POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

I came across this quote which might help keep eyes on the prize:

Waste no more time arguing what a good man should be. Be one. -- Marcus Aurelius

We all have different ways in which we want to fight the Nazis. The important thing isn't our differences; it is to defeat the Nazis. We should cut each other a break. Reserve the scorn for the real enemy.

We don't have to be in love to fight together.

 

[leswp1]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

And what about the Dem voters who see them doing nothing, and so are disillusioned and not energized enough as a result to turn out and vote for a party that won't even make an effort to save our democracy? Probably just as many as those, as the folks you claim will turn against them for impeaching.

The truth is, no one knows what the effect will be. Whether it encourages more Dem votes, or discourages them.

No one that is, but you, the only sane rational centrist in a world of radical partisans. You go, you.

I am way more cynical. From what I can tell in order for oversight and Impeachment to work everyone needs to be acting in good faith and in the best interests of the country. When you have one party not willing to play by the rules there is no recourse or accountability. Rattling the saber by Impeaching when the entire GOP has lost their moral and ethical compass is an exercise in frustration. What will it achieve?

IMHO unless the Senate grows balls (only a rare ovary there) trying to Impeach will provide a massive stage for the GOP to cry out with outrage, spin, and twist everything- cementing their base's feeling of righteousness. The GOP will successfully play it by asking for proof and then claim there isn't really any when none is produced. It won't matter that the attempts were made. That will be irrelevant and another ability to claim persecution. You aren't going to flip a single Neanderthal to vote against the Cheeto. Period.

If they successfully gets thru the House you are not going to get the Senate do anything. The vast majority of Americans seem ignorant of the 2 step process. Feeling righteous that he is impeached might be enough for some and give a false sense that something has changed. Nixon was impeached and left. A lot of people had no idea Clinton could stay when he was impeached. When the Rump isn't ousted people are going to be shocked and view it as inept. Yet another platform for the GOP to excuse what ever he does.

Anyone with 2 brain cells to rub together knows he is guilty and are p1ssed. Start to impeach without the end result of removal and it takes the wind out of the sails. Currently people are ripping mad and they are going to vote. They aren't going to stay home. He helps by keeping up a steady stream of offensive behaviour. If they are disillusioned they might show up to vote in the primaries to get rid of the Dems who are 'doing nothing' but doubtful they are going to flip to the GOPs in their anger.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

Anyone with 2 brain cells to rub together knows he is guilty and are p1ssed. Start to impeach without the end result of removal and it takes the wind out of the sails. Currently people are ripping mad and they are going to vote.

I guess it is possible that people might say, "I would have gone out and vote against him but I won't bother now even if he wins we'll just impeach him anyway." People are that lazy.

OK. You convinced me. That's a substantive argument, not "if we start impeaching him and fail we'll look weak" (rebuttal: we won't and even if we do that's a lame excuse not to do the right thing) or "if we start impeaching him somebody might get mad" (rebuttal: the Nazis are already insane).

 

[sagard]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

I guess it is possible that people might say, "I would have gone out and vote against him but I won't bother now even if he wins we'll just impeach him anyway." People are that lazy.

OK. You convinced me. That's a substantive argument, not "if we start impeaching him and fail we'll look weak" (rebuttal: we won't and even if we do that's a lame excuse not to do the right thing) or "if we start impeaching him somebody might get mad" (rebuttal: the Nazis are already insane).

To me the reason to impeach is to force a vote and make everybody pick a side. At least it will be noted in history classes. If there is no impeachment, the Trump narrative will become history. Trump will be very hard to beat in 2020 whether they vote to impeach or not. When Trump wins again in 2020 and really starts to wreak havoc, I want every Republican on record as a "let's keep him."

Trump's worst impulses aren't even being seen yet, he knows he still has an election. If he wins that, he will act like the despots he admires so much. I'd expect actions against his enemies instead of just words if he wins again.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

None taken. To the extent I've posted sexist crap that's wrong and I apologize. We probably disagree sometimes on what constitutes sexism, but gratuitously body-shaming 20-something women to get the dummies to guffaw hopefully fits both our definitions.

And it isn't as if Rover doesn't constantly deploy that kind of en passant college sophomore "humor" in his hamfisted attempts to appear clever. He's a Mom's basement internet bully; it's just hard to see it sometimes because he's also such a pus-sy, and because 83% of the time he targets those we shed no tears for. But he's still a boob.

I cant judge what is sexist towards a woman...I am a dude. Nothing you say offends me I just think it is a bit hypocritical to attack Rover for what he said when you have said similar stuff many times when describing women. (you seem to call a lot of the "homely" lately) I mean Rover may be sophomoric but your humor towards women is probably only in Grad School

Trust me my super liberal GF says things way worse than what Rover said or you or I say. Hell her ripping Melania will make your head spin. What Rover said is tame. I think you overreacted a bit in part because Monica has created quite a life for herself after the shaming and disgraceful way she was treated not because it was really that offensive. That is understandable BTW.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

I'm more worried about them looking like they're getting nothing done. And since they can't get any legislation done at all because of the Senate. Actual oversight is there only option. And so far their grade on oversight of the Trump Administration is a big fat zero.

Me too which is why I have flipped my opinion in the last month. It is becoming clear that inaction looks worse than going after Trump. I think sitting on their hands will have a worse effect on the election than Impeaching will even it blows up in their face.

The cracks are there...its time to bust the **** and end this. Again we dont need many votes and right now his numbers arent great in the states he needs to keep flipped. Break out the jackhammer and beat this turd into the ground.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

Bulls**t. I have nothing against Rube and in fact like him quite a bit. It's a 'political' action in the arena in which it is enacted but the reasoning behind it is not political in nature if the charges being cited are legitimate. Stop treating people as if they're idiots, rufus-lite.

btw - I'm not even stating they have to impeach. But if they did it sure as hell would be warranted.

