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Shannon Miller out at UMD?

Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

Bottom line here is that any institution that is given federal dollars, needs to also adhere to federal laws. Coach Miller could file (and probably win) lawsuits regarding Title VII, Title IX, and the Equal Pay Act. Much like the Iowa Women's Field Hockey team recently did, Coach Miller's players could also file a Title IX lawsuit
 
Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

CrankIt said:
Bottom line here is that any institution that is given federal dollars, needs to also adhere to federal laws.
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Yes, it does. However, you seem determined to avoid understanding what the federal laws actually say. Deliberate ignorance isn't pretty.

Coach Miller could file (and probably win) lawsuits regarding Title VII, Title IX, and the Equal Pay Act. Much like the Iowa Women's Field Hockey team recently did, Coach Miller's players could also file a Title IX lawsuit
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Anyone can file a lawsuit over pretty much anything, so that doesn't say much. Again, does it not register in your mind that the disparity in coaches' salaries the existed at UMD is mirrored at just about every school in the country in just about every sport where there is a direct comparison between a men's and women's team?
 
Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

CrankIt said:
Coach Miller could file lawsuits regarding Title VII, Title IX, and the Equal Pay Act.
Click to expand...

given all the female coaches in the NCAA, Miller would be about the worst possible client a lawyer could have in that:
1) she is paid MORE than her fellow coaches including the men (in fact the highest paid)
2)again, the fact that her team loses mega bucks while the team she is comparing herself to turns a profit
3) the fact that she offered to work for less money (kinda hard to argue you are being discriminated against because you are paid less, when in fact you asked to be paid less)

and that's not to mention all the personal/personality baggage she carries
 
Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

so it's time to start talking about who will succeed her.

Considering the way she's conducted herself, my guess is that any assistant coach of hers will be on the "thanks for applying, but no thanks" list.

The coach likely hired will be an alumni of UMD, good connections/thought of highly in MN, NCAA coaching experience (it should be recognized by now that coaching experience in Canada counts even less than coaching high school).
 
Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

pokechecker said:
so it's time to start talking about who will succeed her.

Considering the way she's conducted herself, my guess is that any assistant coach of hers will be on the "thanks for applying, but no thanks" list.

The coach likely hired will be an alumni of UMD, good connections/thought of highly in MN, NCAA coaching experience (it should be recognized by now that coaching experience in Canada counts even less than coaching high school).
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I wonder if any UW or UM assistants would considering making a name for themselves and give it a whirl. Obviously these people already know the recruiting trail for top talent and they know what it will take in to win in the WCHA. Downside: They may be on the pricey side and they know how tall an order it is to upend UM and UW, which should be their goal.
 
pokechecker said:
given all the female coaches in the NCAA, Miller would be about the worst possible client a lawyer could have in that:
1) she is paid MORE than her fellow coaches including the men (in fact the highest paid)
Click to expand...

Title IX applies to what coaches at THE SAME INSTITUTION are being paid. So, yes, while she does make more than other women's coaches, she is still paid less than the men's head coach AT UMD.

At the end of the day, this will all play out in the courts and anonymously arguing over the logistics of it via a meaningless message board will do nothing. UMD will end up losing far more money than they thought they would save.
 
Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

pokechecker said:
so it's time to start talking about who will succeed her.
Click to expand...

I'd suspect someone that has an Olympic medal & played D-I hockey, with the preference for at UMD. That is not that big a list, particularly if they add coaching experience to the list, does not have to be D-I but maybe an assistant some place. ANyone wanna hazard a guess?
 
Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

CrankIt said:
Title IX applies to what coaches at THE SAME INSTITUTION are being paid. .
Click to expand...

COOL! So it's OK for every male coach of a women's team to be paid less than the male coach coaching the men's team at the same school, but if it's a female coach than it's not OK! Sounds like gender discrimination to me.

Also pretty cool how she would be holding the school hostage. "We can't not rehire Shannon because she will cost us so much in legal fees, might as well keep her forever!"

Also really cool how she was willing to work for less if they needed to renegotiate her deal, but since they don't want to renew it's 'they really needed to pay her more'!
 
Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

CrankIt said:
Title IX applies to what coaches at THE SAME INSTITUTION are being paid.
Click to expand...

so every coach should be paid the same as the football coach?

I bet there are a lot of coaches wishing that were true.

you cannot compare the coach of the men's team to the women's team. The applicants aren't even the same, just look at the applicants for the two positions,you don't get coaches applying for both positions, so obviously the two positions are different.

