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Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

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Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

Old Pio said:
Typically "clever" of you to change the subject to "criticizing a republican," and not the zero credibility of Arianna "I swear I didn't know he was gay, but was pretty certain he was incredibly rich" Huffington. Won't work. Your standards for Bush bashing are nonexistant. Anybody, anywhere can say anything critical about Bush and it's gospel to you. It doesn't matter much, except your perpetual snarkiness becomes a bit of a bore, especially when not tethered in the slightest to truth or accuracy. And when you engage in your typical intellectual blowhardism, quoting Prince Henry the Navigator's comments. 'Course he's contemptuous of America too, which makes him your favorite 18th (or was it 19th) century Portuguese "intellectual."

As victims of your posts can attest, in your mind "patriotism" is the ultimate sin. You snark about it every chance you get. I know, believe me, I know. In Kepler world, saying something, anything positive about America is "political," to be ridiculed and rejected--even if (or perhaps because) it's said on the 4th of July.
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Why so serious? Anyway, to address your silliness in roughly your order:

1) The "cleverness" was all on your side, son. You were the one who threw in the gratuitous "insult America" line that had literally nothing to do with the discussion.

2) Arianna is most certainly part of the same boobocracy as all the righties who fellate each other on hate radio nightly. It's a straw man to draw the attention over there when NO ONE is defending her. There's even a fancy-pants pointed-headed Amurka-hatin' latin name for that logic error, but we'll just call it the Magpie Strategy. And, as you say... it won't work. Try sticking to the point.

3) Firstly: I don't think you want to throw the perpetual snarkiness stone in this glass house. Not only you but a half dozen of your "my party, right or wrong" types would find that pretty embarrassing. Secondly: call the wahbulance.

4) To be fair, the standards of my Bush-bashing are non-existent. Dude's a stain on the nation, and that makes me mad.

5) "Patriotism" as respect for our country's ideals is wonderful, justified, should be celebrated. "Patriotism" as "wrap the flag around my particular parochial political tropes" is as inane for an American as it is for any other nationality -- pure dopiness -- even (especially) if it's done on July 4th. And you know that -- it's just a very easy short iron to pull out when the logical ground of your argument is caving in and you need a little raw emotional poutrage to save the day. "While it may be true that historically low top marginal tax rates have contributed to the deficit... whoa... kittens!!! We can all agree on kittens!!!" Spare us; that works on the mental deficients in the CPAC crowd but not here.

Throughout) Playing the elitism card has become a bit of a hobby for you guys, hasn't it? It's your own version of the Class War. Well, I guess once you vamp being on the side of the "little guy" even with your economics of the elites, you can fake anything. :)
 
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Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

Boys! Be nice! Otherwise:
timeout.gif
 
Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

Even when P. J. O'Rourke is wrong he's sensible. Here is he in typical form.

We will win an election when all the seats in the House and Senate and the chair behind the desk in the Oval Office and the whole bench of the Supreme Court are filled with people who wish they weren’t there.
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Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

When did Japan become a debtor nation? I vaguely remembered they were creditor nation before the boom and crash of their real estate market.

$7trillion 170% of GDP 2nd highest in the World.

Debt-as-pct-of-GDP-2008.gif


http://www.csmonitor.com/Commentary/Opinion/2010/0812/When-Japan-s-debt-bubble-bursts-watch-out
For the next 20 years, using flashy names like Fiscal Structural Reform Act, and Emergency Employment Measures, and Policy Measures of Economic Rebirth, the government cut taxes, increased spending, and borrowed money to finance itself. Once or twice the government found fiscal religion and raised taxes; however, the economy stuttered and taxes again were lowered and the stimulus story continued.

Today, 20 years into endless stimuli, the Japanese economy is beset by the same rot it was then, except that its debt has tripled – the ratio of debt to gross domestic product (GDP) stands at almost 200 percent, double those of the United States and Germany, and second only to Zimbabwe.

