4
The Red Sox also received 23 starts from Wakefield, who started the season in the bullpen. The losses of Buchholz and Dice-K really hurt. Say what you will about Dice-K, but he averaged 25 starts and 146 IP coming into this season. They were #1 in almost every offensive category, but 28th in quality starts.
Get rid of Lackey, use JD's $14M to find a 4/5 starter and hope Crawford and Gonzalez start living up to those contracts.
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
Francona reportedly gone?
Not sure I agree, if it indeed the truth.
Priceless, agree with you totally about Crawford, but Gonzalez had a pretty decent season. I know he more or less disappeared in September, but he was a boa fide MVP candidate for a good portion of the season. And I'm not just saying that because he's My Red Sox Boyfriend.
Francona reportedly gone?
Not sure I agree, if it indeed the truth.
Priceless, agree with you totally about Crawford, but Gonzalez had a pretty decent season. I know he more or less disappeared in September, but he was a boa fide MVP candidate for a good portion of the season. And I'm not just saying that because he's My Red Sox Boyfriend.
P
Priceless
Guest
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
We'll have to see what God has in the cards for Gonzalez. I have a real problem with a guy who is supposed to be a leader dropping it in God's lap. By his reasoning, you can be fat, lazy bums who play like dog turds and if it's part of "God's Plan" for you to win, you will; on the other hand, you can give 100%, play spotless baseball and if God decides you're going to lose anyway, there's nothing you can do about it. Maybe he should sacrifice a lamb or something to placate the Almighty.
As for Tito, I seriously wonder if he really wants to be the manager of this team. In many cases the players are just interested in collecting their paycheck and then making excuses when they suck (did John Lackey ever once say he pitched a bad game?) plus his health isn't stellar.
We'll have to see what God has in the cards for Gonzalez. I have a real problem with a guy who is supposed to be a leader dropping it in God's lap. By his reasoning, you can be fat, lazy bums who play like dog turds and if it's part of "God's Plan" for you to win, you will; on the other hand, you can give 100%, play spotless baseball and if God decides you're going to lose anyway, there's nothing you can do about it. Maybe he should sacrifice a lamb or something to placate the Almighty.
As for Tito, I seriously wonder if he really wants to be the manager of this team. In many cases the players are just interested in collecting their paycheck and then making excuses when they suck (did John Lackey ever once say he pitched a bad game?) plus his health isn't stellar.
Re: The 2011 Boston Red Sox: This Space for Rent
If Tito wanted/wants out, can't blame him. Good luck to him.
If Theo wanted to keep Tito, but was overruled by John Henry...that's BS. John Henry should not be making managerial decisions.
Theo should be gone. Problem is, I can't see John Henry ever getting rid of his boyfriend.
If Tito wanted/wants out, can't blame him. Good luck to him.
If Theo wanted to keep Tito, but was overruled by John Henry...that's BS. John Henry should not be making managerial decisions.
Theo should be gone. Problem is, I can't see John Henry ever getting rid of his boyfriend.