POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

[jerphisch]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

This is a fair criticism. It is to the undying shame of the Democrats that they didn't hold the line on Cheney/Rumsfeld even at the risk of being called cowards and traitors. That was the moment the Dems should have taken one for the team, but very few did. Hillary was among the worst offenders, seeing as she did it in full cognizance of furthering her presidential aspirations.

The Dems should accept full responsibility for helping usher us into this era of blind obedience to an increasingly unrepresentative plutocracy. If you and I can agree on that, maybe there's hope of rolling it back someday.

Except the whole post was about us "surviving" the Bush administration and that we'll survive Trump just the same. Whether or not Dems supported the war doesn't change the fact that it happened. If anything the fact that Dems cowered in the face of being called traitors should make us MORE worried about the next administration, not less.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

Except the whole post was about us "surviving" the Bush administration and that we'll survive Trump just the same. Whether or not Dems supported the war doesn't change the fact that it happened. If anything the fact that Dems cowered in the face of being called traitors should make us MORE worried about the next administration, not less.

I was only addressing the point that the Dems pushed the Patriot Act and the 2002 Congressional Resolution authorizing the use of military force against Iraq over the top. The Democrats (and any Republicans -- I don't think there were any (edit: there were in the House) ) who voted No on those two measure should be honored. That was truly a brave sacrifice in the name of their country. The Republicans who voted Yes to those votes I'm not going to criticize -- their ideology and their partisanship aligned, so why wouldn't they? But the Dems who votes Yes can eat a bag of dicks. Those were the cowards. Those were the colors that ran. F-ck them.

Here are the heros:

Patriot Act

Senate 2000:
Feingold (D-WI)

Senate 2006:
Akaka (D-HI) <-- Dr. Mrs. wrote the position paper outlining the reasons for Akaka's vote! She is my hero.
Bingaman (D-NM)
Byrd (D-WV)
Feingold (D-WI)
Harkin (D-IA)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Murray (D-WA)
Wyden (D-OR)


House 2000: 66
House 2006: 138

2002 Resolution

Senate: 23
House: 133

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

I was only addressing the point that the Dems pushed the Patriot Act and the 2002 Congressional Resolution authorizing the use of military force against Iraq over the top. The Democrats (and any Republicans -- I don't think there were any) who voted No on those two measure should be honored. That was truly a brave sacrifice in the name of their country. The Republicans who voted Yes to those votes I'm not going to criticize -- their ideology and their partisanship aligned, so why wouldn't they? But the Dems who votes Yes can eat a bag of dicks. Those were the cowards. Those were the colors that ran. F-ck them.

Paul Wellstone would've voted no. I think Bernie did. Small number but true Patriots.

 

[SJHovey]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

Well, planet earth survived the ice age too, but frankly, I'd rather not have to live through such extremes just to claim, "we survived it".

We as a country were in a position to do more than "just survive". That ain't gonna happen now. I guess you like starting over again at zero every 4-8 years.

I can't go back beyond the date of my birth. I simply have no personal experience before that date. But this idea that we're all just sitting on a big turd in this country and someone has it the flush lever I find a bit absurd.

Unemployment is running at about 4.5% or so. When I was born, and for a number of years before and after, it was at 5.5%. It obviously fluctuates with events and the economy, but we're doing pretty well right now.

When I was born, the average white person could expect to live to be about 69.5 in this country. For a similar person born today, it's almost 80.

Even with the recession of 8-10 years ago and the massive loss of home ownership in this country, the rate of home ownership is still a few percentage points higher than when I was born.

The percentage of people over the age of 25 who have graduated from high school has more than doubled since the year of my birth. The percentage of people over the age of 25 with college degrees has more than tripled from when I was born.

We are healthier. We are living longer. We are better educated. We are working. More of us own our own homes.

It's not perfect. There is a wealth distribution problem that will have to be addressed. There are some entitlement programs that we need to deal with as we travel through the "boom/bust" population cycles. But jeez, some of you act like the big meteor has been spotted and we have a week.

 

[Patman]

Even Trump supporters should be able to stand behind this statement. Somehow, I don't think they will. Hovey's already shown he won't.

Which part is an attack on democracy... cmon spill it.

Hillary had reams of her dirty laundry aired showing she is what we knew she was... you know it too but you don't give a ****.

As for trump taking the spoils... well, again... who decided to run the most corrupt politician since the 1930s?

Somehow this is all magically trump's problem is hilarious. I think his views on Russia are a problem and if you can evidence collusion in the primaries or the general you have a point... but as for Hillary and the DNC... that was all of their own making. All of it.

