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POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

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Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

Yeah it's admirable but it shouldn't have to happen in the first place that's the entire ****ing point. Circular logic and all aside.
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

trixR4kids said:
Yeah it's admirable but it shouldn't have to happen in the first place that's the entire ****ing point. Circular logic and all aside.
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It shouldn't happen, but it HAS to happen to get things done. You know? I mean, 50 years ago (or so) the sit-ins, etc, shouldn't have had to happen, but they were needed. The women's suffrage marches 100 years ago (or whatever, don't feel like math-ing right now) shouldn't have had to happen, but they were needed. In most cases, those folks paid the penalties for breaking the law. And it led to change, because the laws were unjust. It got the general overall public to step back and say, "Hey, wait a minute..."
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

The Rube said:
It shouldn't happen, but it HAS to happen to get things done. You know? I mean, 50 years ago (or so) the sit-ins, etc, shouldn't have had to happen, but they were needed. The women's suffrage marches 100 years ago (or whatever, don't feel like math-ing right now) shouldn't have had to happen, but they were needed. In most cases, those folks paid the penalties for breaking the law. And it led to change, because the laws were unjust. It got the general overall public to step back and say, "Hey, wait a minute..."
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But if you believe that there are problems with the current immigration law, that it is unjust and needs to change, shouldn't you support the immigrants? How does saying they are doing a righteous act, but should be jailed for it make sense? You are actively working against the change you are saying needs to happen rather than supporting it.
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

jerphisch said:
But if you believe that there are problems with the current immigration law, that it is unjust and needs to change, shouldn't you support the immigrants? How does saying they are doing a righteous act, but should be jailed for it make sense? You are actively working against the change you are saying needs to happen rather than supporting it.
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The ones that are immigrating illegally should pay the price, because it's against the law, and if it happens enough (which it kinda is now), the laws will hopefully change. I will (and do) respect the ones that accept the punishment for breaking the current law. I don't respect the ones that get away (for lack of a better phrase) scot-free.
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

To use the current asylum-seekers: they are going about it in a legal way. Bring 'em on in. 100% fine with that. Ftard isn't. Blech. You clear the background checks etc. you're good.
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

The Rube said:
It shouldn't happen, but it HAS to happen to get things done. You know? I mean, 50 years ago (or so) the sit-ins, etc, shouldn't have had to happen, but they were needed. The women's suffrage marches 100 years ago (or whatever, don't feel like math-ing right now) shouldn't have had to happen, but they were needed. In most cases, those folks paid the penalties for breaking the law. And it led to change, because the laws were unjust. It got the general overall public to step back and say, "Hey, wait a minute..."
Click to expand...
Yeah, we all get that. What we don't get is why you're clearly more focused on punishing those who break the unjust law and positively benefit our society, rather than on changing the stupid law or at the very least drawing attention to how bad it is.
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

trixR4kids said:
Yeah, we all get that. What we don't get is why you're clearly more focused on punishing those who break the unjust law and positively benefit our society, rather than on changing the stupid law or at the very least drawing attention to how bad it is.
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Basically, pay now for future benefits. It's a sacrifice to make, a difficult one, but it must be done, with how the world works and has always worked.
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

So the Jewish people who didn't wear a star and broke the law, who got punished by being put into concentration/death camps, they deserved their punishment because they broke the law?
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

trixR4kids said:
So the Jewish people who didn't wear a star and broke the law, who got punished by being put into concentration/death camps, they deserved their punishment because they broke the law?
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I'm invoking Godwin's Law right here and now.
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

trixR4kids said:
So the Jewish people who didn't wear a star and broke the law, who got punished by being put into concentration/death camps, they deserved their punishment because they broke the law?
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You are a complete idiot. "Deserved" is not the same thing as "being punished under the law." Being punished could mean being unfair. Deserving is not unfair.

Wake the hell up and smell the coffee.
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

<img src="https://media.giphy.com/media/tyqcJoNjNv0Fq/giphy.gif"></img>
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

:D Yep. That's about it with these chuckleboxes.
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

Look, if you support an unjust law using the circular logic argument "because it's illegal", despite the fact that it's currently being enforced in the most racist way possible or is a racist law to begin with, then you're still being racist.
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

trixR4kids said:
Look, if you support an unjust law using the circular logic argument "because it's illegal", despite the fact that it's currently being enforced in the most racist way possible or is a racist law to begin with, then you're still being racist.
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Let's dial it back to Rosa. What she did was illegal, she paid the price, and it led to change. I admire that she sacrificed to eventually change the unjust law. However, I also support that if you break the law, you also serve the penalty. The only thing I DON'T support is an unsafe protest against unjust laws. CIVIL disobedience is the answer. Don't risk harm to others. The popular example BLM, blocking highways and such. Not cool. That could cause harm to others, harm others' safety.

I will add an edit: this whole "Nationalist" BS needs to not exist. They are all but openly asking for violence against others. No. Not cool.
 
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Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

The Rube said:
However, I also support that if you break the law, you also serve the penalty.
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Ok but as pointed out before there have been various fascist regimes who create unjust laws and disobeying them is punishable by death or camps where you get worked to death. Or running away as a slave might've meant being (legally) maimed or killed. Why would you support people being punished for breaking a law that is completely unjust?
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

trixR4kids said:
Ok but as pointed out before there have been various fascist regimes who create unjust laws and disobeying them is punishable by death or camps where you get worked to death. Or running away as a slave might've meant being (legally) maimed or killed. Why would you support people being punished for breaking a law that is completely unjust?
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It's a tragedy, don't get me wrong. It's unfair. However, tragedy is often needed to change things. I don't like that, but it's the way it is. We often have to learn from our history.

What's oddly relevant is a quote from Beavis And Butthead, and I'll paraphrase, since I don't recall the exact quote....but if everything ruled, how would we know what sucked?

There's going to be some dark times, some evil instances, before improvement, because we are not perfect beings. Some people will perish. Some people will be served unjust punishments, and HOPEFULLY, we will learn from all those things and improve as a species. We will still make mistakes, but I also hope we will continue to grow and learn.
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

trixR4kids said:
I suppose that's one way to not answer the question.
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You are trying to force an answer that you want to hear with phrasing. It's similar to "Have you been caught masturbating in the closet, yet?" /gradeschooljoke
 
Re: POTUS 45.45: The Wall or a Shut Down. Your Choice Pelosi!!!!!!

Saying, "tragedy always exists hopefully we improve as a society", doesn't really answer why you support unjust and/or racist laws and their corresponding overly harsh punishment.
 
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