Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

[giwan]

With that kind of talk... Is there a chance of downsizing to division 2 or some other de-emphasis of sports? I mean, it seems they're "hurting"... Just looking for the general picture.

If EMU is unwilling to downsize their sports juggernaut how can you justify any other school to do so. Granted no hockey at EMU but they recently were made a mockery of nationally on HBO Sports

 

[JohnsonsJerseys]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

No plans? "I’m thinking in the next 18 to 24 months, we should have shovels in the ground...."
Source: ASU Devils.com (February, 7, 2016)

In other words, in one to two years they should have a plan on how they will get a rink. Ok, I was mistaken, ASU is at least 4-5 years from having a rink. Two years ago was the time to have a plan,before you started the team. Now was the time to be taking action on that plan.

Oh the butthurt will just never end, will it? So amusing!

The NCHC isn't going to shed either of its Minnesota teams. Both teams were strong all year... neither school would be interested in returning to a struggling WCHA.... DU and UND started the NCHC ... to make them money... woo the schools that are making money for DU and UND....

Oh the arrogance will just never end, will it? So amusing!
Ryan J

 

[manurespreader]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Sigh!

 

[davyd83]

This is a statement that I find just silly. But don't feel bad, you're not the only person here who has posted something similar.

It is this outrage over the "clandestine" way in which DU and UND acted, and how that somehow "created" the problems.

What would have happened if, after the B1G announces they are forming, DU and UND announced they were thinking of forming a new conference on their own with some yet to be named teams? You think all the remaining teams in the CCHA and WCHA would have said, "yeah, let's get together and put together two new conferences?"

B.S.

There would have been screaming. Lawsuits would have been threatened. It would have been chaos. Impossible to get anything productive accomplished.

I find it funny that everyone seems to think its ok for the B1G schools to choose who they want to be in a conference with, it's ok for Michigan and MSU and Notre Dame and Tech and NMU to decide, multiple times, they no longer want to be associated with one group of teams but want to be associated with another group of teams, its ok for a bunch of teams in the old ECAC to decide they wanted to form another new conference entirely and name it Hockey East, but somehow DU and UND screwed up the entirety of college hockey.

Miami was also part of the initial group. Western & St Cloud were not. In fact, they were not even part of the NCHC "Original 6," and St Cloud, just a couple weeks earlier has pledged themselves to a WCHA which would have been a six team loop with 3 Minnesota schools, Tech, NMU & UAA. Once St Cloud snuck out the back door, it left the WCHA with 5 and forced a merger with the remaining CCHA misfit toys.

 

[pbr]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

The constant criticism of what happened to the WCHA and creation of the Big whatever and NCHC is getting old. It's done and there's nothing any one of us can do about it. I miss old rivalries that Tech was a part of, but they're now in a position to succeed and have legitimate conference championship and NCAA tournament aspirations each year. Hopefully that trend continues and best of luck to ASU wherever you land and call your home rink.

 

[Dirty]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Oh the arrogance will just never end, will it? So amusing!
Ryan J

It's not arrogance when it's true.

 

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

The constant criticism of what happened to the WCHA and creation of the Big whatever and NCHC is getting old.

It got old about three fccking years ago.

 

[SiouxFanatic]

It got old about three fccking years ago.

Yep. There are a couple of people who post here that love to continue beating the dead horse though and whenever there is conference talk, they make sure to remind everyone.

 

[SteveO]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

In other words, in one to two years they should have a plan on how they will get a rink. Ok, I was mistaken, ASU is at least 4-5 years from having a rink. Two years ago was the time to have a plan,before you started the team. Now was the time to be taking action on that plan.

Ryan J

Ahh...no, you were mistaken when you made THIS statement:

ASU has no plans

Ryan J

According to ASU's Vice President for University Athletics you are wrong. In regards to you questioning the VPs statement and timetable, you should contact him.

 

[gfmorris]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

According to ASU's Vice President for University Athletics you are wrong. In regards to you questioning the VPs statement and timetable, you should contact him.

UAH had an on-campus hockey arena on the five-year capital plan six years ago, and as I remember it, every other major project on the plan was built. Of course, that was a plan developed by the guy who got fired, who was replaced by the guy who nearly killed our program, so, yolo.

Point is: plans change. Are they less likely to change at a large university like ASU? Yes, but cost is a huge factor (see why UAH hasn't built that rink).

GFM

 

[SJHovey]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

If EMU is unwilling to downsize their sports juggernaut how can you justify any other school to do so. Granted no hockey at EMU but they recently were made a mockery of nationally on HBO Sports

That was a really good segment (in fact, the entire show was good).

Here is an article I saw regarding the cost of college athletics, and basically confirmed what the Real Sports segment conveyed. Two or three dozen programs will make money through their athletics, but over 300 of the 340 or so NCAA member institutions will not.

ASU is not one of the profitable programs. You'll note they've seen substantial increases in their revenue since 2004, but still lost $8.4 million in 2014.

At some point these schools are going to take a hard look at programs, like UND recently did with golf and baseball, and try to stop the bleeding. With tuition and student fees skyrocketing, and student debt reaching impossible levels, something is going to change and the dollars to throw at new hockey rinks is going to disappear.

 

[Sean Pickett]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

That was a really good segment (in fact, the entire show was good).

Here is an article I saw regarding the cost of college athletics, and basically confirmed what the Real Sports segment conveyed. Two or three dozen programs will make money through their athletics, but over 300 of the 340 or so NCAA member institutions will not.

ASU is not one of the profitable programs. You'll note they've seen substantial increases in their revenue since 2004, but still lost $8.4 million in 2014.

At some point these schools are going to take a hard look at programs, like UND recently did with golf and baseball, and try to stop the bleeding. With tuition and student fees skyrocketing, and student debt reaching impossible levels, something is going to change and the dollars to throw at new hockey rinks is going to disappear.

