POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

[Handyman]

If you're making 20K more, you are paying more in taxes, progressive or not.

Right but that isn't the same thing. I should be taxed at a higher rate because I can be and survive.

 

[The Rube]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

Right but that isn't the same thing. I should be taxed at a higher rate because I can be and survive.

And that's the disagreement. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should be forced to.

 

[unofan]

And that's the disagreement. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should be forced to.

It should if he actually likes living in a society that respects the rule of law and allows him the opportunity to succeed. Government isn't free or cheap, and it benefits the rich far more than the poor.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

Brent, another way to look at it. The poor don't live large. They typically live paycheck to paycheck, rent small apartments and just can't afford to do much else. The rich travel all the time, don't just own a car but often commute sizable distances, own large homes, shop and eat out quite a bit.

Everyone uses government infrastructure and services. The rich on average require and use many times more than someone who doesn't own much of anything, flips burgers all day and goes home to a microwave dinner.

 

[The Rube]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

Brent, another way to look at it. The poor don't live large. They typically live paycheck to paycheck, rent small apartments and just can't afford to do much else. The rich travel all the time, don't just own a car but often commute sizable distances, own large homes, shop and eat out quite a bit.

Everyone uses government infrastructure and services. The rich on average require and use many times more than someone who doesn't own much of anything, flips burgers all day and goes home to a microwave dinner.

I'm not poor, but I am far from rich. My "big day out" is to go to a local restaurant for lunch and a beer or two. That was my choice in life. I value other things more than money. I still am saying that I don't think it's right that if you earn more, you pay a higher rate of taxes.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

I'm not poor, but I am far from rich. My "big day out" is to go to a local restaurant for lunch and a beer or two. That was my choice in life. I value other things more than money. I still am saying that I don't think it's right that if you earn more, you pay a higher rate of taxes.

And the government can't know exactly how much your using...but statistics hold, the rich use lots of resources.

If you're using many times more government infrastructure and services than someone else, shouldn't you pay a commensurate amount more for them?

 

[unofan]

I still am saying that I don't think it's right that if you earn more, you pay a higher rate of taxes.

And we're all saying you're 100 percent wrong.

And you're also ignoring the fact that the person making 40,000 and the person making 1,040,000 pay the same rate on that first 40,000. The person only pays the higher rate for the income above the threshold for a given bracket.

 

[Handyman]

And that's the disagreement. Just because you can, doesn't mean you should be forced to.

Yes I should. I want social safety nets and good infrastructure along with quality education. (not to mention police and fire departments) I want society as a whole to benefit. If a couple thousand bucks more can help then it is my duty as an American to do so.

If you want the country to work, you need help from those who can help.

 

[Handyman]

I'm not poor, but I am far from rich. My "big day out" is to go to a local restaurant for lunch and a beer or two. That was my choice in life. I value other things more than money. I still am saying that I don't think it's right that if you earn more, you pay a higher rate of taxes.

Then you best forget about about a functional economy or society. The math doesn't work.

 

[Handyman]

And we're all saying you're 100 percent wrong.

And you're also ignoring the fact that the person making 40,000 and the person making 1,040,000 pay the same rate on that first 40,000. The person only pays the higher rate for the income above the threshold for a given bracket.

This. It isn't like I pay the top percent on all my salary. I only paid the higher rate on a small portion that crossed the threshold.

 

[SJHovey]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

If you're using many times more government infrastructure and services than someone else, shouldn't you pay a commensurate amount more for them?

I personally think some sort of progressive tax structure is fine.

However, it does irk me when I read statements of alleged fact like you just wrote that I might use "many times more" government infrastructure and services than others.

I'd really like to see a link on that.

I know for a fact that my neighbor doesn't make 25% of what I make. But we drive down the same street to get home, the same cop drives by both our homes, the same street light lights our street, the same sewer line hauls both of our crap away, our kids went to the same school, etc...

 

[burd]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

Yes I should. I want social safety nets and good infrastructure along with quality education. (not to mention police and fire departments) I want society as a whole to benefit. If a couple thousand bucks more can help then it is my duty as an American to do so.

If you want the country to work, you need help from those who can help.

The GOP has had its foot on the throats of its own red-state base, keeping them poor and uneducated and suspicious of any spending that will benefit society as a whole. The irony of their support for GOP tax policies designed to benefit the wealthy to their own detriment is a sad one. It's not trickle down, it's beat down.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

I personally think some sort of progressive tax structure is fine.

However, it does irk me when I read statements of alleged fact like you just wrote that I might use "many times more" government infrastructure and services than others.

I'd really like to see a link on that.

