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POTUS 45.08: Suckers

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Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

St. Clown said:
Because everything happens in a space where, you know, nothing ever changes, like a sort of, I guess you could say, like a vacuum, and nothing ever changes after a specific situation ends. Nothing that could require further scrutiny.



So I'm just gonna, you know, like President Obama did, pass the buck.
Click to expand...

You ever notice they never mention that Obama fired Flynn...that stuff comes up when you vet someone ;)

Hey Sooki...Read Up!

Flynn actually had his clearance revoked in 2014 when he was “allowed to retire.” CNN’s Jake Tapper said that Spicer’s accusations are fair if it turns out the Army and Defense Department “renewed Flynn’s clearance without sufficient diligence given to that Russian trip and money.”

Tapper noted, however, that doing so is not the same as appointing and vetting Flynn to serve as the top security advisor in the country.

“Remember, Obama fired Flynn from a lower position in the national security community,” Tapper said. “You might wonder why was Flynn fired? Last July when Flynn was being considered for the VP slot, Flynn wrote an op-ed the military fired me for calling the radicals jihadis. That was different from when [former Secretary of State Colin] Powell told his son when he had been told, ‘abusive with staff, didn’t listen, worked against policy, bad management. He has been and was right wing nutty ever since.'” he said citing hacked emails.
Click to expand...
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

If people want to get something through from Trump, all people have to say is "Obama told me no" and presto, you'll get your wish. Are you reading this, Chuck and Nancy?
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

St. Clown said:
Because everything happens in a space where, you know, nothing ever changes, like a sort of, I guess you could say, like a vacuum, and nothing ever changes after a specific situation ends. Nothing that could require further scrutiny.



So I'm just gonna, you know, like President Obama did, pass the buck.
Click to expand...

Again, so don thinks now that President Obama was doing a good job, all of a sudden?

Ignoring the fact that he was fired- don's been telling the whole world how big of a loser that President Obama was, but in *this* instance, he was competent enough?

Which is it?

That is the weakest excuse of all time.

Do your job, don. Yes, it's really hard.
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

Looks like my Canada score would be between a 73 and around an 88 if I could find a job up there ahead of time.
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

dxmnkd316 said:
Looks like my Canada score would be between a 73 and around an 88 if I could find a job up there ahead of time.
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What if I already have a job with a global company, and could get a transfer approved? Rumor has it our Canadian arm is in need of business analysts. ;)
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

Of the 556 executive branch jobs important enough to require Senate confirmation, only 24 have been filled. Trump hasn't nominated anyone for 468 of them, according to the running tab kept by the Partnership for Public Service.
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We can only pray that some sort of international or Katrina-like crisis doesn't hit.
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

Watching how little Trump's support has waned among his voters and supporters has made me wonder about something. At what point COULD a Trump have been elected? When did enough of the American electorate devolve into the rubes and racists who were numerous enough -- barely and in the right places -- to elect him? Was 2016 the first year when all of the stars were aligned to elect Trump or someone like him? It used to be when the mainstream press announced you had committed a gaff severe enough to consider dropping from a race, you dropped from the race. Trump made a regular habit of doing so during the primary season, yet never quit. During the general election he was written off pretty much as soon as the Democrats held their convention, yet he ignored the history, refused to fold, and surprised nearly everyone, himself included I'm sure.

Could Trump have happened at any other time in the internet age? Or the TV age? To me it seems things are worse now, but that might only be because we're living this nightmare. George W. Bush is likely to be considered one of the worst -- if not THE worst -- two term presidents in the nation's history when enough time has passed to fairly rate him. I didn't think it was possible to elect someone who would be demonstrably worse by magnitudes that frighten me, yet we did just that. But could this just be because Trump was the first one to say "f!ck all of you, I ain't quitting!" Or have we truly become so stupid, simple and afraid of our shadows that we have finally arrived at the point where politics will only give us the kinds of choices we saw in 2016?
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

Kepler said:
Fitting.

No person with functioning brain cells would argue otherwise.
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There are about 60 million people who would argue otherwise, and remember, most of them have a driver's license. Pray they understand the difference between green and red, and the long skinny pedal versus the wide one.
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

Bill Maher on Real Time during his interview with Elizabeth Warren talked about Trump voters and what the Democrats could do to win them.

And he covered it at the end of the show.

His conclusion? You can't talk to them. The Democrats would be wasting their time trying to talk to them. With the election being so close and Hillary hated so much yet garnering so many votes it was a key contributing factor that she wasted time on Republicans. If she had spent all her time just on her base she may have pulled it off.

This also is a key indicator that were not likely to get less polarized anytime soon. It's war in the Legislature. It's war in the States. It's war all over the place. Iraq is a three state solution and the US if they don't watch it is going to need a 2 state solution.
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

ScoobyDoo said:
Bill Maher on Real Time during his interview with Elizabeth Warren talked about Trump voters and what the Democrats could do to win them.

And he covered it at the end of the show.

