POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

[Drew S.]

Why is that "ignorant"? And what do you mean by "free"? Do we have a "free" military or "free" public schools?

There's always an argument to be made for any x whether it should be a right or a privilege. If school until 18 is a right, why not school until 22?

Our opinions differ but neither side in that difference is "ignorant."

I don't see how we can afford it when we have 20 trillion in debt and are running a 500 billion dollar deficit each year. There needs to be a reckoning as far as what we can afford and how it will be funded. The status quo isn't going to go on forever.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

I think countries over time have respected us less and less for whatever reason.

"Respect" is an interesting term. I think you're right, and I also think the US under Trump is now a global laughingstock. But what does respect connote to you in international relations? Dependability? The US under any predecessor to Trump was trusted to stand by their commitments and alliances. Under Trump, there's no guarantee since the man is a moral cripple and only views allegiance as one-sided with him free to break any agreement on any whim.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

I don't see how we can afford it when we have 20 trillion in debt and are running a 500 billion dollar deficit each year. There needs to be a reckoning as far as what we can afford and how it will be funded. The status quo isn't going to go on forever.

We are 20 trillion in debt because the rich have 20 trillion dollars in the Caymans and the middle class has been neglected to the point of penury by the 1%ers who bribe our government.

Educating a workforce and keeping it healthy is the best guarantee that we will be internationally competitive. It will also reduce all the costs we currently pay for dooming a third of the nation to perpetual poverty: social spending, policing, and all the associated opportunity costs of never being able to see what miracles those people could achieve if given a chance.

Plutocracies are expensive and inefficient. If you want to see the potential of America unleashed, invest in Americans and stop shoveling all of our treasure to an international cartel of useless accumulators.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

We are 20 trillion in debt because the rich have 20 trillion dollars in the Caymans and the middle class has been neglected to the point of penury by the 1%ers who bribe our government.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I will never understand why this is so hard to understand.

 

[alfablue]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

What about the crowd who wants free college tuition and free healthcare? Isn't that somewhat ignorant as well? There is plenty of blame to go around. To say that rural white people are the only problem in our country is completely off the mark.

And to pretend that rural white people have the monopoly on ignorance and fear is just as off the mark.

Sure, they are a majority of the people, but they are being fed by the fear mongering people in power with money. Which are the actual source of the problem.

It's funny how the anti-single payer people label that as free healthcare. Most of the advocates who are trying to get it passed fully know that it means that people are going to get taxed. But from a system standpoint- the raw amount of money spent on "healthcare" will go down with single payer- as it will take the group of people profiting on laundering my money out of the system. But you "tax is evil" people are ok paying MORE money so that someone can profit over paying less money, but in taxes.

The crowd who want "free" college tuition are the ones being constantly squeezed out of being able to afford college with the reduction of state funds going to state schools- who are then forced to pass that reduction of income onto the students. Gotta be careful of students- they have a tendency of revolt over the ages.

Your comparisons between the left and right are so inapplicable, but I guess it's not really that surprising coming from you.

 

[alfablue]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

I don't see how we can afford it when we have 20 trillion in debt and are running a 500 billion dollar deficit each year. There needs to be a reckoning as far as what we can afford and how it will be funded. The status quo isn't going to go on forever.

Next time we have a war, maybe we have a war bond drive to make sure we will pay for it?

Or elect a Democrat- as historically they have been the ones able to balance budgets better.

The tax cut and spend republicans are driving the boat you fear so much.

 

[Gurtholfin]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

Good post here. Really good post.

Followup: IF YOU VOTED FOR HIM is the key. I didn't. But I didn't vote against him, and some folks are making me (and similar folk) villains.

I think "villain" is strong, but your one vote went to Trump.

Luckily you live in a blue state so it didn't matter.


There were two choices in this election. By choosing NOT HILLARY, you chose Trump.

You basically said, I don't want Hillary so bad that I'd rather have ANYONE than her. Well... you got your "anyone."

 

[Drew S.]

We are 20 trillion in debt because the rich have 20 trillion dollars in the Caymans and the middle class has been neglected to the point of penury by the 1%ers who bribe our government.

Educating a workforce and keeping it healthy is the best guarantee that we will be internationally competitive. It will also reduce all the costs we currently pay for dooming a third of the nation to perpetual poverty: social spending, policing, and all the associated opportunity costs of never being able to see what miracles those people could achieve if given a chance.

Plutocracies are expensive and inefficient. If you want to see the potential of America unleashed, invest in Americans and stop shoveling all of our treasure to an international cartel of useless accumulators.

I don't disagree with you. I think that in a lot of ways our education model is broken and outdated. We spend a frightening amount of money for what we get for outcomes. I wouldn't mind kids getting free college, but most definitely not in the current setup we have.

As I've said previously, I'm in favor of single payer and was being a bit lazy when I threw that out.

To go back to my original point today, our problems are much deeper than Trump being president. I honestly don't even know how we would ever get the changes we need with the current political setup. It's going to take reforms we haven't seen since the early 1790's to get us back on the right path.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

I don't disagree with you. I think that in a lot of ways our education model is broken and outdated. We spend a frightening amount of money for what we get for outcomes. I wouldn't mind kids getting free college, but most definitely not in the current setup we have.

As I've said previously, I'm in favor of single payer and was being a bit lazy when I threw that out.

To go back to my original point today, our problems are much deeper than Trump being president. I honestly don't even know how we would ever get the changes we need with the current political setup. It's going to take reforms we haven't seen since the early 1790's to get us back on the right path.

Cap individual political contributions, severely restrict lobbying*, impose stiff criminal penalties for violations. Those measures won't solve all our problems, but without those measures we will never solve our problems. We are no longer a functioning democratic republic.