None of this changes under your world view of course... IT security and the rest... Russia or china will just pick and choose which thing to vent. So, you're upset about something that won't be resolved without other issues under your own view of what happened.

----

I'll leave this one as is... If working with the Russians to interfere in American election is bad then what does that make Ted Kennedy?

 

[jerphisch]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

I can't go back beyond the date of my birth. I simply have no personal experience before that date. But this idea that we're all just sitting on a big turd in this country and someone has it the flush lever I find a bit absurd.

Unemployment is running at about 4.5% or so. When I was born, and for a number of years before and after, it was at 5.5%. It obviously fluctuates with events and the economy, but we're doing pretty well right now.

When I was born, the average white person could expect to live to be about 69.5 in this country. For a similar person born today, it's almost 80.

Even with the recession of 8-10 years ago and the massive loss of home ownership in this country, the rate of home ownership is still a few percentage points higher than when I was born.

The percentage of people over the age of 25 who have graduated from high school has more than doubled since the year of my birth. The percentage of people over the age of 25 with college degrees has more than tripled from when I was born.

We are healthier. We are living longer. We are better educated. We are working. More of us own our own homes.

It's not perfect. There is a wealth distribution problem that will have to be addressed. There are some entitlement programs that we need to deal with as we travel through the "boom/bust" population cycles. But jeez, some of you act like the big meteor has been spotted and we have a week.

And half the country just voted to roll all that back.

 

[SJHovey]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

Except the whole post was about us "surviving" the Bush administration and that we'll survive Trump just the same. Whether or not Dems supported the war doesn't change the fact that it happened. If anything the fact that Dems cowered in the face of being called traitors should make us MORE worried about the next administration, not less.

No, the whole point of my post was to use hyperbole to mock the sky is falling hyperbole that seems to have taken over this Board since November 8. To hear people around here for the last 8 years, Bush was a combination of smallpox and the 1918 flu epidemic. Since Trump's election the hyperbole has only ramped up. I just suggest saving some of it, since at some point there will likely be another Republican President-elect.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. -- Galatians 6:7

An article I can get behind.

 

[Patman]

No, the whole point of my post was to use hyperbole to mock the sky is falling hyperbole that seems to have taken over this Board since November 8. To hear people around here for the last 8 years, Bush was a combination of smallpox and the 1918 flu epidemic. Since Trump's election the hyperbole has only ramped up. I just suggest saving some of it, since at some point there will likely be another Republican President-elect.

Trump is bringing back polio... it's had a bad rap

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

No, the whole point of my post was to use hyperbole to mock the sky is falling hyperbole that seems to have taken over this Board since November 8. To hear people around here for the last 8 years, Bush was a combination of smallpox and the 1918 flu epidemic. Since Trump's election the hyperbole has only ramped up. I just suggest saving some of it, since at some point there will likely be another Republican President-elect.

Bush was a drift towards fascism, in the form of the "unitary executive" ideology.

Trump isn't a drift, it's a steered course towards fascism. I ask you, in what other "direction" is Trump by any definition steering, except towards Caesarism and authoritarianism? Traditional conservatism? I don't think so...

I'm sincerely sorry the letter after the name has blinded you to the danger. The incoming administration, on the heels of the type of campaign the candidate ran, is VERY bad news for democracy in the US.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

Trump is bringing back polio... it's had a bad rap

Hey. Traditional values.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

I can't go back beyond the date of my birth. I simply have no personal experience before that date. But this idea that we're all just sitting on a big turd in this country and someone has it the flush lever I find a bit absurd.

Unemployment is running at about 4.5% or so. When I was born, and for a number of years before and after, it was at 5.5%. It obviously fluctuates with events and the economy, but we're doing pretty well right now.

When I was born, the average white person could expect to live to be about 69.5 in this country. For a similar person born today, it's almost 80.

Even with the recession of 8-10 years ago and the massive loss of home ownership in this country, the rate of home ownership is still a few percentage points higher than when I was born.

The percentage of people over the age of 25 who have graduated from high school has more than doubled since the year of my birth. The percentage of people over the age of 25 with college degrees has more than tripled from when I was born.

We are healthier. We are living longer. We are better educated. We are working. More of us own our own homes.

It's not perfect. There is a wealth distribution problem that will have to be addressed. There are some entitlement programs that we need to deal with as we travel through the "boom/bust" population cycles. But jeez, some of you act like the big meteor has been spotted and we have a week.

