Nescac 10 - 11

[obserbear]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

Let's be honest, that may be the case, but by all accounts, coaching will become the issue.....

Do you mean you expect Midd will win the NCAA again this season??? We all know Coach Mandigo is a legend in his own time (why I heard he shot the panther that is on display in the Kenyon entrance...). I am sure last season was disappointing (kind of like the Yankees that way); with a little more size and toughness I expect Midd to be right there (as they always seem to be).

 

[NHDad]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

Let's be honest, that may be the case, but by all accounts, coaching will become the issue.....

I'm not sure what prompted this comment, but I would love to hear more...

 

[Phil D. Stands]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

...from obserbear... (he prolly shot the panther in his pj's -- how he got in his pj's, we'll never know).. good stuff, bear!

 

[puxrex]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

Is Amherst the only NESCAC school going the transfer route to get around the admissions hurdle or are there others? The Amherst men's hockey program has used this tactic quite effectively.

 

[dontyelldad]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

Is Amherst the only NESCAC school going the transfer route to get around the admissions hurdle or are there others? The Amherst men's hockey program has used this tactic quite effectively.

Well, from the Amherst website, it looks like last year, the men's team had 2 transfers, 1 who left West Point after one semester and one transfer from Holy Cross. Most everyone else on the team played prep or juniors or both.

On the women's team, there's one transfer.

Doesn't look to me like a significant "tactic" and I doubt seriously if the admissions requirements are relaxed significantly for transfers, at least not at Amherst.

 

[obserbear]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

Is Amherst the only NESCAC school going the transfer route to get around the admissions hurdle or are there others? The Amherst men's hockey program has used this tactic quite effectively.

It is hard to imagine the primary motivation in tranferring to a NESCAC school such as Amherst (costing upwards of $50,000 per year) to be playing hockey (even if they are 2 time defending NCAA champs). It is probably something much more compelling, like the color of those purple sweaters or the pizza or maybe even the educational opportunity.

 

[JONESTEST]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

Well said...I sense some sarcasm..

 

[dontyelldad]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

It is hard to imagine the primary motivation in tranferring to a NESCAC school such as Amherst (costing upwards of $50,000 per year) to be playing hockey (even if they are 2 time defending NCAA champs). It is probably something much more compelling, like the color of those purple sweaters or the pizza or maybe even the educational opportunity.

Funny you should mention "educational opportunity." The Amherst Men's team published a media guide last year that is on the website. They list hockey alumni for the men's team. I looked at the last 5 years, and there were 3 alums who were playing or had played professional hockey (Italy, Germany and Corpus Christi). 4 med school students and a bunch of investment bankers.

Would be nice if they did the same for the women's team.

 

[Phil D. Stands]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

Well said...I sense some sarcasm..

The 'bear might be a mite ornery coming out of hibernation -- he just needs to get a few games under his belt, but his early season sarcasm is to be savored as the fresh yet fruity nouveau beaujolais that it is -- hinting at a bevy of rich vintage offerings in what is sure to be an INCREDIBLE year -- cheers!!! ....(purple pizza indeed!)

 

[puxrex]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

Transfers do not show up in the regular admission stats for gpa and test scores. They are not considered recruited "tips" either. It's a handy way to fill a few holes that you many not be able to fill via the regular admissions process. One to two transfers every year can make a significant difference. All NESCAC schools do it to some degree. Some more than others.

 

[spike]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

I think this discussion runs parallel with the thread related to the DI transfers that have shown up at Platty this year. The perennially successful DIII hockey programs are successful because they attract talented players. In women's college hockey, many of those players have DI and DIII options. It does not surprise me that many of these women will go DI and then transfer to a DIII school. Once a player decides to go from DI to DIII, if her reasons are based on playing time, an academically "lateral" move to a school like Plattsburgh makes sense. However, IMHO nobody goes to a NESCAC school unless academics are at or near the top of their priorities. I guess we'll never know if these transfers got into the NESCAC with below standard qualifications. Perhaps someone who knows a kid like Sarah Plunkett could weigh in on this. She transferred from Colgate to Williams for two years. If she was looking for playing time I would guess she could have gone to a number of other schools with more competitive hockey teams. Did Williams relax their admission standards to get her? I would tend to doubt it.

 

[FranchisePlayer]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

I think this discussion runs parallel with the thread related to the DI transfers that have shown up at Platty this year. The perennially successful DIII hockey programs are successful because they attract talented players. In women's college hockey, many of those players have DI and DIII options. It does not surprise me that many of these women will go DI and then transfer to a DIII school. Once a player decides to go from DI to DIII, if her reasons are based on playing time, an academically "lateral" move to a school like Plattsburgh makes sense. However, IMHO nobody goes to a NESCAC school unless academics are at or near the top of their priorities. I guess we'll never know if these transfers got into the NESCAC with below standard qualifications. Perhaps someone who knows a kid like Sarah Plunkett could weigh in on this. She transferred from Colgate to Williams for two years. If she was looking for playing time I would guess she could have gone to a number of other schools with more competitive hockey teams. Did Williams relax their admission standards to get her? I would tend to doubt it.

