Open Wheel Racing 2021, anyone there to watch?

[Kepler]

It was nice until today. Got very cloudy. Temps have barely broke 70 my 4 days here. At night mid 50s is the best I saw with upper 40s in play.

Apparently rooms are being discounted upwards of 80% from original ask.

And I had a cabbie the other day who could win the race easily. Last time I was that scared was in Cairo...

The craziest cab ride I ever had was in Vegas but the driver was from Cape Verde. I think the cab may also have been from Cape Verde.

 

[Spartanforlife4]

This is turning out to be a disaster. Sainz hit a drain cover and it destroyed everything on the car in FP1, leading them to cancel the rest of the session after 8 minutes. There was a delay to fix that cover and inspect the others, and then they kicked out all spectators before FP2 started.

Sainz appealed to not have his replacement parts count towards the penalty since it was an issue with the track, but it was denied, so he has a ten place penalty.

 

[RaceBoarder]

I was just coming here to post that...

Sainz hitting a water main control cover. (About 6" across. NOT a full manhole cover like I've seen in some clickbait-y headlines)

I suppose being a brand new street circuit, all of the covers/plates weren't fully mapped out and this one just slipped through the cracks so to speak. I assume that it's still S.O.P. to weld them into place for the weekend?

 

[MichVandal]

I was just coming here to post that...

Sainz hitting a water main control cover. (About 6" across. NOT a full manhole cover like I've seen in some clickbait-y headlines)

I suppose being a brand new street circuit, all of the covers/plates weren't fully mapped out and this one just slipped through the cracks so to speak. I assume that it's still S.O.P. to weld them into place for the weekend?

Has been for a very, very long time- manhole covers have almost killed drivers in the past. But to not allow Sainz to fix his car when he did nothing wrong (like brush up against a wall), not sure about that. That seems weak. I understand the rule, but how are drivers supposed to know that driving over a metal cover was going to destroy the car?

 

[Kepler]

Has been for a very, very long time- manhole covers have almost killed drivers in the past. But to not allow Sainz to fix his car when he did nothing wrong (like brush up against a wall), not sure about that. That seems weak. I understand the rule, but how are drivers supposed to know that driving over a metal cover was going to destroy the car?

When Kym Ilman, the white-haired dude, was doing a track walk early in the week, he noted the manholes were not welded down. I thought I had mentioned that in an earlier post.

 

[MichVandal]

For those of you who roll your eyes over Vegas- just saw a video that the local airports raised all landing fees to $3000/plane- which is a huge amount for small general aviation. After that was exposed, they lowered it to $750 for small planes, but even that is really high. This is a county agency, not a corporation, so this is more like raising toll road fees for an event.

Man, what a bunch of leeches in Vegas.

 

[RaceBoarder]

Has been for a very, very long time- manhole covers have almost killed drivers in the past. But to not allow Sainz to fix his car when he did nothing wrong (like brush up against a wall), not sure about that. That seems weak. I understand the rule, but how are drivers supposed to know that driving over a metal cover was going to destroy the car?

Yea. I get the bureaucracy of F1 rules and whatnot, but being penalized because of a literal malfunction of the track itself is doing him dirty.

 

[SJHovey]

For those of you who roll your eyes over Vegas- just saw a video that the local airports raised all landing fees to $3000/plane- which is a huge amount for small general aviation. After that was exposed, they lowered it to $750 for small planes, but even that is really high. This is a county agency, not a corporation, so this is more like raising toll road fees for an event.

Man, what a bunch of leeches in Vegas.

Everything that I've read coming out of Vegas is that Vegas considers this the greatest debacle the city has participated in, and that if there is any possible way to have this deal end after this first year, they want that to happen.

 

[Kepler]

Yea. I get the bureaucracy of F1 rules and whatnot, but being penalized because of a literal malfunction of the track itself is doing him dirty.

This is a textbook case of what force majeure is for. I really do not understand how they did not get relief.

 

[Kepler]

Everything that I've read coming out of Vegas is that Vegas considers this the greatest debacle the city has participated in, and that if there is any possible way to have this deal end after this first year, they want that to happen.