I know for a fact that my neighbor doesn't make 25% of what I make. But we drive down the same street to get home, the same cop drives by both our homes, the same street light lights our street, the same sewer line hauls both of our crap away, our kids went to the same school, etc...

Have I ever let you down?

The top third of Americans have an income of $65K and the bottom third have an income of $37.5K (wiki).

The upper third spends twice the lower third on gas, auto maintenance, insurance...and even public transport.

The upper third spends almost three times the lower third on eating out...and pets, media equipment and services, toys and admission events.

Now what do you think these numbers would be if we compared somebody earning $30K vs. somebody who makes say $200K? Are we good?

https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/resear...efs/2016/03/household-expenditures-and-income

 

[SJHovey]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

Have I ever let you down?

The top third of Americans have an income of $65K and the bottom third have an income of $37.5K (wiki).

The upper third spends twice the lower third on gas, auto maintenance, insurance...and even public transport.

The upper third spends almost three times the lower third on eating out...and pets, media equipment and services, toys and admission events.

Now what do you think these numbers would be if we compared somebody earning $30K vs. somebody who makes say $200K? Are we good?

https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/resear...efs/2016/03/household-expenditures-and-income

When government infrastructure and services starts including things like gas, auto maintenance, insurance, eating out, pets, media equipment and services, toys and admission to events, I'll agree with you. Until then, you've let me down.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

flat taxes are a bad idea. Due to the diminishing marginal utility of money, a flat tax "harms" lower income people more than it harms high income people. A progressive tax structure is the most "fair".

The quotes around ‘fair’ weren’t necessary.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

I personally think some sort of progressive tax structure is fine.

However, it does irk me when I read statements of alleged fact like you just wrote that I might use "many times more" government infrastructure and services than others.

I'd really like to see a link on that.

I know for a fact that my neighbor doesn't make 25% of what I make. But we drive down the same street to get home, the same cop drives by both our homes, the same street light lights our street, the same sewer line hauls both of our crap away, our kids went to the same school, etc...

Yes, but it’s not about personal consumption. That’s a use tax or sales tax. Those are inherently regressive.

A person who makes $50,000 can’t afford to pay $1,000 in taxes as much as a person who makes $500,000 can afford $10,000.

If we want a flat tax, I want the first $250,000 exempted. The rich can fight it out over the rest.

 

[SJHovey]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

Yes, but it’s not about personal consumption. That’s a use tax or sales tax. Those are inherently regressive.

A person who makes $50,000 can’t afford to pay $1,000 in taxes as much as a person who makes $500,000 can afford $10,000.

If we want a flat tax, I want the first $250,000 exempted. The rich can fight it out over the rest.

I didn't say anything to the contrary. If you want to argue that I should pay more because I can afford it, fine. Make that argument. But don't tell me that I "use many times more government infrastructure and services" than someone making a fraction of what I earn.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

This. It isn't like I pay the top percent on all my salary. I only paid the higher rate on a small portion that crossed the threshold.

I don’t think the GOP voters or Fark Independents understand this math. For every dollar society provides me in income, I am necessarily using progressively more of society’s resources.

Say I’m selling lemonade on a street corner. I make $100. I use two streets. My grocery store is down the street and I can bike there. Not much wear and tear.

Now say I grow to be Lemonade Stands Corp andbi make $1,000,000. Instead of selling my lemonade on a street corner and using two streets I use the federal highway system now because my supply chain has grown. I also use Customs to import specialty lemons and cane sugar from Brazil. I’m using ports and docks now and all of the inspectors that come with it.

In order to make that last dollar, I’m using far more of the nation’s resources and not just my local streets. I should pay progressively more in taxes because I use progressively more resources.

 

[rufus]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

I'm not poor, but I am far from rich. My "big day out" is to go to a local restaurant for lunch and a beer or two. That was my choice in life. I value other things more than money. I still am saying that I don't think it's right that if you earn more, you pay a higher rate of taxes.

Taxes are the price we all pay for living in a civilized society. Otherwise, we'd be Somalia.

It only stands to reason that those who benefit most from that civilized society should also be expected to contribute the most towards its continued existence. Otherwise, we're Somalia.


When the mobs start descending on their gated communities, the rich are gonna wish they'd contributed a bit more towards the peoples' well-being.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: POTUS 45.42: Who Needs Tax Increases? If You're Rich Just Write A Check.

This is the post I read.

However, it does irk me when I read statements of alleged fact like you just wrote that I might use "many times more" government infrastructure and services than others.

I'd really like to see a link on that.

Didn't I just answer that? Isn't that what you wanted?