The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

[Bakunin]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

They voted for that crap? Nice ****ing country. Geeeeeesh.

Considering that it has no chance of passing the Senate, I don't give a flying **** about it. This is what the House is known for doing: lots of legislative masturbation for the sake of their hardcore supporters while knowing full well the Senate won't swallow what's produced.

And if the left is truly that worried about the government not funding abortion for the poor, they can form a charitable organization that offers to fund them. Soros alone could subsidize them with his pocket change.

 

[leswp1]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Considering that it has no chance of passing the Senate, I don't give a flying **** about it. This is what the House is known for doing: lots of legislative masturbation for the sake of their hardcore supporters while knowing full well the Senate won't swallow what's produced.

And if the left is truly that worried about the government not funding abortion for the poor, they can form a charitable organization that offers to fund them. Soros alone could subsidize them with his pocket change.

Even tho the House is like watching a bunch of teenagers who have no sense of consequence, doesn't it freak you out a bit that they are actually adults that have this type of reasoning and logic?

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Even tho the House is like watching a bunch of teenagers who have no sense of consequence, doesn't it freak you out a bit that they are actually adults that have this type of reasoning and logic?

 

[Rover]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

I'm not sure I get the politics here. This would be swell if the 2004 electorate was the one going to the polls in 2012. The enthusiasm is for economic issues, not social conservative ones. Maybe its my left wing take on things, but I don't think running on a platform of "its not rape if the woman was drugged" is a winner. Furthermore, with all Republicans voting for this bill, and 60+ of them sitting in Obama won districts, this is a really odd vote for those people. Much like the Ryan plan, they're now on record supporting it. I'm not sure why The Boner even let it come up for a vote.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Considering that it has no chance of passing the Senate, I don't give a flying **** about it. This is what the House is known for doing: lots of legislative masturbation for the sake of their hardcore supporters while knowing full well the Senate won't swallow what's produced.

And if the left is truly that worried about the government not funding abortion for the poor, they can form a charitable organization that offers to fund them. Soros alone could subsidize them with his pocket change.

Yeah, you're right but that's not the part that bothers me. It's the redefinition that bugs me.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

I'm just grateful he wasn't trying to pick up dudes in Minneapolis bathrooms.

Me too. I go to those.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

BTW, where'd you get this? It sums up exactly what I've been trying (unsuccessfully) to articulate (poorly) for years.

 

[bronconick]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

BTW, where'd you get this? It sums up exactly what I've been trying (unsuccessfully) to articulate (poorly) for years.

Stole it from Fark. Not sure who made it there.

 

[Bakunin]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Even tho the House is like watching a bunch of teenagers who have no sense of consequence, doesn't it freak you out a bit that they are actually adults that have this type of reasoning and logic?

Not at all. The mistake you're making is to think any of this has anything to do with reasoning and logic. It's about heartfelt beliefs. If you believe sufficiently in your cause, no amount of reasoning or logic is going to dissuade you from pursuing your agenda, no matter how damaging it might actually be.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Not at all. The mistake you're making is to think any of this has anything to do with reasoning and logic. It's about heartfelt beliefs. If you believe sufficiently in your cause, no amount of reasoning or logic is going to dissuade you from pursuing your agenda, no matter how damaging it might actually be.

I think you're wrong if you're ascribing this to Congress. Politicians (well, their staffs -- the Members themselves are just hairdos) have the cold-hearted logic of machines. They don't believe anything; they're polling and pandering. And the stupidity of the masses isn't their beliefs -- by definition everybody's basic foundation is emotional, not logical. The mass ignorance is their falling for the politicians' BS. Look at the people who fall for Palin's carefully calculated persona precisely because they think it's real. Once you can fake sincerity you can fake anything.

 

[Priceless]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Where are all the Usual Suspects to tell us what a principled stand it was for Republicans, or to show us how many jobs are going to be created by this misogyny.

 

[Bakunin]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

I think you're wrong if you're ascribing this to Congress.

I should've been clearer - I was ascribing it to the ideologues that vote these clowns into office, i.e. the single issue voters. The House is simply throwing this constituency some red meat, knowing there isn't a snowball's chance in hell of it passing.

And the stupidity of the masses isn't their beliefs -- by definition everybody's basic foundation is emotional, not logical.

I'd say it is their beliefs, at least on the hard right / hard left. With people on those two ends of the spectrum, there is no compromise. And since these are the people driving the caucuses and primaries, the people who are ultimately elected reflect their lunacy and also don't seem to know the meaning of the "c" word.

The mass ignorance is their falling for the politicians' BS. Look at the people who fall for Palin's carefully calculated persona precisely because they think it's real. Once you can fake sincerity you can fake anything.

As far as I can tell, only the hard right supports her right now, and I suspect there's very little "falling for it" going on there. Whether or not Palin believes anything she says is meaningless - as long as she does the things the right wing of the party wants her to do upon getting elected. Crafted persona or not, I think she'd probably do just that, and it has nothing to do with whether or not I think she's sincere.

I just hope if she's elected, there's a sex scandal (and sex tape).

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

As far as I can tell, only the hard right supports her right now, and I suspect there's very little "falling for it" going on there.

I would love to believe this, but months of listening to the hard core TPers at my office has convinced me she's got them completely fooled. Not whether she's "smart" or "dumb" -- that's always just the issue of where you stand depending on where you sit. The thing that's amazing about Saint Sarah is her total unscrupulousness combined with her constant invocation of personal victimhood. Al Sharpton isn't any less surreal whether he's smart or dumb -- that's missing the point.