You can look at the NCAA Revenues & Expenses 2004-14 report to see overall and median information for all three DI groups: FBS, FCS and non-football. There are a lot of blanks in the report, but the according to the median values for all sports in all subdivisions (tables 3.11, 4.11 and 5.11) only men's basketball and football in the FBS subdivision make money, while all other sports lose money. And really, isn't that how it is supposed to be? Aren't college athletics supposed to be for the student athlete? Otherwise why not just offer just men's and women's basketball, football and a few other women's sports to offset football?

Sean

 

[St. Clown]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Oh the arrogance will just never end, will it? So amusing!
Ryan J

What arrogance? The WCHA is struggling financially, so it's going to be tough to get any school that has a program with decent success to join the conference until that changes. And those changes have to happen internally before they can even think of finding external (new schools) to help further any sort of league ambition.

 

[JohnsonsJerseys]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

The WCHA is struggling financially...

Any money from league events like conference tourneys that may or may not have been equally shared in the past and no longer exist now is not the league's problem. It's up to the member teams to solve their own budget issues. Too broke to fly? Take a bus. Travel budget stretched thin, hit the road after the game not another night in the hotel.

Even when Tech was a "drain" on the WCHA, as some former members like to claim, Tech spent the money to keep investing in the team / facilities. New seating in the rink, new suites, new HD video board, new ice plant, more money spent on coaches' salaries, etc. Now that they win more than they lose, they're getting their money back on those investments in terms of dollars at the gates and better recruits on the ice. If WCHA programs are so broke as outsiders like to claim... Well, I don't see any of them dropping hockey and getting out of the game...
Ryan J

 

[The Sicatoka]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Aren't college athletics supposed to be for the student athlete?

Pulling on the ol' Devil's Advocate hat (and it fits pretty well):

I thought colleges were to educate 100% of enrolled students, not fund athletics programs for 4% of enrolled students.

Why should the vast majority of students get saddled with rising costs/fees to cover athletics so a few can play games?

 

[St. Clown]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Any money from league events like conference tourneys that may or may not have been equally shared in the past and no longer exist now is not the league's problem. It's up to the member teams to solve their own budget issues. Too broke to fly? Take a bus. Travel budget stretched thin, hit the road after the game not another night in the hotel.

Even when Tech was a "drain" on the WCHA, as some former members like to claim, Tech spent the money to keep investing in the team / facilities. New seating in the rink, new suites, new HD video board, new ice plant, more money spent on coaches' salaries, etc. Now that they win more than they lose, they're getting their money back on those investments in terms of dollars at the gates and better recruits on the ice. If WCHA programs are so broke as outsiders like to claim... Well, I don't see any of them dropping hockey and getting out of the game...
Ryan J

For most of the schools in the WCHA, hockey is their only division 1 sport - the standard around which they rally school spirit and student support. They're not going to drop hockey unless things turn truly dire.

I'm not blasting these schools, or saying that they can't compete with the rest of D1, just that they're in a league that's no longer financially appealing to prospective schools that are in leagues like the NCHC or even the B1G Mistake. I won't pretend to know the financial situation of the eastern conferences with the smaller schools, but those are perhaps the only potential schools the WCHA could target for future needs. Your league is just not likely to woo back SCSU or UMD, and could easily lose Mankato State or even BSU should the NCHC decide to poach them because the NCHC has more potential money to offer due to having schools that simply put more butts in the seats.

 

[Sean Pickett]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Pulling on the ol' Devil's Advocate hat (and it fits pretty well):

I thought colleges were to educate 100% of enrolled students, not fund athletics programs for 4% of enrolled students.

Why should the vast majority of students get saddled with rising costs/fees to cover athletics so a few can play games?

I considered going that route, but I decided not to because I believe that colleges are supposed to do more then just educate.

Sean

 

[davyd83]

Any money from league events like conference tourneys that may or may not have been equally shared in the past and no longer exist now is not the league's problem. It's up to the member teams to solve their own budget issues. Too broke to fly? Take a bus. Travel budget stretched thin, hit the road after the game not another night in the hotel.

Even when Tech was a "drain" on the WCHA, as some former members like to claim, Tech spent the money to keep investing in the team / facilities. New seating in the rink, new suites, new HD video board, new ice plant, more money spent on coaches' salaries, etc. Now that they win more than they lose, they're getting their money back on those investments in terms of dollars at the gates and better recruits on the ice. If WCHA programs are so broke as outsiders like to claim... Well, I don't see any of them dropping hockey and getting out of the game...
Ryan J

Most teams do hit the road after the game on bus trips. Not one team that wasn't flying stayed here after a game. As far as bus vs fly, the five day bus trip to Fairbanks would cost more than the flights. And talk about "bus legs..."

 

[davyd83]

What arrogance? The WCHA is struggling financially, so it's going to be tough to get any school that has a program with decent success to join the conference until that changes. And those changes have to happen internally before they can even think of finding external (new schools) to help further any sort of league ambition.

The WCHA was set to be a pretty solid league with a nice compact footprint. Then there was the school that said, "We're committed to the WCHA!" Which ranks right up there with, "Read my lips. No new taxes," and, "If you like your plan, you can keep your plan, PERIOD."

 

[St. Clown]

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

Re: Sources: Arizona State Hockey Won’t Join Big Ten

The WCHA was set to be a pretty solid league with a nice compact footprint. Then there was the school that said, "We're committed to the WCHA!" Which ranks right up there with, "Read my lips. No new taxes," and, "If you like your plan, you can keep your plan, PERIOD."

Yup, SCSU chased the dollars. Most teams in their situation would have as well. What else were they going to say when they weren't receiving an NCHC invitation, pout about it?