I'm surprised by that.

I recognize the drivers, engineers, race fans, and locals are all screwed, but the pols who were bribed, businesses, VIPs, FIA big wigs, and Liberty are all going to make out. That's an unqualified success for the people who matter.

 

[RaceBoarder]

I'm surprised by that.

I recognize the drivers, engineers, race fans, and locals are all screwed, but the pols who were bribed, businesses, VIPs, FIA big wigs, and Liberty are all going to make out. That's an unqualified success for the people who matter.

I think Vegas (as a whole) is realizing how this event is turning the general population off to the town.

For the last 4-6 months, blogs/vlogs have been documenting the problems for visitors to the Strip. It's turning off a lot of people. Many 1st timers aren't booking their 2nd trips in the usual windows because of the sour taste being left. (The hotels/casinos can easily predict general timetables for this and there has been a significant departure from the norm here). They know that they are hurting a crop of consumers that will have a ripple effect for a significant amount of time.

 

[Kepler]

I think Vegas (as a whole) is realizing how this event is turning the general population off to the town.

For the last 4-6 months, blogs/vlogs have been documenting the problems for visitors to the Strip. It's turning off a lot of people. Many 1st timers aren't booking their 2nd trips in the usual windows because of the sour taste being left. (The hotels/casinos can easily predict general timetables for this and there has been a significant departure from the norm here). They know that they are hurting a crop of consumers that will have a ripple effect for a significant amount of time.

That's a good point.

OTOH every flyover who has ever gone to Times Square on New Years Eve has had their pocket picked and then been entrapped in the Badger Game, but that hasn't hurt NYC tourism any. You just make allowances and stay away that week.

 

[SJHovey]

I'm surprised by that.

I recognize the drivers, engineers, race fans, and locals are all screwed, but the pols who were bribed, businesses, VIPs, FIA big wigs, and Liberty are all going to make out. That's an unqualified success for the people who matter.

One of the things you're seeing is there is very limited general benefit getting spread around. There are about 3-4 casinos in Las Vegas that F1 teams, fans or visitors would consider staying at. They aren't staying at Planet Hollywood or Treasure Island or the Flamingo or any places like that.

The exceedingly upscale locations in Vegas are doing fine by the event, but very little of Vegas fits in that category.

 

[Kepler]

One of the things you're seeing is there is very limited general benefit getting spread around. There are about 3-4 casinos in Las Vegas that F1 teams, fans or visitors would consider staying at. They aren't staying at Planet Hollywood or Treasure Island or the Flamingo or any places like that.

The exceedingly upscale locations in Vegas are doing fine by the event, but very little of Vegas fits in that category.

I guess it comes down to who runs the city? Is it Wynn, Venetian, and Bellagio or is it the lower end places that serve 95% of the tourists and employ 95% of the locals?

We've stayed at Golden Nugget and Excaliber -- they were laughably bad (the escorts in the elevators all said hi; they are not attractive) and a lot of fun. Luxor is stupid but was actually nice -- I think it is my favorite.

 

[RaceBoarder]

That's a good point.

OTOH every flyover who has ever gone to Times Square on New Years Eve has had their pocket picked and then been entrapped in the Badger Game, but that hasn't hurt NYC tourism any. You just make allowances and stay away that week.

The issue is that the impact has been much larger than just race week.

The Bellagio Fountains (one of the best "free" things to do) have been down since September and will be through the Holiday season. As Hovey mentioned, it's cutting out many of the low/mid tier travelers that come to the city. And their $$$ adds up over time and is absolutely a key component of that town.

Their economy is based upon people like Handy who drop in 2-4 times per year for 1-3 nights at a time.

 

[unofan]

One of the things you're seeing is there is very limited general benefit getting spread around. There are about 3-4 casinos in Las Vegas that F1 teams, fans or visitors would consider staying at. They aren't staying at Planet Hollywood or Treasure Island or the Flamingo or any places like that.

The exceedingly upscale locations in Vegas are doing fine by the event, but very little of Vegas fits in that category.

