POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

[alfablue]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

Jeff Flake, newly crowned hero of the people, votes to deny consumers ability to sue banks, credit card companies, and other financial institutions.

Nice speech. How about back it up. I listened to his interview with NPR this morning. And in spite of him calling out all of congress, and calling out dump's behavior, he 100% failed at being specific. Says that Ryan called dump out on the campaign trail, so that's ok, somehow now... and that pence is a good guy, and hopes that he talks to dump behind closed doors.

Ok, so condemn the president's behavior and call out congress for not reacting to it, but then NOT actually criticizing people who are very much in power to do what he says.

Total let down.

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

And that's why Jeff Flake's retiring. Lame duck RINO looking to screw people over. He knows his days are numbered with the enlightenment of those still with a brain.

 

[Spartanforlife4]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

Ok, then what about the other Republicans minus Graham and Kennedy who voted for it? I doubt they're all leaving.

 

[WeAreNDHockey]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

Nice speech. How about back it up. I listened to his interview with NPR this morning. And in spite of him calling out all of congress, and calling out dump's behavior, he 100% failed at being specific. Says that Ryan called dump out on the campaign trail, so that's ok, somehow now... and that pence is a good guy, and hopes that he talks to dump behind closed doors.

Ok, so condemn the president's behavior and call out congress for not reacting to it, but then NOT actually criticizing people who are very much in power to do what he says.

Total let down.

Flake is just another cowardly politician. The only reason he isn't running is that he's afraid he'd lose the primary. It isn't out of some deep seated patriotism, or an actual "enough is finally enough" attitude. Guys like Flake and Corker are the best the republicans can offer us, cowards who decide to take their ball and go home. This isn't a signal at all the republicans are learning or coming around, its a signal that the mainstream of the party now is not just far to the right, its off the rails completely. The MAINSTREAM of the party. What qualifies now as a "conservative" republican is a fascist or a white supremacist. The mainstream are at best enablers, and a good portion of them are racist too. In a lot of states it is not nearly enough to be lock-step in your votes with trump as both Corker and Flake are, you have to espouse the same phony tough rhetoric, and you have to support the same bigoted ideals as the trump white house.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

Jeff Flake has a 96% conservative voting record. One of the best. When he was in the House he was considered too conservative. Now, he's not "conservative" enough for this government.

 

[rufus]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

It's almost as if god, guns and gays are deliberate distractions so the Republican rank and file will vote to destroy themselves economically.

Now that's just deplorable. How dare you belittle a good portion of the electorate's sincere beliefs. Typical of you condescending, elitest, liberals. Go back to your Ivy League towers and quit trying to tell Real America how they should live.

 

[rufus]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

Nice speech. How about back it up. I listened to his interview with NPR this morning. And in spite of him calling out all of congress, and calling out dump's behavior, he 100% failed at being specific. Says that Ryan called dump out on the campaign trail, so that's ok, somehow now... and that pence is a good guy, and hopes that he talks to dump behind closed doors.

Ok, so condemn the president's behavior and call out congress for not reacting to it, but then NOT actually criticizing people who are very much in power to do what he says.

Total let down.

Agreed. Instead of doing something, using his position in power to actually stand up and oppose this president, vote against his agenda and attempt to convince his colleagues to join hi in the effort, he's running away and going home. Doing nothing. Except there's probably a sweet-paying lobbyist's fee in his future.

What's the saying, "For evil to flourish,all that's necessary is for good men to do nothing"? Welcome to doing nothing, Jeff Flake. Coward.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

From the NY Times.

Breaking News: Mike Pence cast the deciding vote as Senate Republicans struck down a rule that would have let Americans sue banks and credit card companies.

The 1% wins again. Congratulations 1%. It's been a long time since your last victory.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

Sue them for what?

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

Sue them for what?

WASHINGTON — The Republican-led Senate narrowly voted Tuesday to repeal a banking rule that would let consumers band together to sue their bank or credit card company to resolve financial disputes.

Vice President Mike Pence cast the final vote to break a 50-50 tie. The banking industry had been lobbying hard to roll back the regulation from the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau. The bureau had moved to ban most types of mandatory arbitration clauses found in the fine print of agreements consumers often enter into when opening a checking account or getting a credit card.

The vote reflects the effort of the Trump administration and congressional Republicans to undo regulations that the GOP argues harms the free market. The measure now moves to President Donald Trump’s desk for his signature.

Democratic lawmakers said the rule was needed and would give consumers more leverage to stop companies from financial wrongdoing. They cited the sales practices at Wells Fargo and the security breach at credit company Equifax as examples of misdeeds protected through forced arbitration.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/pol...te-nullify-rule-suing-banks-article-1.3586551

So, now Wells Fargo and Equifax and anyone who does anything like them skates.

 

[Wisko McBadgerton]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

Waiting for our resident Rs to answer this one.