Plunkett graduated from St. George's School, which is a member of New England's ISL (think NESCAC, but for prep schools). St. George's students regularly matriculate to NESCAC and Ivy League schools...

 

[obserbear]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

I just took a quick look at the '09-'10 NESCAC women's rosters and it appears Ms. Plunkett was the only rostered DI tranfer this past season. It may be more common practice on the men's side, but such transfers are rare in NESCAC women's hockey. Bowdoin's biggest DI transfer was Kristi Anderson taking her 33 point sophmore season and leaving for Dartmouth. Bear in mind, the transfer process can have a big impact on financial assistance.

 

[Phil D. Stands]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

Bear in mind, the transfer process can have a big impact on financial assistance.

et voila! ...de bon mot...c'est magnifique, cet our avec son vin jeune!

 

[d3follower]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

Transfers do not show up in the regular admission stats for gpa and test scores. They are not considered recruited "tips" either. It's a handy way to fill a few holes that you many not be able to fill via the regular admissions process. One to two transfers every year can make a significant difference. All NESCAC schools do it to some degree. Some more than others.

I've been told by a NESCAC coach that transfers do count for "tips" but I believe that they do manage to evade the requirement to report SAT scores because those usually are not required for transfer applicants . .

 

[ONR]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

I've been told by a NESCAC coach that transfers do count for "tips" but I believe that they do manage to evade the requirement to report SAT scores because those usually are not required for transfer applicants . .

What is/are "tips"?

 

[d3follower]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

What is/are "tips"?

"Tips" are recommendations that NESCAC coaches make to the admissions department that give athletes a slight break in the admissions process. Each NESCAC school regulates and limits the number of tips, with that number varying slightly from school to school (typically about 70/year give or take a few in either direction) and the tips being allocated among the sports by the Athletic Dep't based on team needs for the upcoming year. There are 3 categories of tips, consisting of C-band, B-band, and A-band tips, with C-band reserved for the best athletes ("impact" players) who need the most help in the admissions process. Roughly speaking, an A-band tip would ensure the athlete's admission over a non-athlete, all other things being equal; a B-band tip would give a bump to, and ensure the admission of, an athlete who is very close to the typical admittee for the school in qualifications but slightly below; the C-band tip would give a fairly substantial bump to an "impact" athlete (projected to be a 4-year starter) who would otherwise not be admitted (roughly speaking a B+ student with SAT's in the 1900 range (with slight variations in either direction depending on the school). The typical NESCAC hockey program is allocated roughly 4/5 tips/year, with 1 (maybe 2 in some cases) being for C-band tips.

 

[Mr. Kitty]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

I just took a quick look at the '09-'10 NESCAC women's rosters and it appears Ms. Plunkett was the only rostered DI tranfer this past season. It may be more common practice on the men's side, but such transfers are rare in NESCAC women's hockey. Bowdoin's biggest DI transfer was Kristi Anderson taking her 33 point sophmore season and leaving for Dartmouth. Bear in mind, the transfer process can have a big impact on financial assistance.

I am not sure by what you mean about the transfer process having an impact on financial assistance. Do you mean a transfer is less likely, or more likely to get some financial bump from the admitting school? Or are you saying that transfers decide where to matriculate based on their financial aid offerings?

 

[FranchisePlayer]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

"Tips" are recommendations that NESCAC coaches make to the admissions department that give athletes a slight break in the admissions process. Each NESCAC school regulates and limits the number of tips, with that number varying slightly from school to school (typically about 70/year give or take a few in either direction) and the tips being allocated among the sports by the Athletic Dep't based on team needs for the upcoming year. There are 3 categories of tips, consisting of C-band, B-band, and A-band tips, with C-band reserved for the best athletes ("impact" players) who need the most help in the admissions process. Roughly speaking, an A-band tip would ensure the athlete's admission over a non-athlete, all other things being equal; a B-band tip would give a bump to, and ensure the admission of, an athlete who is very close to the typical admittee for the school in qualifications but slightly below; the C-band tip would give a fairly substantial bump to an "impact" athlete (projected to be a 4-year starter) who would otherwise not be admitted (roughly speaking a B+ student with SAT's in the 1900 range (with slight variations in either direction depending on the school). The typical NESCAC hockey program is allocated roughly 4/5 tips/year, with 1 (maybe 2 in some cases) being for C-band tips.

Great explanation. Also, gives some perspective into just how amazing it is that the top NESCACs (Amherst, Bowdoin, Middlebury) perform so well nationally given the very high/difficult admissions standards that they have (the B+/1900 threshold) with relatively few exceptions granted for athletes.

 

[spike]

Re: Nescac 10 - 11

Great explanation. Also, gives some perspective into just how amazing it is that the top NESCACs (Amherst, Bowdoin, Middlebury) perform so well nationally given the very high/difficult admissions standards that they have (the B+/1900 threshold) with relatively few exceptions granted for athletes.

Not for nothing but over a year ago Plumer told me that the only "C's" that get into Amherst and Middlebury are on the football team and men's hockey teams. Makes it even more amazing that these schools can compete so effectively on a national scale in Women's hockey.