It's been a long time since I stayed on the strip; normally I'm either at my parents' house in the western burbs or an airbnb near their house in the western burbs. Last time on the strip was close to 10 years ago, wife and I stayed at Treasure Island for a night before heading to St George and Zion and yeah, it was ok but not F1 euro-fan acceptable (and, ironically, we wound up at the Trump hotel for a night on the way back after Priceline offered a 5-star hotel in the strip for under $100. We'd guessed it was going to be the Trump based the description but couldn't pass up the deal. Nice hotel but gaudy as ****.) But I can't imagine an extra decade has treated since of those hotels well; TI was already looking dated and well-worn 10 years ago.

Probably will avoid the Strip next week when I'm out there for Thanksgiving since whole family will be there. But I'm planning to stay an extra night when i visit my parents again in January to just get one night alone with no parents/kid/etc. Sto just do some gambling, shopping, etc and otherwise get some alone time. Probably will stay on the strip for that one night, so it'll be interesting to see how it's changed.

 

[RaceBoarder]

It's been a long time since I stayed on the strip; normally I'm either at my parents' house in the western burbs or an airbnb near their house in the western burbs. Last time on the strip was close to 10 years ago, wife and I stayed at Treasure Island for a night before heading to St George and Zion and yeah, it was ok but not F1 euro-fan acceptable (and, ironically, we wound up at the Trump hotel for a night on the way back after Priceline offered a 5-star hotel in the strip for under $100. We'd guessed it was going to be the Trump based the description but couldn't pass up the deal. Nice hotel but gaudy as ****.) But I can't imagine an extra decade has treated since of those hotels well; TI was already looking dated and well-worn 10 years ago.

Probably will avoid the Strip next week when I'm out there for Thanksgiving since whole family will be there. But I'm planning to stay an extra night when i visit my parents again in January to just get one night alone with no parents/kid/etc. Sto just do some gambling, shopping, etc and otherwise get some alone time. Probably will stay on the strip for that one night, so it'll be interesting to see how it's changed.

There definitely is a "middle class" hotel level on the strip. Places like Planet Hollywood or the Linq can be found for $100-150/night ("out the door" price w/ resort fees, etc). Solid location and solid rooms. A step above known cheap stays like Excalibur or Luxor.

 

[MichVandal]

I'm surprised by that.

I recognize the drivers, engineers, race fans, and locals are all screwed, but the pols who were bribed, businesses, VIPs, FIA big wigs, and Liberty are all going to make out. That's an unqualified success for the people who matter.

Given how many locals are dealers, bar tenders, servers, cleaners, etc- and there is a union, they kind of matter a lot. Let alone they are the ones who will decide elections, so if they want to find a new set of leadership who will end this, they can.

That's why the tip amounts for all of them is a really big deal. If they get a huge amount of tip income for this struggle, then they will tolerate it. If not....

 

[aparch]

I suppose being a brand new street circuit, all of the covers/plates weren't fully mapped out and this one just slipped through the cracks so to speak. I assume that it's still S.O.P. to weld them into place for the weekend?

All those streets were repaved and manholes adjusted (or should have been) prior to the repave. The engineering firm (or I guess Clark County / City of Vegas Public Works) should have had documentation where each and every structure was located.

On top of that, F1, *at a minimum* should have had a walk through of the track the day prior to activity with a contractor on hand for last minute issues like this to be resolved.

If this is F1's deal (as I've seen) and they don't have a middle man putting this event on, this is 100% on F1.



What's embarrassing is that the NASCAR race in Chicago was commended for not having issues like this when I could d*mn well see clear as day during the broadcast there were structures and other imperfections where the contractor took shortcuts or structures weren't adjusted correctly.

 

[Kepler]

Given how many locals are dealers, bar tenders, servers, cleaners, etc- and there is a union, they kind of matter a lot. Let alone they are the ones who will decide elections, so if they want to find a new set of leadership who will end this, they can.

That's why the tip amounts for all of them is a really big deal. If they get a huge amount of tip income for this struggle, then they will tolerate it. If not....

Well the Eruos don't tip.