Well, to be fair, Clinton proposed at least $200 billion (back when $200 billion was still a lot of money!) in deficit spending every year from '92 - '96 in his budgets, as at the time, a balanced budget admittedly wasn't a priority of Clintonomics. Caving on spending to congressional R's allowed him the double political dip of taking credit for having balanced the budget, while also exposing the evil of R's in their opposition to proposed new social spending. Because R's hate the poor. Bill was an excellent politician.

 

[alfablue]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

Well, to be fair, Clinton proposed at least $200 billion (back when $200 billion was still a lot of money!) in deficit spending every year from '92 - '96 in his budgets, as at the time, a balanced budget admittedly wasn't a priority of Clintonomics. Caving on spending to congressional R's allowed him the double political dip of taking credit for having balanced the budget, while also exposing the evil of R's in their opposition to proposed new social spending. Because R's hate the poor. Bill was an excellent politician.

Yet at the end of his 8 years, we had a surplus.

At the end of 12 years of reagan bush- there was a recession. And at the end of Bush 2, we had a bigger recession. And both has much higher debts/deficits at the end of their run vs. the beginning.

It's fair to say that D's appear to know HOW to spend money and help the economy, R's do not. D spending leads to actual expansion, and eventually leads to lower deficits and ending debt. R's spending leads to recessions.

Again, WHY do you continue to vote for that? That is based on what actually happened.

 

[SJHovey]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/pol...te-nullify-rule-suing-banks-article-1.3586551

So, now Wells Fargo and Equifax and anyone who does anything like them skates.

"let consumers band together to sue credit card companies or banks."

So here is what we have. Credit card companies and banks include mandatory arbitration clauses in the small print of all of their contracts. These clauses prohibit consumers from suing them in court, and instead require resolution of the disputes by arbitration. These clauses also effectively eliminate class actions.

Trial lawyers or others wanted to get a rule passed that effectively overrules these mandatory arbitration clauses and would permit consumers to, "band together" was it, and sue the credit card companies and banks. The credit card companies and banks would get held hostage for millions in the class action lawsuits, most of which would go to the lawyers and the name plaintiff in the class action lawsuit, all of which the banks and credit card companies would just get back from the customers through fees and charges, and I'd get a check for $3.69 as my share of this class action lawsuit, or maybe a voucher or something valuable like that, and I got farked over by Senate Republicans again how Scoobs?

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

I disagree with many of his policies, but there are few in the federal government that have been more brave than Jeff Flake. And outside of Trump himself, there are few that have been more damaging to Trump's image. If there were more Jeff Flakes, this national nightmare might be put to rest.

So since you don’t approve of her private life (and I can’t blame you there) she doesn’t have the right to speak up? That doesn’t seem right either. She can make all the noises she wants to about bullying, and vegetables, and libraries, and fashion and it troubles me not the slightest. She’s not relevant to my opinions on anything but I welcome her efforts to make positive changes.

You are right...she does have the right and its in the country's best interest if she does in a productive manner. But to leswp's point...Trump is singlehandedly contributing to setting back civil relations in this country hundreds of years. Her voice would be better spent moderating his tweets than doing anything else.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

"let consumers band together to sue credit card companies or banks."

So here is what we have. Credit card companies and banks include mandatory arbitration clauses in the small print of all of their contracts. These clauses prohibit consumers from suing them in court, and instead require resolution of the disputes by arbitration. These clauses also effectively eliminate class actions.

Trial lawyers or others wanted to get a rule passed that effectively overrules these mandatory arbitration clauses and would permit consumers to, "band together" was it, and sue the credit card companies and banks. The credit card companies and banks would get held hostage for millions in the class action lawsuits, most of which would go to the lawyers and the name plaintiff in the class action lawsuit, all of which the banks and credit card companies would just get back from the customers through fees and charges, and I'd get a check for $3.69 as my share of this class action lawsuit, or maybe a voucher or something valuable like that, and I got farked over by Senate Republicans again how Scoobs?

Great. Good plan. Now let's eliminate all class action lawsuits. Cause, you know, they never have done anyone any good.

Class action lawsuits positively impact society. For example, they have caused automobile manufacturers to recall and fix defective cars, required service providers to fully disclose the terms and conditions of their services, forced companies to refund monies they improperly charged their customers, mandated that food manufacturers fully disclose their products’ ingredients, and compelled manufacturers that engage in price fixing to compensate retailers and consumers that paid artificially high products for goods and services. Equally important, class actions serve as a deterrent against such behavior by corporations.

Class actions are sometimes ridiculed in the press. Without them, however, consumers and shareholders with small claims would be without any means to pursue them, effectively giving large companies immunity for their bad acts. So, class actions are not only good for something, they are sometimes they only way to level the playing field between individuals and large companies.

http://wklawyers.com/class-action-lawsuits-good/

In other words. I disagree. Even though I only get $3.69, the fact that I sued has positive impact on change. Now that I can't sue the banks get to do whatever the **** they want.

 

[alfablue]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

"let consumers band together to sue credit card companies or banks."