Timothy A said:
I wonder if any UW or UM assistants would considering and give it a whirl.
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that's a possibility
on the positive side they do understand what it takes to be successful,
I guess it comes down to if they want to risk leaving a good place and having confidence they have enough experience to be successful

so let's see:
Olympic history of success
alumni
coaching experience at the NCAA level
success as a player
well known
good connections/thought of highly

it's a short list
 
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Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

CrankIt said:
Title IX applies to what coaches at THE SAME INSTITUTION are being paid. So, yes, while she does make more than other women's coaches, she is still paid less than the men's head coach AT UMD.
Click to expand...

This is becoming quite impressive.
 
Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

I don't think an alum is necessary but if you feel the next head coach must be an alum I'm sure Jenny Potter would be happy to leave D3 Trinity. I'm sure she'll be an applicant if she hasn't already contacted the AD directly. Other than that I'd make a phone call to Natalie Darwitz as long as she doesn't bring along any family members to be her assistants. Is Krissy Wendell coaching anywhere? What's Angela Ruggiero up to these days? How about Cammi Granato? Just keep either of the nasty twins away!
 
Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

Maintaining tradition is important. If only Reggie Dunlop were available.
 
Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

ne7minder said:
I'd suspect someone that has an Olympic medal & played D-I hockey, with the preference for at UMD. That is not that big a list, particularly if they add coaching experience to the list, does not have to be D-I but maybe an assistant some place. ANyone wanna hazard a guess?
Click to expand...

Jenny Potter.
 
Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

shelfit said:
Other than that I'd make a phone call to Natalie Darwitz as long as she doesn't bring along any family members to be her assistants.
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That's funny...in a sick sort of way.

Caroline Ouellette strikes me as a possibility if she has any interest. She was an assistant coach under Miller for a couple of years, is highly respected, is an alum and maybe just far enough removed in time from the last few negative years that seem to have started Miller's problems. That is, if she would be interested...she left her assistant coaching position at UMD for Team Canada thereby declaring which was more important to her at the time. But she is now several years older and one would think that her playing career is drawing to a close, so, she may be developing different priorities.

As an aside, one thing that strikes me about some of these long tenured international players regardless of the respect that I have for them for chasing their passion for so long is with middle age starting to loom largely in front of you, when do you decide that enough is enough and start getting on with your life in an attempt to earn some semblance of a decent living after living on crumbs for so long? Maybe some of them think that their extended resume will help when that day comes and for some of them that might be true. Is their putting off that decision partly due to the adulation they receive...sort of like an over the hill boxer that doesn't know when to pull the pin who ultimately gets embarrassed into doing so or worse, has a serious injury forces him out?

I mean we are talking about some serious earning power years that are passing these older players by...at least those with highly marketable degrees. On the other hand a degree in exercise science...well, I don't know.

But circling back to the possibilities, I still think that Schuler would be interested...it would seem to be the best possible situation for her assuming UMD would consider her and not consider her tainted by Miller and, also, if she is not totally put off by UMD. But if she joins Miller's lawsuit then, of course, that would be that for that. Apart from that what better schtick could she have (no pun intended)...it jives perfectly with her stated motives for leaving her head coaching position at NU and what better program could she hope to gain the reins on than one with such a dominating tradition of winning? Also, in light of the fact that it would appear that her highly desired mentoring gig under Miller is now over it could be very attractive to her for all those reasons.
 
Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

It is not going to be Jenny Potter. I'm leaning more toward Shawna Davidson. The administration has made it clear through their lack of support of European players that they want more Americans on the team. With Davidson's current scouting job with USA Hockey, they would fulfill that desire.
 
Re: Shannon Miller out at UMD?

The more this story is covered and expounded on the more and more I find contempt for this person and her situation. She seems to stop at nothing in her attempt to manipulate every avenue from the gender to the gay card. Not to mention how she exploits her players and assistant coaches. If I’m reading between the lines correctly…and I think I am…this is nothing more than about her loss and her feelings of rejection. They are not renewing her contract! Boohoo! How can you not understand and except the parameters around this highly coveted position…with its inherent level of scrutiny and accountability…and here’s a little secret there is no stipulation under Title 9 about equity in paid salaries. I got to believe there is a slight difference in the contracts of the two basketball coaches at any top ten program. The University has nothing to answer to. They employed her for 16 years…supported her hiring of other minority coaches… rewarded her substantially when warranted…etc. They could have gone in any direction when defending their move and would have been justified. Not getting the results expected of a coach of this compensation…her utter disrespect of University personnel, her peers, officials, or most people in general, etc. (after a game I happened to be in ear shot of her as someone walking past her uttered “tough loss coach”… and she quickly dismissed them with a “what would you know”… real classy. She just needs to move on and so should the misguided advocates trying way too hard to find something that is really not there.
 
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