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Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

Okay, going tonight at 9:30...one small ask of J.J. Pretty please with sugar on top have Darth Sidious say “I’m back *****es!!!” Followed up with telling the pitiful resistance band to: https://youtu.be/rOcYpzmmkG0
 
Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

WARNING: SPOILERS INCOMING!!

So I am of two minds for this film. On the one hand as someone that HATED TLJ I love that they basically gave that film the middle finger. It is blatantly obvious this was where the story was supposed to end up in JJs mind and Rian Johnson sidetracked that by trying to subvert expectations and deconstruct the story. This film matches The Force Awakens and is the narrative conclusion to all of those stories. It is also weighed down by having to tell a portion of the story that TLJ never got around to.

On the other hand, because TLJ exists it might have been better if they had just finished the trilogy off his way instead of making the first half of this film a proto "Episode 8.5". There is too much going on, too many stories that come out of nowhere, some that disappear and too many payoffs that dont quite land because there just wasnt enough care put into the relationships of the characters. The entire "Poe/Finn/Rey" dynamic was uber forced because they have spent almost no time together on screen. It felt incomplete...hell I still dont even see the purpose of those characters all they do is yell, fly around and call each other "buddy". Finn especially is just a wasted opportunity. That he is "Force Sensitive" could have been a cool story to explore...instead he just kind of hints at it and we move on. Poe being a spice runner...yeah shut up you arent Han Solo.

Now with all of that said the movie is "satisfying" in that it finishes its story and it cleans up a TON of messes. In my mind it does a better job subverting expectations (especially Rey and Kylo) than TLJ ever could hope to. Kylo/Ben was 10000000 times better in this film than TLJ. (his redemption I REALLY dug especially cause it gave the finger to the Reylo crap) Luke was done so much better in his brief scene than he was in all of his story in TLJ. (he also basically apologizes for how bad he was in that film which I found funny) The Emperor was ok, mainly because his story comes out of nowhere. TLJ should have set him up. The opening scene of this film should have been the closing scene of the last film. Kylo should have left after Rey helped the "Rebellion" escape and found the Emperor. They didnt do that...so his whole story was rushed to high heaven. Leia's story was ****ed near perfect (including her training flashback) and the cameo I didnt have spoiled (my guess the one you loved the most Scooby) really made the last 1/3 of the film a joy. Rey's story finally stopped sucking too because her lineage finally makes sense. Having her be a Palpatine is WAY better than having her be a Skywalker or Kenobi. This story is more simplistic, but in being simplistic it is a way better narrative.

The Rey and Kylo fights were great and when they are using the force on the ship in the desert that was friggin sweet! When Ben fights the Knights of Ren that was also very cool. The final space battle was also fun though kind of wasted. At least I dont have to riot though as the Ewoks got a cameo ;)

Ultimately though I look back at this trilogy as a missed opportunity. It was one movie away from being epic. If they had let Rian make some other film and had JJ (or someone like him) make a more "Star Warsy" type Episode 8 this ending would have made the saga complete and above reproach. As it is the series is OK with moments of brilliance and mind numbing stupidity. Disney obviously had no plan for this trilogy which is fine...but the problem is like almost everything Star Wars related they do it just doesnt feel right and almost feels like they are just throwing darts at an idea board and hoping to find a direction. And I dont buy for 1 second this is the end of the saga BTW...they had her change her name for a reason.

I give the first half of the film a 5 because it just is so bloated and convoluted there is no room to breathe. Every second of film has some piece of exposition trying to give part of the story Episode 8 never gave us. The film almost collapses under the weight of it. Once Chewie gets captured though things settle to a good pace and the film gets good. Second half gets an 8.5. Overall I would give it a solid 7...

Since I dont pay I might see it again and see if it flows better once you know what is and is not important ;)
 
Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

WARNING: SPOILERS

Yes, Handy, the best part of the entire film was Leia. Leia being a Jedi. Leia having a Light Saber. As for the other parts you mentioned.

Ben's Redemption? Boring. Darth Vader all over again. Nothing new, nothing exciting.
Rey being a Palpatine? Boring. Luke Skywalker all over again.

1. It was way more interesting when Rey was nobody. It opened up a whole world of possibilities going forward.
2. Ben staying Evil was way more interesting than redemption. It would have meant that there are consequences going to the Dark Side. How interesting it was going to be was only heightened by how torn he seemed.
3. Palpatine is the villain? I think I was bored to tears. 8 worked so hard to eliminate this whole idea that all Force Users are either Sith or Jedi. And, Abrams put the whole thing right back into the box.

All the thought provoking things that had happened in episode 8 are gone. The one new thing Abrams did was with Leia. That was fun and worth the price of the movie for me but it's not enough to get me to watch it again. It goes in the Endgame, GOT pile. Lazy, uncreative writing for the finish.
 