So here is what we have. Credit card companies and banks include mandatory arbitration clauses in the small print of all of their contracts. These clauses prohibit consumers from suing them in court, and instead require resolution of the disputes by arbitration. These clauses also effectively eliminate class actions.

Trial lawyers or others wanted to get a rule passed that effectively overrules these mandatory arbitration clauses and would permit consumers to, "band together" was it, and sue the credit card companies and banks. The credit card companies and banks would get held hostage for millions in the class action lawsuits, most of which would go to the lawyers and the name plaintiff in the class action lawsuit, all of which the banks and credit card companies would just get back from the customers through fees and charges, and I'd get a check for $3.69 as my share of this class action lawsuit, or maybe a voucher or something valuable like that, and I got farked over by Senate Republicans again how Scoobs?

OR the companies can prevent reasons for people to sue them. Good customer service, not defrauding their customers, etc. Don't do that, and people won't have a need to sue.

I think your point is one that is constantly repeated, siding with companies who have a history of not very good behavior. Wells Fargo and Equifax are just the most recent bad ones. Your claims put the onus of blame for the problems on the consumer and their lawyers, when the companies are the ones who are doing the bad practices that lead to the lawsuits.

"Held hostage" - once again, using fear mongering to prevent us from protecting consumers.... Awesome.

 

[Drew S.]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

A lot of conservatives like you are bothered by the deficit and the debt.

Quick question- when was the last R President that had a balanced budget? I'd bet it happened prior to your legal vote counting.

Clinton balanced the budget, and ran a surplus. Obama started deep in the hole, but was reducing it every year. Bush totally lied to Congress about his budget by leaving out the wars we fought in Iraq and Afghanistan. And we know that Reagan-Bush took a nominal deficit and exploded it to a massively high value.

Which brings up the follow up question- if the budget is so important to you, why do you vote for the party that is much farther from balancing the budget. Since you do it over and over again, expecting different results, one can make a logical conclusion that you are insane, since that's the very definition of it.

You are correct that it did. You're also correct that Republicans deserve a lot of the blame this century for the massive deficits. I think you give Democrats way too much credit for being fiscally responsible though. If they were in power I believe we'd have the same deficit with higher taxes and higher spending. You can debate the merits of that but it isn't the point. If balancing the budget was a simple as voting democrat I certainly would do it. Hell, I'd even give up some of my guns. Its better than the country going bankrupt.

There are a few major problems I see with what has happened the last 15 years and what is projected into the future. The first is that the longer we do it the harder it will be to break the cycle of it. We're more or less like a drug addict. Everyone will feel some pain when we get back to reality. The fact that we have run a deficit is almost secondary to just how big they have actually been. If we ran a 10 billion dollar deficit every year it wouldn't be the end of the world, but the average has been somewhere around a trillion dollars.

The other thing that bothers me is how little we have to show for it. If the deficit financed some great new infrastructure or something along those lines it would be one thing, but the money has more or less been wasted. At some point we are going to have to spend some serious money on infrastructure too.

Why do you think this issue doesn't get more attention? Is it that people don't understand or just don't care? I wonder what you and others think 10, 20, 30 years down the road looks like. I honestly can't see how it has a happy ending but would like to be completely wrong.

 

[alfablue]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

I disagree with many of his policies, but there are few in the federal government that have been more brave than Jeff Flake. And outside of Trump himself, there are few that have been more damaging to Trump's image. If there were more Jeff Flakes, this national nightmare might be put to rest.

How is it brave to call out congress and the government complicit in letting dump be a ******* yet totally let off his buddies pence and ryan- who are key people in that allowance????

Call people out, even if they are your friends. That's courage.

 

[leswp1]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

I empathize too, but it’s not hopeless - I know someone very well who was abused for years by her father and became one of the best people I know, and probably the strongest. She pities her father but learned more from his bad example than most ever learn from a good one. Young Barron will come to realize the full import of his circumstances eventually, and may profit from the knowledge if he has the courage. Or he’ll just lock it away and try to follow the footsteps... he’s his own soul.

I agree. I have taken care of people who have gotten out from under the abuser. The dynamic of abuse in a relationship is very complicated and is usually part of a family system that is generationally toxic. Makes it even harder to break the mold. It takes realization that things aren't OK, courage, strength and most important- supports and a way to protect oneself. This woman right now is modeling that it is OK to stay and tolerate. Not good. Not a judgement on her at all. It isn't easy to get out. But her so publicly tolerating is not good for those who see it. Instead of having the insight into their dysfunction reinforced they have a role model who perpetuates acceptance. (rambling but hopefully making my point)

 

[SJHovey]

Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

Class actions, like all lawsuits, have their place and serve a legitimate need to try to force companies to toe the line with respect to policies, manufacturing, etc...

But we also have a real problem with class actions in this country where we basically have lawyers who do nothing but those types of claims and move from industry to industry looking for ways to use the power of numbers to basically extort money from corporations. There is a line out there between abuse of these types of actions and legitimate use.

If an individual has a legitimate claim against a Wells Fargo or Equifax, there are no end of lawyers who will be willing to take it.