Problems for Ford Field?

[Alton]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

I haven't read every post in this thread - I saw the first post:

Does anyone have a link to anything published besides this forum that the NCAA is considering moving the game from Ford Field?

There are many pros/cons to hosting the event at Ford Field but the premise of the thread was that there may be a change of venue.

Anyone have any evidence?

I have some evidence that this is not being considered.

On September 15, the committee that would have to approve a venue change, the NCAA Division I Championships and Sports Management Cabinet met. The Hockey Committee presented 5 action items to the Cabinet...none of them were about a venue change:

http://web1.ncaa.org/web_files/DI_Champs_Sports_Mgmt_Cab/2009/September/Supp_14_MIH.pdf

No venue change was discussed at the meeting:

http://web1.ncaa.org/web_files/DI_Champs_Sports_Mgmt_Cab/2009/September/Final Report 9-09.pdf

The Cabinet's next meeting is February 15. It seems implausible that they would change the venue in the middle of February.

 

[Rover]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

Really? Those are the only 2 domes you can think of? How about Carrier Dome, RCA Dome, Astrodome, Metrodome, Georgia Dome, Superdome, St. Louis (forgot the name), etc, etc. The NCAA could have it in nothing but domed football stadiums if it wanted to.

bcshater's point I believe is that for a dome stadium to work (with the larger capacity and the hope to avoid a ton of empty seats) you'd have to put it in a centrally located place with a few big schools in the vicinity.

That would leave Metrodome and maybe St. Louis (but I doubt it because few people want to go to St. Louis). New Orleans would also work because its a vacation destination and not hard to get to. Don't know why anybody would want a tournament in Syracuse. Astrodome, Georgia Dome = non-hockey places. Forget where RCA dome is.

 

[bigblue_dl]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

Forget where RCA dome is.

Is that the old dome in Indy? I think it got imploded after LucasOil was built.

 

[bigmrg74]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

bcshater's point I believe is that for a dome stadium to work (with the larger capacity and the hope to avoid a ton of empty seats) you'd have to put it in a centrally located place with a few big schools in the vicinity.

That would leave Metrodome and maybe St. Louis (but I doubt it because few people want to go to St. Louis). New Orleans would also work because its a vacation destination and not hard to get to. Don't know why anybody would want a tournament in Syracuse. Astrodome, Georgia Dome = non-hockey places. Forget where RCA dome is.

Ummm... The RCA dome is no more, Indy build the new Lucas Oil Stadium and tore down the RCA.

There's also Relant Stadium in Houston, and the new Cowboy Stadium in Dallas, Retractable roofs. And the Tropicana Field in Tampa. Last but not least would be the Rogers Center in Toronto, but that's another ball of wax right there.

 

[bigblue_dl]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

University of Phoenix Stadium!! Glendale is an emerging hockey hotbed.

 

[thebrain]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

Ummm... The RCA dome is no more, Indy build the new Lucas Oil Stadium and tore down the RCA.

There's also Relant Stadium in Houston, and the new Cowboy Stadium in Dallas, Retractable roofs. And the Tropicana Field in Tampa. Last but not least would be the Rogers Center in Toronto, but that's another ball of wax right there.

Don't forget....FARGODOME!! Even though it's not really a dome....

At least Tropicana has had hockey played in it...

 

[LynahFan]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

bcshater's point I believe is that for a dome stadium to work (with the larger capacity and the hope to avoid a ton of empty seats) you'd have to put it in a centrally located place with a few big schools in the vicinity.

That would leave Metrodome and maybe St. Louis (but I doubt it because few people want to go to St. Louis). New Orleans would also work because its a vacation destination and not hard to get to. Don't know why anybody would want a tournament in Syracuse. Astrodome, Georgia Dome = non-hockey places. Forget where RCA dome is.

Well, considering the two he mentioned were Dallas and Seattle, I'm not sure how that could have been his point. In any case, Ned Harkness and Ken Dryden disagree that Syracuse is a bad place for an NCAA championship (Onondaga War Memorial, 1967). Not to mention Jack Kelly (BU 1971).