His conclusion? You can't talk to them. The Democrats would be wasting their time trying to talk to them. With the election being so close and Hillary hated so much yet garnering so many votes it was a key contributing factor that she wasted time on Republicans. If she had spent all her time just on her base she may have pulled it off.

This also is a key indicator that were not likely to get less polarized anytime soon. It's war in the Legislature. It's war in the States. It's war all over the place. Iraq is a three state solution and the US if they don't watch it is going to need a 2 state solution.
Click to expand...

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/04/27/trump-voters-ruining-america-tom-nichols-column/100926836/

here is a more disturbing possibility here than pure ignorance: that voters not only do not understand these issues, but also that they simply do not care about them. As his supporters like to point out, Trump makes the right enemies, and that’s enough for them. Journalists, scientists, policy wonks — as long as “the elites” are upset, Trump’s voters assume that the administration is doing something right. “He makes them uncomfortable, which makes me happy,” Ohio Trump voter James Cassidy told the Toronto Star’s Daniel Dale. Syria? Korea? Health care reform? Foreign aid? Just so much mumbo-jumbo, the kind of Sunday morning talk-show stuff only coastal elitists care about.
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That's it in a nutshell. All today's Republican party cares about is pizzing liberals off. As long as their leaders keep doing that, then they'll keep supporting them.
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

WeAreNDHockey said:
Watching how little Trump's support has waned among his voters and supporters has made me wonder about something.
Click to expand...
I think most of us kept thinking, well this is the one that will turn even his base against him. But after the poocee grabber comment, and the tax returns, and any of the dozens of other things, you had to come to the realization that if that previous horrendous thing didn't do it, why would this horrendous thing do it?

And for a while I thought nothing would do it, but that's not true. If he turned black, or into a woman, that would do it. But anything short of those two things and they're sticking with him. Lost cause, don't bother.

It's all a game to them, and he's their team. They don't think the actions of the government effect them. They're not smart or aware enough to make connections that are anything less direct than if you don't put gas in your truck it stops running. Anything less direct than that, even something as simple as taxes pay for teachers, is totally and completely beyond them.
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

WeAreNDHockey said:
Watching how little Trump's support has waned among his voters and supporters has made me wonder about something. At what point COULD a Trump have been elected? When did enough of the American electorate devolve into the rubes and racists who were numerous enough -- barely and in the right places -- to elect him? Was 2016 the first year when all of the stars were aligned to elect Trump or someone like him? It used to be when the mainstream press announced you had committed a gaff severe enough to consider dropping from a race, you dropped from the race. Trump made a regular habit of doing so during the primary season, yet never quit. During the general election he was written off pretty much as soon as the Democrats held their convention, yet he ignored the history, refused to fold, and surprised nearly everyone, himself included I'm sure.

Could Trump have happened at any other time in the internet age? Or the TV age? To me it seems things are worse now, but that might only be because we're living this nightmare. George W. Bush is likely to be considered one of the worst -- if not THE worst -- two term presidents in the nation's history when enough time has passed to fairly rate him. I didn't think it was possible to elect someone who would be demonstrably worse by magnitudes that frighten me, yet we did just that. But could this just be because Trump was the first one to say "f!ck all of you, I ain't quitting!" Or have we truly become so stupid, simple and afraid of our shadows that we have finally arrived at the point where politics will only give us the kinds of choices we saw in 2016?
Click to expand...

The only way a Trump gets elected is if a party embraces the radical elements and lets them take control. There was always wackos and people that are now Trump voters, but they were fringe never mainstream. Then a Black Man became President and the GOP decided they would let them out of their cage and join the party figuring they could keep them in line. They obviously cant especially since there is a lot of money backing a lot of this crazy.

That isnt enough though. You need to have said party be a loyalty brigade. If the Dems did this it would crap the bed because, as shown in the past election, the average Dem voter is loyal to its principle over their Party. That isnt true for the GOP. even though Trump stands for almost nothing many of the GOP voters stand for they still voted for him. GOP voting numbers are pretty consistent these days every 4 years...their victories depend on Dem turnout.

So to answer your question...no I dont think it could have happened at any other time. There was attempts in the past but usually either the Party was too split to make it work or cooler heads prevailed. In this case the Dems were too divided and a significant % in the wrong states stayed home. It was a perfect storm.

This is why going into 2020 the Dems need to shift their strategy. First and foremost is they need to make sure that in every contested district, no matter where it is, they have to engage the population on a much more personal level and bring out younger candidates. I know even talking about the Georgia 6th gets people all hot and bothered but the truth is whether he wins or loses that should be the template. He is young guy with little experience who is running Anti-Trump/Anti-Ryan. He is engaging the people there not talking above them. The Congressional Dems need to not only throw out ads, but hold town halls and such explaining why these bills are hurting them especially Health Care and Tax Reform. It isnt like people arent picking up on it...the mere mention of it at GOP rallies usually leads to boos and chants. (my fave was "Your last term!" at Lindsay Graham's)

Then on the National level you do 2 things. First you find someone who the whole Party can support and not someone who has been around forever and it is "their turn". You cant make this a John Kerry type appointment this needs to be someone that gets the Dems to the polls whether they are Centrists or Progressives. Second, you need to forget about the Trump voters. They arent breaking minus something catastrophic happening so let them go. We know what his numbers will be, so the Dems job needs to be to beat that. It isnt that hard, he didnt win Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania by much...get the Dems back voting there and you are off to the races.