No doubt there are plenty of cool heads in the RNC who are doing the usual cost:benefit calculation of "culture wars" and other tactics. But the rank and file Palinites are not making calculations like that. They may not even be true believers in ideas, but they have honest belief in her. That's why they are so stung and so emotional when anybody challenges her basic grasp of, well, everything. That's them feeling personally attacked. For them, "she" has become "me."

When Paul is criticized there's a lot of unreasoning ideological reaction because his supporters identify with his ideas, but even at their worst those people can still keep a separation between themselves and Paul. That was true of Reagan, too. There's no such critical distance with Palin's supporters. They are much more like the Dubya supporters. Every attack on Palin is an attack on them, personally. That (and her obvious lack of ability) is what's dangerous about her -- she's unfalsiable in their eyes. She actually has what principled righties always feared Obama would create: not a party, but a cult.

It would be funny if she weren't electable but anybody who can win a nomination is electable in an environment where a doorpost starts with 45% of the electorate for either R or D. All it takes is a crisis at the wrong moment.

 

[Priceless]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Happy Anniversary!

(Debt free? )

 

[joecct]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Happy Anniversary!

(Debt free? )

The debt is free.. Haven't you been reading the news????

 

[Tundra]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

As far as I can tell, only the hard right supports her right now, and I suspect there's very little "falling for it" going on there. Whether or not Palin believes anything she says is meaningless - as long as she does the things the right wing of the party wants her to do upon getting elected. Crafted persona or not, I think she'd probably do just that, and it has nothing to do with whether or not I think she's sincere.

I just hope if she's elected, there's a sex scandal (and sex tape).

I didn't vote for Palin for Governor nor VP (seemed a bit flaky) but I think I might vote for her as president or other public office. She might actually take on big corporations instead of pandering to them if history is any guide.

Simple reason: she raised oil royalty taxes (extra $2billion/yr revenue), she tried to build NG pipeline (blocked sideways by Exxon/conoco) under AGIA (Alaska Gas Inducement Act).

Not sure if her position has changed regarding oil (corporations) taxes (subsidy) toward Republican pandering to businesses but if she got that fire and brimstone for banks and oil companies... well she got my vote.

 

[Priceless]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Not sure if her position has changed regarding oil (corporations) taxes (subsidy) toward Republican pandering to businesses but if she got that fire and brimstone for banks and oil companies... well she got my vote.

Are you kidding? Who do you think is paying for this <del>campaign trip</del> vacation?

 

[Bakunin]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

The thing that's amazing about Saint Sarah is her total unscrupulousness combined with her constant invocation of personal victimhood. Al Sharpton isn't any less surreal whether he's smart or dumb -- that's missing the point.

Being an attractive woman makes that very easy for her to do, though.

They may not even be true believers in ideas, but they have honest belief in her. That's why they are so stung and so emotional when anybody challenges her basic grasp of, well, everything. That's them feeling personally attacked. For them, "she" has become "me."

I think it's idea/belief alignment combined with speaking style and her gender. If a candidate talks somewhat like you, claims your core beliefs, *and* is a good-looking woman, then it's instantly personal. For the male supporters, it'd be a bit like an overprotective boyfriend. For the women, it's probably tied to the fact she's a mother / has a family.

When Paul is criticized there's a lot of unreasoning ideological reaction because his supporters identify with his ideas, but even at their worst those people can still keep a separation between themselves and Paul. That was true of Reagan, too.

Probably because they're guys, and guys generally don't need anyone else to protect them.

That (and her obvious lack of ability) is what's dangerous about her -- she's unfalsiable in their eyes. She actually has what principled righties always feared Obama would create: not a party, but a cult.

Obama is too much like a professor to become that. If he had Clinton's personal charm, then it'd be possible.

It would be funny if she weren't electable but anybody who can win a nomination is electable in an environment where a doorpost starts with 45% of the electorate for either R or D. All it takes is a crisis at the wrong moment.

Given the faltering recovery, I don't know if we even need a crisis anymore. Rising inflation and unemployment? All we need is an oil embargo, and we're right back to the 1970s - only with nicer technology.

 

[XYZ]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

I think you're wrong if you're ascribing this to Congress. Politicians (well, their staffs -- the Members themselves are just hairdos) have the cold-hearted logic of machines. They don't believe anything; they're polling and pandering. And the stupidity of the masses isn't their beliefs -- by definition everybody's basic foundation is emotional, not logical. The mass ignorance is their falling for the politicians' BS. Look at the people who fall for Palin's carefully calculated persona precisely because they think it's real. Once you can fake sincerity you can fake anything.

I know you've mentioned that your wife is/was in the mix up there on the Hill. Based on hers and/or general perceptions up there is there anyone who is considered the real deal?

 

[Tundra]

Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Are you kidding? Who do you think is paying for this <del>campaign trip</del> vacation?

No I'm not kidding. I've an inkling of what she'll do from 2-3 years of governorship up here. I don't (didn't) like her social views but she'll at least entertain tax hikes (repeal of subsidies) and actually implement them.

Obama said all the right things (for me), and he hasn't done jack *&#$ on any of the it. on the tax and economics (banks, subsidy). So there is no point in trusting someone with "intelligence" "education" and "charisma" like Nobama.

Maybe someone like Palin with "less intelligence" "less education" and "no charisma" will get some crap done, especially raising taxes to balance the budget. At least she had the balls to take on the corporate juggernaut up here and she might be stupid enough to take on the banks, oil companies, corporations and congress.