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The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

  • Thread starter Thread starter Priceless
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Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Rover said:
Kep, the Dem campaign for the House is already written, and its called the "Ryan Plan". Never in a hundred years should all of them have voted for turning Medicare into a voucher program. The average voter isn't going to care about the nuances of that plan, nor do they have the attention span to grasp abstract concepts like a country's debt limit. For once in their lives, they can boil their campaign down to one simple slogan: The GOP tried to screw seniors. All 60+ Republicans running in Obama won districts are going to have to answer for that as well as GOP nominee Michelle Bachmann!!!
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The average voter can't tie his shoes, let alone remember a failed vote 18 months before the general election. You're dreaming.

The Repubs already tried to paint it as Obama and the Dems endangering Medicare, and you know their loyalists will buy that because it fits in with the whole "death panel" narrative.

I'd try to run on it, of course, every little bit helps, but given all the dust that's already kicked up, I doubt it is a game changer. You are forgetting the Timely Manufactured Outrage that will get all the pundit attention that we haven't even heard of as of this date. Did you know Obama sacrifices Christian babies in a secret Muslim altar located beneath the Lincoln Memorial? The author of the Constitution*, D. W. Griffith, warned us about this in The Birth of a Nation, which starred Ronald Reagan.

(* The Declaration of Independence was, of course, brought down from Stone Mountain in Georgia by Moses.)
 
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Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Handyman said:
Obama should put his plan up for vote, and when it gets defeated Talking Point #1 is "Why are the Republicans going to destroy the world economy?"
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That's why the plan won't come up for a vote. Obama can't schedule a vote in the House, that's up to Boner. No way he's going to let this see the light of day.
 
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Priceless said:
That's why the plan won't come up for a vote. Obama can't schedule a vote in the House, that's up to Boner. No way he's going to let this see the light of day.
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There's no time on his docket with all their jobs bills.
 
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Kepler said:
The average voter can't tie his shoes, let alone remember a failed vote 18 months before the general election. You're dreaming.

The Repubs already tried to paint it as Obama and the Dems endangering Medicare, and you know their loyalists will buy that because it fits in with the whole "death panel" narrative.

I'd try to run on it, of course, every little bit helps, but given all the dust that's already kicked up, I doubt it is a game changer. You are forgetting the Timely Manufactured Outrage that will get all the pundit attention that we haven't even heard of as of this date. Did you know Obama sacrifices Christian babies in a secret Muslim altar located beneath the Lincoln Memorial? The author of the Constitution*, D. W. Griffith, warned us about this in The Birth of a Nation, which starred Ronald Reagan.

(* The Declaration of Independence was, of course, brought down from Stone Mountain in Georgia by Moses.)
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Kep, the electorate that shows up in 2012 isn't the same one that showed up in 2010. Now that does not guarantee a victory, but you're operating under a Rovean assumption that whoever the GOP candidate is will have the ability to maximize turnout amongst his or her supporters while not scaring the voters in the middle. I'm curious who you think that is, because if you write back "Romney" or "Bachmann" I'm going to break out in laughter right in the middle of the office.
 
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Rover said:
Kep, the electorate that shows up in 2012 isn't the same one that showed up in 2010. Now that does not guarantee a victory, but you're operating under a Rovean assumption that whoever the GOP candidate is will have the ability to maximize turnout amongst his or her supporters while not scaring the voters in the middle. I'm curious who you think that is, because if you write back "Romney" or "Bachmann" I'm going to break out in laughter right in the middle of the office.
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I don't think the electorate that shows up in 2012 will be the same as the one from 2008, either. Agreeing the GOP has no strong presidential candidate, they won't need one to make gains in both chambers because (S) the Dems defend far more seats in the Senate, and (H) the GOP controls more state legislatures and will be able to gerrymander more effectively for House seats.

Positive effects for Obama: he should be able to campaign rings around whatever doorstop the GOP nominates, he is now the best-qualified guy in the country to be president, and racism is today's cigarette smoking: hemorrhaging market share because is isn't replacing its dying customers with enough young ones.

Negative effects for Obama: incumbency during rotten times means you get blamed, governing from the center (at times, center-right) has meant a lot of the air going out of the netroots and liberal bag, the country is no longer exhausted by a criminal sitting GOP administration, and McCain won't be the opponent.

That seems to be a push and an Obama re-election by about the same margins as 2008. None of the positives helps Congressional Dems much if at all, though.
 
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Rover said:
Kep, the electorate that shows up in 2012 isn't the same one that showed up in 2010. Now that does not guarantee a victory, but you're operating under a Rovean assumption that whoever the GOP candidate is will have the ability to maximize turnout amongst his or her supporters while not scaring the voters in the middle. I'm curious who you think that is, because if you write back "Romney" or "Bachmann" I'm going to break out in laughter right in the middle of the office.
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You'd be underestimating Bachmann by a longshot. But, with Perry and Palin itching to get in she has little shot at the nomination.
 
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Kepler said:
This is a hostage situation and your family is the hostage. Holding fast in that situation is not "having the stones," it's risking the unthinkable. The guy with the knife is either a criminal or insane, but the first thing to do is get that knife away from your child's throat. Are you really going to stand there and cooly say, "game theory states that I should not give in to your demands"? Because if you're going to do that, you've seen too many Bruce Willis movies and you're a lousy parent.