I forgot they'd replaced the "crowd noise" dome with Lucas Oil stadium. I drove past that this summer - not sure if it's really that huge or just that the other Indianapolis downtown buildings are so small, but it looked absolutely enormous. That would certainly be another indoor football stadium that's not too far from some hockey schools (Notre Dame, etc).

 

[Rover]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

Syracuse, Indy, Kansas City, Omaha = Cincinnatti Frozen Four. Boring @ ss cities I don't want to go to for any reason. It amazes me some of the places that get mentioned out here to have the tournament in.

 

[LynahFan]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

Syracuse, Indy, Kansas City, Omaha = Cincinnatti Frozen Four. Boring @ ss cities I don't want to go to for any reason. It amazes me some of the places that get mentioned out here to have the tournament in.

I hope you don't misconstrue that I am in any way, shape, or form in FAVOR of hosting the tourney in those places. Those are places I FEAR they might think of holding the tournament if the FFFF is remotely successful.

 

[NMU8405]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

Syracuse, Indy, Kansas City, Omaha = Cincinnatti Frozen Four. Boring @ ss cities I don't want to go to for any reason. It amazes me some of the places that get mentioned out here to have the tournament in.

Tijuana.

 

[RaceBoarder]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

Just wondering....

I've heard several mentions of the 1996 Cincinnati FF being dull/unsuccessful... I'm curious as to why it's percieved like that... Also, was that bid tied into the Cincinnatti Cylclones (?) hockey team?

This was before my time, so I'm just curious....

 

[dggoddard]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

I have some evidence that this is not being considered.

On September 15, the committee that would have to approve a venue change, the NCAA Division I Championships and Sports Management Cabinet met. The Hockey Committee presented 5 action items to the Cabinet...none of them were about a venue change:

The Cabinet's next meeting is February 15. It seems implausible that they would change the venue in the middle of February.

I don't think your "evidence" proves much one way or the other.

The original post implies that this is a recent development...

I spoke to a reliable source this morning who says that the NCAA is exploring the possibility of moving the FF to Joe Louis Arena. Apparently less than half of the expected demand occurred. Stay tuned.

 

[Alton]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

I don't think your "evidence" prove much one way or the other.

The original post implies that this is a recent development...

I don't think it "proves" anything; I can't prove a negative. It is only what I said--evidence.

So this is more recent than September 15? Fine, but as I said, the committee doesn't meet again until February. If you think they will change venues in February, okay, but it seems unlikely to me. I would also like to see one place where it is documented (other than the original post) that a move is being considered. One person who has knowledge of this speaking out.

I don't claim to know anything one way or another, but I haven't seen any piece of evidence that the original post is correct.

 

[Puck Swami]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

Just wondering....

I've heard several mentions of the 1996 Cincinnati FF being dull/unsuccessful... I'm curious as to why it's percieved like that... Also, was that bid tied into the Cincinnatti Cylclones (?) hockey team?

This was before my time, so I'm just curious....

The Cincinnati experience was panned by many for several reasons. First, the games were held in Riverfront Coliseum, which had not hosted hockey events in a long time prior the FF. The rink boards looked like something out of a garage sale - old, discolored mismatched, and downright rickety. To make matters worse, an incompetent rink staffer drilled the ice in the wrong place and into a pipe, causing a flood of coolant and water to spill out on the ice. Colorado College and Vermont had to play the afternoon game on what some termed a "swamp". The bad conditions neutralized the speed of the favored Catamounts' two stars, Martin St. Louis and Eric Perrin, and helped Colorado College pull off the upset. The ice surface was deemed unplayable by the second game, and it had to be delayed until much later that night when the problem could be somewhat fixed.

Addionally, the City of Cincinnati was also perceived as very lazy about the event, with little of festive touches that fans expect today outside the venue.

All in all, it was the worst Frozen Four in modern memory.