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Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

Eh, I went with low expectations and I enjoyed it more than episode 8.
 
Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

ScoobyDoo said:
WARNING: SPOILERS

Yes, Handy, the best part of the entire film was Leia. Leia being a Jedi. Leia having a Light Saber. As for the other parts you mentioned.

Ben's Redemption? Boring. Darth Vader all over again. Nothing new, nothing exciting.
Rey being a Palpatine? Boring. Luke Skywalker all over again.

1. It was way more interesting when Rey was nobody. It opened up a whole world of possibilities going forward.
2. Ben staying Evil was way more interesting than redemption. It would have meant that there are consequences going to the Dark Side. How interesting it was going to be was only heightened by how torn he seemed.
3. Palpatine is the villain? I think I was bored to tears. 8 worked so hard to eliminate this whole idea that all Force Users are either Sith or Jedi. And, Abrams put the whole thing right back into the box.

All the thought provoking things that had happened in episode 8 are gone. The one new thing Abrams did was with Leia. That was fun and worth the price of the movie for me but it's not enough to get me to watch it again. It goes in the Endgame, GOT pile. Lazy, uncreative writing for the finish.
Click to expand...

Actually I thought the return of Han would be your fave part. (whited out cause I dont want to completely spoil everything) That was easily mine. Leia training had me geek out though.

I never thought any of the stuff in Episode 8 was thought provoking...I thought it was just dumb. Hell half of it didnt even make narrative sense. Rey being nobody didnt leave anything open...she was basically worthless. She has to have some lineage otherwise she is just another stupid Jesus allegory. We already had that...

Kylo being redeemed would have been boring had it been done like Vader but the way they did it in this film was better. He was never fully evil that was set up right away in TFA. Hell he killed his father in hopes that would push him past his conflicts but it couldnt. There were consequences, his fate was sealed. (live as evil or die as a hero) His ending was more in character with how he was introduced than the "Shirtless Wonder" in Episode 8.

I am not a fan of the return of Palpatine (they did that in the LEGENDS canon that Di$ney discarded because...reasons) for many reasons...but it made more sense than what Rian did to Snoke. No SW movie since ROTJ has figured out the Big Bad correctly. Kylo was never set up as a character to be that...especially with "connection" he had with Rey. You cant have an all evil badass who has little shirtless Skype sessions with his bae in the Rebellion ;)

This movie is far from perfect (hence the 7) but it could have been way worse. It just sucks it could have been WAY better too. But Di$ney will make a billion so no one will care. And then in 5-7 years we will get Episode X: Return of Rey cause they just cant help themselves.
 
Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

Whew! Spoilers ahead so please skip this post if you have not seen the movie!.........














I loved it! Not a perfect movie and does not crack into my top 3 of Empire, Star Wars and Rogue One.

What I loved:
Leia’s Arc/end. Beautiful. Incredibly poignant with her calling to Ben just as he’s about to destroy Rey and then her calling to Rey just after Rey stabbed Ren. With the limited amount of footage they had to work with this is astounding.

Ren’s arc. I loved Ren breaking the rule of 2 and killing Snoke and I loved how infantile he was in TFA yet dangerous and on the verge of being out of control (it’s the acting and interpretation that should have been Anakin). But he was underserved by losing to Rey (a novice) twice. This time he defeats Ray only to have Leia stop him from killing her. His dismantling of the Knights Of Ren was badas as well. There was more to be mined in his character and I wish it would have happened but if the 3 movies this one was his best imo.

Rey...what can you say? Dumb fanboys called her a Mary Sue. Being a Palpatine explains in one swift stroke of the pen why she’s inately ungodly powerful. And unlike Anakin and Ben and even Luke to a degree she has no anger management issues or whiny breakdowns. She’s a pure force for good like Yoda was and never waivers from that.

Also: she was the chosen one all along.
It was initially supposed to be ANakin but he failed and Yoda said “a prophecy that was misread could have been”...well, he was right.
How ironic the chosen one was the granddaughter of a sith legend.

No dumb droid humor. No 3po “i’m Beside myself.” No bb8 piloting an At-ST. The droid stuff was all very tasteful.

Han Solo flashback or memory or whatever.

Ren and Rey ****ing on Rian Johnson’s dumbass lightsaber over the shoulder joke. Ren threw his into the ocean after his transformation from Kylo to Ben. Gasp!!! Hey Rian, that’s Meaningful. He’s letting the past go also which is hilarious. Touché J.J.

Rey throws hers away only for Luke to come in and provide the adult talk.

Palpatine. I mean c’mon! Did you really think Vader could kill him after palpatine spent so much time trying to figure out how to cheat death?

Drawbacks:
Why the **** did Ben Solo have to die? That was lame.

Not enough Luke.

Not enough Lando.

Rey dubbing herself Skywalker = ultra lame.