Get the hostage free. There will be time to get the knife away from the guy later. You might even get lucky and he'll use it on himself.
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Sorry but your analogy sucks. You go by the premise that if we put forth crap today it will turn into sunshine at some later date. When has that happened? I will give you a clue, it never happens. Pass a bad bill, stave off the default and then in 2 years we are right back here with different people arguing over the same problems. It is a stall tactic, it is like the trap in hockey it just extends the game it never actually does much to try and win it.

Shoot the hostage...fix the problem it is the only solution. You can talk about your kids all you want to but this isnt that, this is the future of the GOD ****ED WORLD ECONOMY...if your kid sliced their wrist you gonna put a band aid on it? If they swallowed poison you gonna give them a Sprite to settle their stomach? If so, then it is you who are the bad parent. That is where we are at...raising the debt ceiling and taking a deal that in truth does nothing to solve any of the problems is so stupid only a Democrat would actually accept it.

Yippie Kay Aye Mutha****er!
 
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Handyman said:
Sorry but your analogy sucks. You go by the premise that if we put forth crap today it will turn into sunshine at some later date. When has that happened? I will give you a clue, it never happens. Pass a bad bill, stave off the default and then in 2 years we are right back here with different people arguing over the same problems. It is a stall tactic, it is like the trap in hockey it just extends the game it never actually does much to try and win it.

Shoot the hostage...fix the problem it is the only solution. You can talk about your kids all you want to but this isnt that, this is the future of the GOD ****ED WORLD ECONOMY...if your kid sliced their wrist you gonna put a band aid on it? If they swallowed poison you gonna give them a Sprite to settle their stomach? If so, then it is you who are the bad parent. That is where we are at...raising the debt ceiling and taking a deal that in truth does nothing to solve any of the problems is so stupid only a Democrat would actually accept it.

Yippie Kay Aye Mutha****er!
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Two movie references (Speed and Die Hard) in one post. Awesome.
 
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Rover said:
Kep, the electorate that shows up in 2012 isn't the same one that showed up in 2010. Now that does not guarantee a victory, but you're operating under a Rovean assumption that whoever the GOP candidate is will have the ability to maximize turnout amongst his or her supporters while not scaring the voters in the middle. I'm curious who you think that is, because if you write back "Romney" or "Bachmann" I'm going to break out in laughter right in the middle of the office.
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Kep believes every voter is stupid. Once you accept that you understand his point. His point is wrong mind you, but at least you understand it. He believes that Joe Schmo is a moron and cant be trusted to vote whether they live in rural Arkansas or New York City. He is what GOPers would call, elitist ;) :p

And Rover the point of my previous post is that bad deals are not the answer here. This is the end of the line. Have you ever been bankrupt? I grew up sadly straddling that line and there is a point where you cant extend things anymore. No amount of talking to banks or creditors, no amount of minimum payments and ducking phone calls will make the problem go away. Sooner or later you either fix the problem or you declare bankruptcy. The Republicans know the Dems dont have the stones to let things crater (unlike the GOP who would in a heartbeat) so they will do what they always do, circle the wagons, put forth a cruddy deal that helps no one and changes nothing and then force the Dems to sign it so they cant be blamed. It is like playing cards with a guy who has no idea how to play and has little cash, you just lean on them and they will fall over everytime.

There is no time to delay on this, the only way to fix this is to raise taxes and cut spending. Not one or the other, but both. Any deal that involves extending the Bush Tax cuts makes hypocrits out of anyone who railed against them. Hey funny, that includes Kepler ;) Thankfully he is smarter than the average Joe Schmo voter though :p
 
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

ScoobyDoo said:
Two movie references (Speed and Die Hard) in one post. Awesome.
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:)

I know I am just one of the uneducated masses of voters but I shure due no me a good catchphraze wen I here 1!!!!!
 
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

Handyman said:
There is no time to delay on this, the only way to fix this is to raise taxes and cut spending. Not one or the other, but both.
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I agree, and that's why I believe we will extend the Bush Tax Cuts, have no increase in revenue of any kind, and slash entitlement programs. Cause the LEFT will cave. They always do.
 
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

unofan said:
Not everyone, just most.

Approximately 50% of the population has below average intelligence. And average ain't exactly great...
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Average believes in the new definition of rich. Job Creator. It's actually kind of funny. The right ran on jobs, not on tax cuts, and yet by redefining the definition of rich to job creator they get to rail on about tax cuts and have the average masses believing it is a jobs bill. Brilliant.
 
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

ScoobyDoo said:
I agree, and that's why I believe we will extend the Bush Tax Cuts, have no increase in revenue of any kind, and slash entitlement programs. Cause the LEFT will cave. They always do.
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Well we are wrong...and apparently you are a horrible parent! ;) Kepler and Rover say the deal is a good one...and they are like way smarter than us so we best agree. Time to become a mindless drone. [robot voice] The Dems are always right, they can do no wrong. Left wing politics never screws anything up and all Right wingers are neanderthals [/robot voice]

unofan,

I can accept 50%...Kepler believes they all are. Every post where he talks about the voters drips with his belief that he is not only smarter than all of us, but that anyone who votes (especially against what he believes, but overall in general too) has an IQ of around 80.
 
Re: The 112th Congress: Debt ceiling edition

ScoobyDoo said:
Average believes in the new definition of rich. Job Creator. It's actually kind of funny. The right ran on jobs, not on tax cuts, and yet by redefining the definition of rich to job creator they get to rail on about tax cuts and have the average masses believing it is a jobs bill. Brilliant.
Click to expand...

I'm looking forward to the next edition of JobCreatorie JobCreator.

Richie+Rich.jpg
 
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