Washington should take heed, because the current US course is disturbingly similar to Japan's. There are several key lessons from Japan's decline, but the most important one is this: We must stop looking for government to be the source of sustainable growth.
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Though debt has tripled over the past two decades, government spending on interest payments has not changed; in fact it even declined a little in the mid-2000s. This happened because the government's average interest rate paid on its debt declined from more than 6 percent in the 1990s to 1.4 percent in 2009.

This is about to change. Historically, more than 90 percent of Japanese government-issued debt was consumed internally by its citizens, directly or through its pension system. In the 1990s, the savings rate was very high, pushing the mid-teens, but as people get older, they retire and start drawing down their savings and pensions. Today, the Japanese savings rate is approaching zero, and will probably go negative in the not-so-distant future.
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Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

Old Pio said:
Didn't your heroine, the lady who was "unaware" that her husband was as gay as a birthday tablecloth
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Old Pio said:
Typically "clever" of you to change the subject to "criticizing a republican," and not the zero credibility of Arianna "I swear I didn't know he was gay, but was pretty certain he was incredibly rich" Huffington
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Dude, between this and the shots you take at Maddow for being a lesbian I have to ask...what is your deal with always talking about gay people?
 
Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

Handyman said:
Dude, between this and the shots you take at Maddow for being a lesbian I have to ask...what is your deal with always talking about gay people?
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In a discussion about Ariana Huffington's credibility, isn't it perfectly sensible to bring up that example?
 
Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

Fix the deficit!

One guy did it in this way.

1. Eliminated earmarks ($14 billion)

2. Cut the pay of civilian workers by 5 percent ($17 billion)

3. Reduced the federal workforce by 10 percent ($15 billion)

4. Reduced nuclear arsenal and space spending ($38 billion)

5. Reduce military to pre-Iraq War size and further reduce troops in Asia and Europe ($49 billion)

6. Reduce Navy and Air Force fleets ($24 billion)

7. Cancel or delay some weapons programs ($18 billion)

8. Reduce the number of troops in Iraq and Afghanistan to 60,000 by 2015 ($149 billion)

9. Enact medical malpractice reform ($13 billion)

10. Increase the Medicare eligibility age to 68 ($56 billion)

11. Reduce the tax break for employer-provided health insurance ($157 billion)

12. Cap Medicare growth starting in 2013 ($562 billion)

13. Raise the Social Security retirement age to 70 ($247 billion)

14. Reduce Social Security benefits for those with high incomes ($54 billion)

15. Tighten eligibility for disability ($17 billion)

16. Use an alternate measure for inflation ($82 billion)
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Not sure if I can find any problems with any of those measures, though cutting the federal workforce by 10% might be tricky.
 
Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

12. Cap Medicare growth starting in 2013 ($562 billion)
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This is where the lion's share of the savings comes from -- what does it mean? How do you "cap growth" -- phase out coverage for people who have been paying into the system for 30 years? Cut everybody's benefits across the board?

16. Use an alternate measure for inflation ($82 billion)
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Did he just claim as a savings "cook the books"? (Edit: no, I see what he means -- essentially, change the metric to drive down COLA)

I love the idea of the simulator, though. There are lots of good political sims out there where you have to do this... and get re-elected. THAT'S tough! :)
 
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Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

WeWantMore said:
In a discussion about Ariana Huffington's credibility, isn't it perfectly sensible to bring up that example?
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I never said it wasn't...but it is something I noticed with Old Pio where he feels the need to interject some sort of passive agressive gay comment and I was wondering why.

I should note though, I have never seen him do that with any of the outed gay Republicans, but that is probably a coincidence :p
 
Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

I fixed the deficit, too. It took 11 minutes.