 

[streaker]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

All in all, it was the worst Frozen Four in modern memory.

Except for Michigan fans.

 

[satyking]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

And the restaurants in Cincy all started to close as the first game ended.....we took a converted school bus for $2 each to a Bar-b-que joint in Kentucky to eat, and that was the highlite of the entire stay there......hopefully never again there or at Ohio State or Anaheim

 

[catsfan]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

I don't oppose growth. What's wrong is that they're selling the soul of the game - the things you cited - bands, atmosphere, etc - for a publicity stunt.

They're building baseball stadiums smaller - the new Yankee Stadium is 10% smaller than the old one (52k vs 58k). Why? Because intimacy makes for a better fan experience and ticket scarcity creates buzz.

Any new fans pulled in by this stunt will think college hockey is big and bombastic when its true appeal is in its intimacy and grass-roots feel.

Well said. Also, think about the players who go through their whole career trying to get to the frozen four and the championship game; for most it will be the pinnacle experience of their hockey career, and then to be forced to play the games in a relatively soulless football arena with fans far in the distance. It is unfair to the players, not to mention the typical NC$$ mistreatment of fans.

 

[Rover]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

Just wondering....

I've heard several mentions of the 1996 Cincinnati FF being dull/unsuccessful... I'm curious as to why it's percieved like that... Also, was that bid tied into the Cincinnatti Cylclones (?) hockey team?

This was before my time, so I'm just curious....

Cincy was a horrible, boring experience for a number of reasons....

1) The facility was a run down rat trap. What a dump, just like the whole Riverfront complex. I thought it was going to fall down. Then that pipe exploded causing about a 4 hour delay where you were stuck inside the arena while a few Gomer Pyle's ran around trying to fix the thing.

2) The city is the most lifeless place I've ever seen. It makes Pittsburgh look like South Beach. We walked the entire city from our hotel to the arena, must have been 30 blocks....and there was nothing. Parking lots and nothing else. No bars, not even dives. No restaurants. No where to buy alcohol except a gas station serving cheap beer. I have no idea what people do there for entertainment. Even the neighborhood near the athletic complex was a bunch of fenced off vacant lots with nothing around it. Covington Kentucky across the river had a couple of generic bars on the water. Whoop de do.

3) I have no idea why they bid on the tournament when it seems they couldn't care less that it was going on. In their brilliant one page write up the day of the first game, the paper mentioned long time BC hockey coach Jack Parker for example. It was clear nobody writing for this newsrag even knew about hockey, let alone who was playing. Same could be said for the whole city.

So, to sum up, far and away the absolute rock bottom for a FF experience. Whenever somebody brings up Omaha, Pittsburgh, Buffalo, Albany, Indy, KC, etc etc etc etc - I always think of the @ sshole of the country, Cincy. As Mark Twain once said a century ago, "when the end of the world comes, I want to be in Cincinnatti, because its 20 years behind the times."

 

[slurpees]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

So, to sum up, far and away the absolute rock bottom for a FF experience. Whenever somebody brings up Omaha, Pittsburgh, Buffalo, Albany, Indy, KC, etc etc etc etc - I always think of the @ sshole of the country, Cincy.

At least Pittsburgh is a bona fide sports town with a legitimate love for hockey. The only team anyone has ever cared about in Cincy was the Reds, but they haven't been relevant in years so sports there pretty much suck. Granted so do the Pirates, but they're probably below Pitt football/bball on the totem poll there.

 

[bigblue_dl]

Re: Problems for Ford Field?

The talk about Cincinnati is surprising to me. That FF was before I really followed college hockey too much. But I was in Cincy 2 weeks ago, for the weekend, and it was tons of fun. I stayed at a friend of a friend's apartment about 3 blocks from the arena, and there were several bars within walking distance that we went to, that were actually a lot of fun and a bunch of people around. I wouldn't have a problem going back there for a weekend since it was a pretty **** good time. (not saying that I want the frozen 4 there, but just that my experience with the nightlife was quite positive)