The one thing they cant do, is get so frustrated with Trump that they give up. They did that with Dubya (hence putting up Kerry who was the wrong candidate) and it lead to destruction. The Dems need to stay engaged and re-engage those that took 2016 off.
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

WeAreNDHockey said:
Watching how little Trump's support has waned among his voters and supporters has made me wonder about something. At what point COULD a Trump have been elected? When did enough of the American electorate devolve into the rubes and racists who were numerous enough -- barely and in the right places -- to elect him? Was 2016 the first year when all of the stars were aligned to elect Trump or someone like him? It used to be when the mainstream press announced you had committed a gaff severe enough to consider dropping from a race, you dropped from the race. Trump made a regular habit of doing so during the primary season, yet never quit. During the general election he was written off pretty much as soon as the Democrats held their convention, yet he ignored the history, refused to fold, and surprised nearly everyone, himself included I'm sure.

Could Trump have happened at any other time in the internet age? Or the TV age? To me it seems things are worse now, but that might only be because we're living this nightmare. George W. Bush is likely to be considered one of the worst -- if not THE worst -- two term presidents in the nation's history when enough time has passed to fairly rate him. I didn't think it was possible to elect someone who would be demonstrably worse by magnitudes that frighten me, yet we did just that. But could this just be because Trump was the first one to say "f!ck all of you, I ain't quitting!" Or have we truly become so stupid, simple and afraid of our shadows that we have finally arrived at the point where politics will only give us the kinds of choices we saw in 2016?
Click to expand...
No it couldn't have happened before, and your point brings a greater point about how things that would have ended campaigns before are simply not anymore. Our culture has shifted where things that would be unthinkable 10, 15 or 30 years ago are not a big deal now. Plus with the hyper-polarization we see now...it's a combo that is one of the many reasons why the 45th is now president.
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

ScoobyDoo said:
Bill Maher on Real Time during his interview with Elizabeth Warren talked about Trump voters and what the Democrats could do to win them.

And he covered it at the end of the show.

His conclusion? You can't talk to them. The Democrats would be wasting their time trying to talk to them. With the election being so close and Hillary hated so much yet garnering so many votes it was a key contributing factor that she wasted time on Republicans. If she had spent all her time just on her base she may have pulled it off.

This also is a key indicator that were not likely to get less polarized anytime soon. It's war in the Legislature. It's war in the States. It's war all over the place. Iraq is a three state solution and the US if they don't watch it is going to need a 2 state solution.
Click to expand...

Bill is right though...there isnt going to be a massive wave of Trump flippers any time soon. The wackos blame the GOP for his failures and the average GOPer wont vote against party. The way to beat them is to worry about your voters and your issues and let the GOP be.

Now if things work out the way many of us think it will (re-engaged Dems lead to a resurgence and a Trump loss) you are going to see a two state solution just in the GOP. Much like the Dems are having issue with the Bernie Bros and the Clintonistas the Trumpers are going to go after the GOPers. Coalitions like this one only work when you win...if you lose then the fireworks start flying. You are seeing evidence of this with the Health Care debate...both sides of the Party have fought on the same side for 7 years. All they wanted was to get rid of ObamaCare no matter the consequences. Now that they can, and their voters are saying "if you take away my Health Care you are out of a job" it isnt so easy to align yourself with the ideological opposite side of your Party. (Freedumb vs. Tuesday) This will play out more and more especially if the midterms arent looking good for the GOP.

Bill really wants Warren to run...and **** that would be a fun election to watch but I just think her ferocity would turn a lot of people off. Then again, the people who would hate her already hate her (hence dont try and convert the Trumpers) so maybe he is right.
 
Re: POTUS 45.08: Suckers

I don't think this could have happened until recently. There are a lot of reasons, and things to blame, that it did happen but a major reason is the near death of journalism in this country. What was journalism is now the media, and that's not just semantics. The ideas of investigation, depth, intelligent analysis have all but given way to ratings. This past election was a reality TV show not a presidential campaign. The hundreds of hours of free coverage Trump got because of ratings, the moral equivalencies in service of some immature notion of "fairness", the lack of follow up, accountability, attention span allowed this to happen.

But it's not surprising. I'm a firm believer in the saying a country gets the leaders it deserves. We've checked out of civic life as a society and culture. We've crawled inside our phones and tuned the real world out. We got a narcissist as President? How shocking, let me just login to Facebook to let people know what I bought at the supremarket this morning and then I'll think about that, if I don't get distracted posting a couple of selfies on Instagram first. Journalism became "the media" because that's what we want, that's what we consume, that's all we can be bothered with, a simplistic reality TV show election crammed in around Snapchat, Twitter, and Finsta.
 
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