Eliminate earmarks
Eliminate farm subsidies
Reduce nuclear arsenal and space spending
Reduce military to pre-Iraq War size and further reduce troops in Asia and Europe
Reduce Navy and Air Force fleets
Cancel or delay some weapons programs
Reduce the number of troops in Iraq and Afghanistan to 30,000 by 2013
Increase the Medicare eligibility age to 70
Raise the Social Security retirement age to 70
Reduce Social Security benefits for those with high incomes
Return the estate tax to Clinton-era levels
Return capital gains tax rates to Clinton-era levels
Allow expiration of Bush tax cuts for income above $250,000 a year
Payroll tax: Subject some incomes above $106,000 to tax
Millionaire's tax on income above $1 million
Eliminate loopholes, but keep taxes slightly higher than Bowles-Simpson
Bank Tax

Saved $668 billion for a budget surplus of $250 billion in 2015
Saved $1.6 trillion for a budget surplus of $260 billion in 2030

Next?
 
Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

WeWantMore said:
Fix the deficit!
Not sure if I can find any problems with any of those measures, though cutting the federal workforce by 10% might be tricky.
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Can't remember everything I picked at the moment, but I know it involved 37% tax increases and 63% spending cuts. I didn't cut the military quite as much and left the federal workforce intact, but added the carbon tax and eliminated the Bush tax cuts for everyone. Social Security and medicare both got fixed roughly the same as quoted, though.
 
Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

Pshaw. Both of you are taxaholics.:D

Cuts are the answer. Cut cut cut.
 
Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

Handyman said:
I never said it wasn't...but it is something I noticed with Old Pio where he feels the need to interject some sort of passive agressive gay comment and I was wondering why.

I should note though, I have never seen him do that with any of the outed gay Republicans, but that is probably a coincidence :p
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Hot on the trail are you, Sherlock? Let me ask YOU a question: even though he's long gone from the Senate I'm still reading and seeing lefty references to Larry Craig. But nary a peep about Barney Frank, who's still in congress, and until January chairman of a committee. And still the one time proprietor of that charming home based personal services business. Why no cracks about Barney? Why the need to focus on Craig?
 
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Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

Handyman said:
Dude, between this and the shots you take at Maddow for being a lesbian I have to ask...what is your deal with always talking about gay people?
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Isn't this a major issue and rallying cry for the social conservative. gays, military, marriage, abortion. only if you could channel this emotional zeal into fiscal "problem".

gay marriage, gays in the military, gays marrying in the military, gay is military, marriage is gay, military gay marriage
 
Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

I was wrong about Japan being a debtor nation. I guess they still own more assets overseas than owe by about $1trillion... since 90% of their debt ($9trillion) is held by Japanese.

From that chart it's clear it's not the Debt to GDP that triggers crisis, since Greece went under with much less debt2GDP, it's the country ability to finance the debt. Japan is able to finance at 1.5 percent while Greece is forced to borrow at 10 percent.

Looks like Roubini nailed it with this comment in April 2010. We're really printing money now.

http://www.csmonitor.com/Commentary...risis-is-only-the-tip-of-the-iceberg/(page)/2
If the Republicans take control of the House of Representatives in the next election and refuse any revenue increases while the Democrats veto spending cuts, the path of least resistance will be runaway fiscal deficits that will then be monetized by the Federal Reserve, which has already embarked on this path. In just the last year alone, the Federal Reserve has bought $1.8 trillion of Treasury securities and agency debt, a course that will inevitably lead to high inflation if sustained. It is what is popularly known as printing money.
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Re: Obama XVII: Do You Take Your Tea Party with One Sugar or Two?

Tundra said:
Isn't this a major issue and rallying cry for the social conservative. gays, military, marriage, abortion. only if you could channel this emotional zeal into fiscal "problem".

gay marriage, gays in the military, gays marrying in the military, gay is military, marriage is gay, military gay marriage
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That would be a relevant post (regarding me) if I were a social conservative and if I hadn't posted several times that I favor a repeal of the restrictions on gays in the military. But you go right ahead with your ignorant prejudices, hear?
 
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