Unemployment - Thanks Obama. Destroyed by Bush.
Home Ownership. Thanks Obama. Destroyed by Bush.
Wealth Distribution - Obama tried to fix it. Cock Blocked by GOP Congress. Caused by Bush.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

I want in on the insider trading!

https://t.co/5J7p7SwwcD

I'd post the photos, but they're really difficult to share on mobile.

You know how to play the market? Watch Fox News and try to "think" like Trump. "Would Trump call this a disaster or complain about the price? Did the Fox News story trash a company's major project? Did they generally trash the company?"

If so, short that stock. I wouldn't be surprised at all if someone did that exact thing.

 

[rufus]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

Except the whole post was about us "surviving" the Bush administration and that we'll survive Trump just the same. Whether or not Dems supported the war doesn't change the fact that it happened. If anything the fact that Dems cowered in the face of being called traitors should make us MORE worried about the next administration, not less.

Yep. That's hope that our Republican brethren, in Congress and here on this board, demonstrate the spine that Democrats failed to when they most needed to.


Not gonna hold my breath.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

Wealth Distribution - Obama tried to fix it. Cock Blocked by GOP Congress. Caused by Bush.

Not really. This is a 30-year slide with both sides of the aisle contributing. Yes, the GOP was worse, but the Democrats have also let this go on and on. The Reagan tax cuts were the start of an enormous transfer of wealth from the middle class to the upper class, which is exactly what they were designed to do. They destroyed the middle class. We see the ravages today, but the obvious solution -- to restore the tax structure to where it was in 1979 -- is branded unthinkable by both the right and most of the left. That is the national debt of the US right there -- about 20 trillion dollars in tax payments that the rich have successfully dodged for the last 36 years. It has been the #1 priority of the Republican party during that entire time, and the #1 priority of its donors.

What Clinton and Obama did was merely some landscaping around the edges. The only way to save the middle class is to reverse that decision and recover that money. Put simply: impound all hidden offshore accounts and then tax income, wealth and inheritance on the 1% for long enough and at a high enough rate to recover the $T20 over and above what they should also be paying during the period of collection, and then restore the 1979 tax structure permanently. That saves America, and we know it works because it worked, unlike every silly scheme the right has come up with to mask the true intentions of their fiscal policies.

In a way Trump's policies might even help. We are already so deep into the hole that his lunacy to completely zero out inheritance taxes won't even hurt that much more (I've seen estimates of about $12T over the next decade). If it gets people angry enough to finally storm the Bastille and just take back all that has been stolen from them, it will be worth it. Short of an actual military coup, the 1% will eventually simply not have the ability to maintain their theft, and the reaction will be rather thorough.

 

[SJHovey]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

Bush was a drift towards fascism, in the form of the "unitary executive" ideology.

Trump isn't a drift, it's a steered course towards fascism. I ask you, in what other "direction" is Trump by any definition steering, except towards Caesarism and authoritarianism? Traditional conservatism? I don't think so...

I'm sincerely sorry the letter after the name has blinded you to the danger. The incoming administration, on the heels of the type of campaign the candidate ran, is VERY bad news for democracy in the US.

Yeah, except here is the thing. Trump might be the first President to hold office who is equally despised by the leadership of both parties. I'm tempted to say that Trump is going to have about 25 friends in Washington, including his cabinet, but I'm worried I couldn't actually name them. This is not a situation where we've got 45-50 gung ho Trump men in the Senate and another 200 in the House.

I think both Trump and his insiders and the Republican leaders in Congress are looking at each other and privately thinking the other could be a "useful idiot." But I don't think we're going to see them goose-stepping down the Mall together.

 

[Slap Shot]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

Let's call the whining in that article for what it is. You have a guy who worked in what is supposed to be a non-political part of the government, who then chooses to take the rare and unusual step of interjecting his own views into who should be elected to be his boss (but we should all separate it between him as CIA spook vs him as regular voting citizen), but is now upset because the guy he campaigned against is mocking him and his agency.

The whining in the article? Did you read it? He took no political angles toward this particular issue and wasn't whining. More importantly despite any political statements he otherwise did make that are completely unrelated to the subject I expect the POTUS(elect) to review the facts and analyze them without acting like a petulant child.

Trump won't have nearly an equal amount of, "getting it from both sides" you claim to neutrally be hoping for. We've already seen members of the GOP acquiesce on several fronts and I don't see that being curbed anytime soon.