Restore democracy, educate the electorate, and then work the people's will through our three branch system. I do not believe we need radical change -- I believe in the Founders' model and I still haven't seen a better, more resilient system. But we must give the power back to the people. The abuse of "liberty" has merely been a ruse for politicians to transfer control of the nation from the people to the 1% in exchange for massive bribes. Those actions should be criminalized in the same way that you may not bribe the judge or the jury when your case in being heard. It's exactly the same behavior.

* That's for the left and the right. I want Soros and the unions to be shut out of politics just as much as the Club for Growth and the Kochs.

 

[Drew S.]

Cap individual political contributions, severely restrict lobbying*, impose stiff criminal penalties for violations. Those measures won't solve all our problems, but without those measures we will never solve our problems. We are no longer a functioning democratic republic.

Restore democracy, educate the electorate, and then work the people's will through our three branch system. I do not believe we need radical change -- I believe in the Founders' model and I still haven't seen a better, more resilient system. But we must give the power back to the people. The abuse of "liberty" has merely been a ruse for politicians to transfer control of the nation from the people to the 1% in exchange for massive bribes. Those actions should be criminalized in the same way that you may not bribe the judge or the jury when your case in being heard. It's exactly the same behavior.

* That's for the left and the right. I want Soros and the unions to be shut out of politics just as much as the Club for Growth and the Kochs.

I agree with all of that. The trouble now is the political class is benefiting so much from the status quo there is no incentive to change. The first amendment ruling on political contributions is tricky to get around too.

It's nice when we have agreement from both sides on issues

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

I agree with all of that. The trouble now is the political class is benefiting so much from the status quo there is no incentive to change. The first amendment ruling on political contributions is tricky to get around too.

It's nice when we have agreement from both sides on issues

I agree. I believe if we could do this then we could have engagement on the issues that matter to the broad middle of American voters. And if we could restore government of the people there are actually some issues on which I would tend to lean center-right. The problem has been the Republican party, corrupted by the plutes, has driven so far to the right both on economics (to please their 1% paymasters) and social issues (to compensate for taking such outrageously terrible economic positions) that they are a non-starter for any rational vote. And obviously that also makes the Dems lazy, since for so many of us they really don't have to deliver, they are still the only choice to fend off GOP Armageddon.

 

[aparch]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

There has to be some GOP deep pockets somewhere that they could legitimately start up a third party to catch those center-right issues. Why do the deep GOP donors continue to fund the moonbats?

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

There has to be some GOP deep pockets somewhere that they could legitimately start up a third party to catch those center-right issues. Why do the deep GOP donors continue to fund the moonbats?

Because the GOP as it exists is doing their bidding. If they were rich people who were willing to be taxed for the good of the country, they would be Democrats.

The Sam Bee story on Art Laffer summed up the entire ideological history of the GOP from 1978 to the present in one sentence. "There is a lot of money in telling rich people what they want to hear."

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

I'm so farking sick of this both sides are bad shiat when you're comparing a mild cold to Ebola. One is within the expected norms and can be easily handled. The other will literally kill you. But since both are bad, they're clearly the same.

Well to be fair that is consistent for that party. They used to consider research into the common cold part of "Research related to AIDS" because in both he immune system broke down. That was their way to pretend they wee helping even though they could care less.

 

[Handyman]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

I don't see how we can afford it when we have 20 trillion in debt and are running a 500 billion dollar deficit each year. There needs to be a reckoning as far as what we can afford and how it will be funded. The status quo isn't going to go on forever.

Well maybe if the Party of Fiscal Responsibility and The Party of Smaller Government didnt cut taxes on a whim and spend to high heaven we wouldnt be in this position. The only Republican who got that was GHWB and most people on the Right never seemed to like him. Cant imagibe why...

Everyone blames the Dems for tax and spend well tax and spend is infinitely better than spend and cut. At least Dems pretended to pay for things, the last time the GOP picked up a check was the early 60s.

 

[aparch]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

Every voting machine used as part of a "Hack-A-Thon" this weekend were compromised within hours .

One hacker said these machines were easier to get into, and more boring, than ATM's.

 

[Kepler]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

Every voting machine used as part of a "Hack-A-Thon" this weekend were compromised within hours .

One hacker said these machines were easier to get into, and more boring, than ATM's.

Go back to manual machines with a physical paper trail. It's the only way to be sure, particularly given the incumbent party's proclivities.

For the first time I am legitimately worried that our elections may be hacked.

 

[French Rage]

Re: POTUS 45.14 - No Confusion, It's Collusion!

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump...medium=website&utm_content=link&ICID=ref_fark

When he says "S.C.", does he mean Supreme Court? Can someone explain to him filling a seat is not an accomplishment, it's a basic, almost procedural, part of your job. I took the trash out last night, but I'm not expecting a ****ing parade for it.

 

[Drew S.]

There has to be some GOP deep pockets somewhere that they could legitimately start up a third party to catch those center-right issues. Why do the deep GOP donors continue to fund the moonbats?

If the GOP broke off into two parties all it would be doing is handing power to the dems. If a third party is going to work it needs to have a mix from both parties with no more than a 70-30 split.

 

[aparch]

Go back to manual machines with a physical paper trail. It's the only way to be sure, particularly given the incumbent party's proclivities.

For the first time I am legitimately worried that our elections may be hacked.

One of the more popular machines has a cellular modem built into it which phones home for updates. Someone said that machine was cracked first because of the cellular capability.

Others had to be cracked with a physical connection (ie: putting a thumb drive in the USB port and going from there).