First of all bite me dont compare me to rufus.

Rube wants him impeached, but he also doesnt want it to backfire. There will be no ramifications in the political sphere from the impeachment we all know it. To Rube (and many others btw) it isnt worth risking 4 more years of Trump to try it. Hell until a month ago I was in the same boat. I changed my mind for various reasons but Rube hasnt gotten to that point yet.

(unless I am misunderstanding what you are saying, in which case mea culpa)

 

[leswp1]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

To me the reason to impeach is to force a vote and make everybody pick a side. At least it will be noted in history classes. If there is no impeachment, the Trump narrative will become history. Trump will be very hard to beat in 2020 whether they vote to impeach or not. When Trump wins again in 2020 and really starts to wreak havoc, I want every Republican on record as a "let's keep him."

Trump's worst impulses aren't even being seen yet, he knows he still has an election. If he wins that, he will act like the despots he admires so much. I'd expect actions against his enemies instead of just words if he wins again.

Again, I ask what will that achieve? The GOP people are elected by folks who believe he is OK and are self delusional enough to be apologists for anything that would be unacceptable in any other human being. I am unclear what labeling what is already known achieves.

I don't think he is capable of a filter. The only thing that stops his impulses is if the 'right' person decides they aren't ok. This isn't about him so much as the others that surround him and what they are willing to say is OK.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

The DOJ is now launching an anti-trust investigation into automakers who agreed to follow the CA emission standards over the national ones.

Well seeing as Ford is part of that deal that should go over REAL well in Michigan...

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

Does not impeaching have any political ramifications? Or do those not matter, since they don't involve Republicans?

Like the Rube, you're presenting this entirely from the view of the Republican side. No other considerations matter

I am not doing anything of the sort. Do you understand the difference between me stating something like the above and how that might be different from my personal opinion. (which I have posted multiple times including yesterday AGREEING WITH YOU!) My lord you talk about how dense The Rube is the amount of projecting you do is ****ed near Trumpian.

I want them to Impeach. Hell I was ****ed at Mueller because he pussed out which gave them the excuse NOT to move forward. I want them to spend every day between now and November 2020 not just telling the world how awful he is but proving it day after day after day. I would rather go down swinging then worrying about how it effects the polls. I wasnt always that way, but I am now.

But that doesnt mean everyone thinks that way and it surely doesnt make them wrong. None of us know how this will play out right now. But I would rather know the people were informed of everything when they voted. I am not going to shout down every person who disagrees with my personal belief though. That is your bit.

But yeah I am presenting things from the Republican point of view. Where do you come up with this crap...

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

Aww, you take potshots at me because I offend your boy. How nice.

Not that you bother to notice I've been saying the exact same thing you just did.

He took a pot shot at you because of how you act not because you are obsessed with Rube or attacked me despite me agreeing with you. Everyone has a buddy like you...so juiced up for an argument they dont even realize they are arguing with the people who are on their side. You dont care about any of our opinions you just are itching to spit in someone's face and will find any reason to do so. Or at least, that is how you act around here.

If we all want Trump out of office, if we all want him in jail and we all want the GOP to be bent over a barrel until they regain their sanity (probably never at this point) shouldnt we be working on that instead of just spitting in each other's faces over the degree with which we are willing to bleed for the cause?

 

[aparch]

The DOJ is now launching an anti-trust investigation into automakers who agreed to follow the CA emission standards over the national ones.

Oh. My. God.

God forbid a corporation does something above and beyond the minimum.

 

[Deutsche Gopher Fan]

Oh. My. God.

God forbid a corporation does something above and beyond the minimum.

States rights!

 

[aparch]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

I might be wrong, but I believe the California standard also matches standards in Canada, Mexico, and some Far East nations. Essentially, wherever NAFTA cars are shipped.

Forcing automakers to walk back standards for US vehicles would fracture the market radically.

We'd be left with entry level trucks (150/1500's made in Michigan) and whatever VW and Audi has parked at the Old Silverdome parking lot that would meet Trump's lowered bar.

 

[Deutsche Gopher Fan]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

But he’d be owning the libs

 

[aparch]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

Also, would you like to color your own NOAA weather charts?? Only $15 for five felt tipped markers.

(They're not even Sharpie brand)

 

[Deutsche Gopher Fan]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Who’s going to pay for the wall?<br><br>Mexico<br>Mexic<br>Mexi<br>Mex<br>Me<br>M<br>Mi<br>Mil<br>Mili<br>Milit<br>Milita<br>Militar<br>Military Children<a href="https://t.co/5tASzuq72y">https://t.co/5tASzuq72y</a></p>— Mark Takano (@RepMarkTakano) <a href="https://twitter.com/RepMarkTakano/status/1170073156859637763?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 6, 2019</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

 

[Slap Shot]

Aww, you take potshots at me because I offend your boy. How nice.

Not that you bother to notice I've been saying the exact same thing you just did.

You and I are quite often of like mind and I very much respect your contributions. I just think at times you could take it easy.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

The DOJ is now launching an anti-trust investigation into automakers who agreed to follow the CA emission standards over the national ones.

And Republicans are blaming the Democrats for the 36 billion that Trump is taking from other priorities for his wall.

Dems? ****ing do some oversight. This is bull****. These ****ers always own the narrative.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45.57: We Should Have Voted for Zaphod Beeblebrox Instead.

To me the reason to impeach is to force a vote and make everybody pick a side. At least it will be noted in history classes.

We already know what side everybody is on. Every R who hasn't gone to the wall against what their party has become is of them, by them, and for them. Silence in the face of evil is support.