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nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

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Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

Cause the mortality rate of this is so much higher. Are you some sort of frickin' idiot? You need this spelled out for you?

The current known mortality rate is higher. Once it plays out, then we will know the actual one, including how many people get it and have no idea- to the point that we will never know they even had it.

Heck, you could be a carrier RIGHT NOW you frrikin' idiot.
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

My USG customer (who is enormous) just banned all non-essential foreign travel to all countries.
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

The current known mortality rate is higher. Once it plays out, then we will know the actual one, including how many people get it and have no idea- to the point that we will never know they even had it.

Heck, you could be a carrier RIGHT NOW you frrikin' idiot.
? They have come out increasing the rate of fatalities, not decreasing rate.
I am really confused why you are being so obtuse. Is it going to kill everyone? No. It is, however, going to cause significant disruption and as things heat up you better pray you live in a n area where there is a strong healthcare system because not many places have the ability to handle the volume

And as I type the # is up to 10 deaths. Not many yet but Americans are, well, Americans. They aren't real clever about thinking of the consequences or caring about the other guy. No matter how many people are asymptomatic it doesn't negate what happens when they get sick.
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

If you have COVID you need to be identified and if you are medically compromised then you are admitted. We do not have the capacity to hospitalize and quarantine every patient. That is why Wuhan had so many problems. You self quarantine and wait to be better unless you are medically in trouble.

All this shows a total lack of leadership on the part of the COVID Confusion Czar and the HHS. This info should be saturating the media of all sorts. Instead they have multiple campaigns of misinformation and the DUmp still trying to pedal the nonsense of meds and a vaccine soon. :mad:

So it comes back to the community needs to know if you have covid19, but until you are really sick, it's not much help to an individual.

Again, to the person who decided that they needed to test themselves- that should be part of the healthcare system to test and contain, not up to each individual in the US.

It's shocking to me that there are federal restrictions on who can even be tested. That's totally insane from a public health standpoint. Dumpy made this issue political, it's time he gets it back in his face.
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

? They have come out increasing the rate of fatalities, not decreasing rate.
I am really confused why you are being so obtuse. Is it going to kill everyone? No. It is, however, going to cause significant disruption and as things heat up you better pray you live in a n area where there is a strong healthcare system because not many places have the ability to handle the volume

And as I type the # is up to 10 deaths. Not many yet but Americans are, well, Americans. They aren't real clever about thinking of the consequences or caring about the other guy. No matter how many people are asymptomatic it doesn't negate what happens when they get sick.

I was called a name because I'm asking a real question that some people think I should know already. I'm not being obtuse vs. recognizing that we know less about this than we actually are sure about- which something nobody wants to admit.

Even if this is has a higher mortality rate than influenza, how would knowing that help me, personally vs. the overall community? It would not help me, personally, at all. However, it would help society out immensely. Therefore ALL OF US should share the burden of people being tested. And insurance companies who refuse to pay for it should be forced out of business, as they are clearly in the for profit game over the public heath game.

If I get sick, I will contact my provider to see what they want to do, but plan on staying home until I have serious problems- as I'm sure there are many other people who would need that bed more than me. I've seen what hospitals can do for norovirus, for now, I expect the same kind of response.
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

I'm just surprised an insurance company had the gall to pull that stunt. I know they're evil and should probably be fired into the sun just to be sure, but that's really not a good look.

Maybe this was an opening offer to see how much they can make off of this. I hope this is the beginning of the end for private.
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

So it comes back to the community needs to know if you have covid19, but until you are really sick, it's not much help to an individual.

Again, to the person who decided that they needed to test themselves- that should be part of the healthcare system to test and contain, not up to each individual in the US.

It's shocking to me that there are federal restrictions on who can even be tested. That's totally insane from a public health standpoint. Dumpy made this issue political, it's time he gets it back in his face.

Not going to keep hoeing the row. If you still think it isn't important to know on an individual level then reading comprehension is not your strong suit but go you.

IMO the restrictions were because we were completely and woefully unprepared on any level to respond to this. The Dump disbanded the program that handles this stuff and no one was minding the house. We didn't have the capacity to test so they tried to ration. Then they distributed a test that was useless. There are a bunch of places formulating tests- It apparently is not that hard but they don't want a bunch of cowboys going out without some sort of oversight
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

There has been some evidence that certain antivirals may be effective. As more data points are available I think you might see some recommendations but it is really a Hail Mary pass

I read somewhere -- don't know how true it is -- that in the worst cases, China has been prescribing the same anti-viral regiment as you would for an HIV patient. Apparently, it has worked. But, that is one heck of treatment to throw at people.

There has been medication for flu for years. It was over-used and resistance occurred that turned out to be quite significant. New med is out now- costly. Has side effects.

When my wife had shingles, which was very painful for her, the doctor prescribed antiviral medicine to hopefully lesson the effect of the shingles. Instead, she developed bedridden, debilitating, horrible headaches. The doctor told her to stop taking the medicine right away. The side effects of antiviral medicines can be very bad for some people.
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

I was called a name because I'm asking a real question that some people think I should know already. I'm not being obtuse vs. recognizing that we know less about this than we actually are sure about- which something nobody wants to admit.