Quick .02 after first viewing. More to follow when I have a chance to digest more.
 
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Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

She is still a Mary Sue...but that was more because of how badly TLJ handled her story. The entire "New Best Friends" were mishandled to the point of ridiculousness. No one worse than Finn though...Black man cant even catch a break in a galaxy far far away ;)
 
Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

My review from Thursday

Despite going social media silent this week I did hear a few comments about the final (for now) movie of the Skywalker saga. Lots of grumbling. Lots of people whining “It ruined my childhood!” I don't understand that. This could have been Manos: Hands of Fate levels of bad and it wouldn't change my memories. Going to Return of the Jedi on opening night and getting stuck in the front row. Let me tell you, when you're nine years old and staring up at a seemingly 50' tall Darth Vader, the movie goes from kid-friendly science-fiction fantasy to terrifying horror in a flash. I still have my memories of the mass of humanity lined up outside the theater in 1999 before The Phantom Menace. Of watching an adorable little girl cosplaying as Jyn Erso running up to every Princess Leia she could find to give her the Death Star plans. Of taking my nephew to The Last Jedi then surprising him with tickets to Star Wars Celebration next summer in Anaheim. Of countless hours spent discussing, listening to and watching the films, TV series, books and video games. Those memories are still intact but I was prepared for the worst tonight.

I needn't have worried. I understand that people are not going to be happy with the way it played out. They aren't going to be satisfied with some of the story elements. The truth is this has been built up so much that there was simply no way to stick the landing to everyone's satisfaction. We just saw that with the final season of Game of Thrones. Even Endgame was disliked by 10% of the audience and got a 78 on metacritic. I thought this was an exciting end to the trilogy of trilogies. To discuss it too much would give away spoilers and I don't want to do that. Suffice to say, I was pleased with the unique spin put on the story, with the old favorites we saw again and the way it was all weaved together. Was it hokey and forced in places? Sure. That's Star Wars. This isn't Shakespeare or Homer or Hawthorne. Remember that it was Han Solo himself who once described the Force as a “hokey religion.” Let's be honest, if Empire Strikes Back came out today, there is a 0% chance people would accept a movie about a guy doing gymnastics in a swamp with a talking Muppet in his backpack.

I was entertained by the film. It didn't ruin my childhood or my love for the franchise. I'm sorry if that doesn't apply to you. I give this film an 8/10 and look forward to many future viewings.

Also of note: I won Star Wars trivia at the theater tonight.
Click to expand...

A few notes:

There will be more movies. In fact, the next one is set to be released on 16 December, 2022. It will not be the Skywalker saga; it will be either the first of Rian Johnson's trilogy or a film from a new director. Or something else... (see below)

The Skywalker saga is done. For now. Remember that it was over in 1983 and 2005 as well. I expect Disney will do Episodes X, XI and XII in a decade or so. Calling it early: Finn is a Jedi.

"Kenobi" is not the next Star Wars show coming to Disney+. The unnamed Rogue One prequel will begin filming next year and air in 2021. Then "Kenobi" is likely in 2022, perhaps timed just before the release of the next film (like "The Mandalorian" and Rise of Skywalker this year).

A second season of "The Mandalorian" has already been announced but no date has been confirmed. Disney executive Alan Horne said before the streaming service started that if the show was a success the TV show might spawn a movie. So maybe the 2022 film will be a "Mandalorian" spin-off. Prepare for Baby Yoda: The Movie

After two viewings of RoS, my current rankings:

The Empire Strikes Back 9.5
A New Hope 9.25
The Force Awakens 9
Rise of Skywalker 8
Return of the Jedi 8
The Last Jedi 7 (8.5 if the Canto Bight sequence was edited out)
Revenge of the Sith 6.5
Attack of the Clones 5.5
The Phantom Menace 5
I am counting the theatrical release of the original trilogy films. Han fires first, Jabba isn't seen until Jedi and Vader doesn't turn into a whiny biotch at the end. Download Harmy's DeSpecialized Editions and treat yourself.
 
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Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

I dont think the "next Trilogy" happens. Even if it does I dont see Johnson doing it. I have a feeling since Disney+ is now a thing and Baby Yoda and his Band of Friends is a popular show they will stick to that and put movies on hold...especially if this ends up underperforming. (which it looks like it will mostly because of overseas)

Then again that would be the smart decision...and Di$ney has shown they wont do that when it comes to this franchise so they will probably try and put a movie out next December ;)

and yes the Skywalker Saga is not done. As Dr. Manhattan said:

<img src="https://i.redd.it/chd7rfinkn541.jpg" />

(whoever made that gets an A+)
 
Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

It's too bad because of IX fails critically and at the box office it won't be because it's deserved it will be because VIII killed the franchise.
 
Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

My new rankings (until I have a chance at a 2nd viewing)

5
4
3.5
9
6
7
3
1, 2, 8
 
Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

So when Ren became Ben, not only did he throw his light saber into the water, the scar on his face disappeared. My wife noticed that immediately.

Also, there are FAR to many open questions to have this be the "last movie"- it's the end of the Sith line, for sure. They are done and gone.

But.

Fenn was trying to tell Rey something for the entire story, but never did. There's a big story there.

Fenn has some force in him. Which explains why he was able to use a light saber two movies ago. There's a story there.

The other former storm troopers have a story, and it appears that they are going to tie it to Lando- which was pretty obvious at the end.

The fighter pilot dude has some open questions- which woman is he attached to- the old days or the new days?

And the very end- Rey Skywalker?

The one thing that I REALLY hate about JJ's movies is how he blatantly copies scenes from other movies- and this time a direct lift of the final battle with the emperor showing Luke/Rey that the battle is going against them trying to bait them into hate and converting to the dark side. Have some originality, dude. You almost even copied over the dialog.

Way to many open questions for this to be the last Star Wars ever. Let alone the NAME of the movie- the RISE of Skywalker? Rise? You can't end a series with a rise and no follow up.
 
Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

alfablue said:
So when Ren became Ben, not only did he throw his light saber into the water, the scar on his face disappeared. My wife noticed that immediately.

Also, there are FAR to many open questions to have this be the "last movie"- it's the end of the Sith line, for sure. They are done and gone.

But.

Fenn was trying to tell Rey something for the entire story, but never did. There's a big story there.

Fenn has some force in him. Which explains why he was able to use a light saber two movies ago. There's a story there.

The other former storm troopers have a story, and it appears that they are going to tie it to Lando- which was pretty obvious at the end.

The fighter pilot dude has some open questions- which woman is he attached to- the old days or the new days?

And the very end- Rey Skywalker?

The one thing that I REALLY hate about JJ's movies is how he blatantly copies scenes from other movies- and this time a direct lift of the final battle with the emperor showing Luke/Rey that the battle is going against them trying to bait them into hate and converting to the dark side. Have some originality, dude. You almost even copied over the dialog.

Way to many open questions for this to be the last Star Wars ever. Let alone the NAME of the movie- the RISE of Skywalker? Rise? You can't end a series with a rise and no follow up.
Click to expand...

It's over. Maybe a book will come out and answer your questions.
 
Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

ScoobyDoo said:
It's over. Maybe a book will come out and answer your questions.
Click to expand...

You are delusional if you really, honestly, think this is the last Star Wars movie. We have read more than one interview that leaves the option open for further movies.

Sith is over, so the 3x Trilogy is done. Sure.

But I can't see greedy Disney leaving all of those potential movies, promo tools, rides, and figurines on the table. And books will never sell like movies in terms of extra stuff.
 
Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

alfablue said:
You are delusional if you really, honestly, think this is the last Star Wars movie. We have read more than one interview that leaves the option open for further movies.

Sith is over, so the 3x Trilogy is done. Sure.

But I can't see greedy Disney leaving all of those potential movies, promo tools, rides, and figurines on the table. And books will never sell like movies in terms of extra stuff.
Click to expand...

The Skywalker saga and these characters are done. And Sith is over? LOL. Sith were over in Episode 8 and JJ brought them back. As far as I can tell Sith and Jedi are forever now.
 
Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

Disney already has December releases for 2020 and 2021 promised to big name directors. Even if it wanted to do a new Star Wars film the box office calendar doesn't work. The Mouse didn't move Mary Poppins for Solo, it isn't about to displace Spielberg (West Side Story) or Cameron (Avatar 2). Disney has numerous Star Wars projects in development already, it is only a question of which one gets greenlit for 2022. The Rian Johnson trilogy, Knights of the Old Republic, Baby Yoda/Mandalorian spin-off. The Kevin Feige film is also a possibility. Let him get his feet wet in the Star Wars universe before (speculation) he takes over LucasFilm when Kathleen Kennedy retires (/speculation). Disney also has Star Wars releases in December 2024 and 2026 (trading off with the Avatar sequels). Disney would need a powerful reason to change that schedule.

As for box office, Disney isn't too concerned. RoS will cross a billion and make the studio a profit. The real money comes in merchandise and the resorts. Even with Endgame, Lion King, Aladdin, Frozen II, Star Wars etc the studio will "only" record about $6 billion in revenue, about $2 billion in actual profit. The parks alone generate an annual profit of $25-27 billion. The difference between RoS making $1.2 and 1.4 billion may be a big deal to movie fans but to the bean counters it is a rounding error.
 
Re: Star Wars IX: rumors, spoilers beware!!!

I didn't HATE episode 8 like a lot of people did, but I didn't like it either. Count me in as part of the group that thinks a lot of 8 shouldn't have happened, and should have been replaced with a good chunk of the first hour of 9.
 
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