 

[rufus]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

Yeah, except here is the thing. Trump might be the first President to hold office who is equally despised by the leadership of both parties. I'm tempted to say that Trump is going to have about 25 friends in Washington, including his cabinet, but I'm worried I couldn't actually name them. This is not a situation where we've got 45-50 gung ho Trump men in the Senate and another 200 in the House.

I think both Trump and his insiders and the Republican leaders in Congress are looking at each other and privately thinking the other could be a "useful idiot." But I don't think we're going to see them goose-stepping down the Mall together.

The GOP leaders in Congress are gonna let Trump do just about anything he wants to do, as long as he doesn't stop them from doing what they want to do. SS and Medicare? Gone. Donald getting his hands in the pie of government spending? Done. Using the office of President to expand the Trump empire worldwide? Done. Tax cuts for the 1%? Done.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

Yeah, except here is the thing. Trump might be the first President to hold office who is equally despised by the leadership of both parties. I'm tempted to say that Trump is going to have about 25 friends in Washington, including his cabinet, but I'm worried I couldn't actually name them. This is not a situation where we've got 45-50 gung ho Trump men in the Senate and another 200 in the House.

I think both Trump and his insiders and the Republican leaders in Congress are looking at each other and privately thinking the other could be a "useful idiot." But I don't think we're going to see them goose-stepping down the Mall together.

The second paragraph is the important one. The GOP is going to use Trump to pass their agenda:

+ Nutbar judges
+ Repeal Obamacare
+ 1% tax cuts
+ Gut Medicare
+ Gut Social Security

That's what every Republican has lain in bed jerking off to for the last generation, and they can grease Trump's ego / palms to do it. This is Paul Ryan's Christmas. It doesn't matter that everybody despises Trump -- the Republicans are the ones who can use him.

Honestly, if I were the Democrats I'd already be going around the GOP gatekeepers to try to "flip" Trump with a better offer. Here's a direct payment of $10T to your kids. Now work with us to pass our agenda, and you'll be hailed as a Philosopher King who went against his own party to do what was right for America. A regular Cincinnatus. A Washington, except compared to you Mr. Trump Washington was a loser. We'll blast his image right off Rushmore if you just pass a 15% national minimum wage, sire, um, I mean sir.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: POTUS Elect Trump I: Get in pu$$y - we're gonna make American great again

I was only addressing the point that the Dems pushed the Patriot Act and the 2002 Congressional Resolution authorizing the use of military force against Iraq over the top. The Democrats (and any Republicans -- I don't think there were any (edit: there were in the House) ) who voted No on those two measure should be honored. That was truly a brave sacrifice in the name of their country. The Republicans who voted Yes to those votes I'm not going to criticize -- their ideology and their partisanship aligned, so why wouldn't they? But the Dems who votes Yes can eat a bag of dicks. Those were the cowards. Those were the colors that ran. F-ck them.

Here are the heros:

Patriot Act

Senate 2000:
Feingold (D-WI)

Senate 2006:
Akaka (D-HI) <-- Dr. Mrs. wrote the position paper outlining the reasons for Akaka's vote! She is my hero.
Bingaman (D-NM)
Byrd (D-WV)
Feingold (D-WI)
Harkin (D-IA)
Jeffords (I-VT)
Leahy (D-VT)
Levin (D-MI)
Murray (D-WA)
Wyden (D-OR)


House 2000: 66
House 2006: 138

2002 Resolution

Senate: 23
House: 133

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Wellstone

I see Scooby already mentioned Wellstone. Some excerpts from Wiki:

Wellstone voted against authorizing the use of force before the Persian Gulf War on January 12, 1991 (the vote was 52–47 in favor). He also voted against the use of force before the Iraq War on October 11, 2002 (the vote was 77–23 in favor). Wellstone was one of 11 senators to vote against both the 1991 and 2002 resolutions. The others were also all Democratic senators: Daniel Akaka of Hawaii, Jeff Bingaman of New Mexico, Robert Byrd of West Virginia, Kent Conrad of North Dakota, Daniel Inouye of Hawaii, Ted Kennedy of Massachusetts, Patrick Leahy of Vermont, Carl Levin of Michigan, Barbara Mikulski of Maryland, and Paul Sarbanes of Maryland.

Senator Wellstone further distinguished himself as a contrarian by being one of only eight members of the Senate to vote against the repeal of the Glass-Steagall Act in 1999.

After voting against the congressional authorization for the war in Iraq on October 11, 2002, in the midst of a tight election, Wellstone is said to have told his wife, "I just cost myself the election."

he was the only Senator facing reelection to vote against the congressional authorization for the [2002] Iraq War.