Even if this is has a higher mortality rate than influenza, how would knowing that help me, personally vs. the overall community? It would not help me, personally, at all. However, it would help society out immensely. Therefore ALL OF US should share the burden of people being tested. And insurance companies who refuse to pay for it should be forced out of business, as they are clearly in the for profit game over the public heath game.

If I get sick, I will contact my provider to see what they want to do, but plan on staying home until I have serious problems- as I'm sure there are many other people who would need that bed more than me. I've seen what hospitals can do for norovirus, for now, I expect the same kind of response.

Until we know how this thing is spreading, we need all the information we can get. I'm not sure why this is so hard. You're not a dumb person, but you're making a dumb argument. Right now we need to know how fast this is spreading and where it has spread. We need to know nationwide. This helps direct critical resources and leaders adapt their response, especially locally.

This is the current situation. In two months when this has spread like wildfire, we won't be testing everyone anymore, just the most at-risk patients. But right now it's a pandemic that requires both medical treatment for the patient and an information/resource response at the local, state, and federal level. We need to know if we should start closing down universities and schools preemptively. We need business leaders to have the right information to tell their employees something (anything!) about how to respond and how to isolate. We need to know where to send the most facemasks, artificial respirators, oxygen, and other needed supplies.

On top of all of that, we still dont' have a good grasp at how this thing spreads. We have a solid theory (droplets) with a few loose ends (fecal, airborne, eye, GI, etc.) that need to be tied up. We also need to know if symptoms are necessary for it to be contagious (this is still developing in the literature despite what anyone in the media says) and we need to know the typical vs. complete incubation period.
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

Not going to keep hoeing the row. If you still think it isn't important to know on an individual level then reading comprehension is not your strong suit but go you.

IMO the restrictions were because we were completely and woefully unprepared on any level to respond to this. The Dump disbanded the program that handles this stuff and no one was minding the house. We didn't have the capacity to test so they tried to ration. Then they distributed a test that was useless. There are a bunch of places formulating tests- It apparently is not that hard but they don't want a bunch of cowboys going out without some sort of oversight

Thank you for that note.

Other than telling me off, and the hints at some possible anti-viral meds that have very questionable efficacy but with nasty side effect, nobody has actually written down how it benefits an individual to know they have this specific virus, when compared to the general community needing to know. Is that such a hard question to answer? Apparently it is...

Have fun debating this.....
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

Not going to keep hoeing the row. If you still think it isn't important to know on an individual level then reading comprehension is not your strong suit but go you.

IMO the restrictions were because we were completely and woefully unprepared on any level to respond to this. The Dump disbanded the program that handles this stuff and no one was minding the house. We didn't have the capacity to test so they tried to ration. Then they distributed a test that was useless. There are a bunch of places formulating tests- It apparently is not that hard but they don't want a bunch of cowboys going out without some sort of oversight

They didn't even update testing guidelines until people started dying in the US. I think they kept the testing guidelines the same (only people who traveled to Wuhan and were symptomatic) from Valentine's day to around Feb 27 or 28.

There has been zero adaptation. At this point, it's in the hands of the states because the feds are treating this like a photo op and not a national crisis like it should have been.
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

I read somewhere -- don't know how true it is -- that in the worst cases, China has been prescribing the same anti-viral regiment as you would for an HIV patient. Apparently, it has worked. But, that is one heck of treatment to throw at people.



When my wife had shingles, which was very painful for her, the doctor prescribed antiviral medicine to hopefully lesson the effect of the shingles. Instead, she developed bedridden, debilitating, horrible headaches. The doctor told her to stop taking the medicine right away. The side effects of antiviral medicines can be very bad for some people.
Thanks. I read that too but I also can't remember exactly what they were using. If I recall they were treating as desperation and no way to know what was the cause of the improvement.

Too bad about your wife. I prescribed antivirals for yrs and for the most part they were well tolerated. It was unusual for someone to discontinue from side effects. Trouble is they work better the sooner you start them. (not supposed to start them past 72h unless that has changed in the last yr or 2). Waiting to see if you are going to 'need them' defeats the purpose. Having seen people have totally debilitating post herpetic neuralgia I would take it unless I couldn't tolerate.
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

Until we know how this thing is spreading, we need all the information we can get. I'm not sure why this is so hard. You're not a dumb person, but you're making a dumb argument. Right now we need to know how fast this is spreading and where it has spread. We need to know nationwide. This helps direct critical resources and leaders adapt their response, especially locally.

This is the current situation. In two months when this has spread like wildfire, we won't be testing everyone anymore, just the most at-risk patients. But right now it's a pandemic that requires both medical treatment for the patient and an information/resource response at the local, state, and federal level. We need to know if we should start closing down universities and schools preemptively. We need business leaders to have the right information to tell their employees something (anything!) about how to respond and how to isolate. We need to know where to send the most facemasks, artificial respirators, oxygen, and other needed supplies.

On top of all of that, we still dont' have a good grasp at how this thing spreads. We have a solid theory (droplets) with a few loose ends (fecal, airborne, eye, GI, etc.) that need to be tied up. We also need to know if symptoms are necessary for it to be contagious (this is still developing in the literature despite what anyone in the media says) and we need to know the typical vs. complete incubation period.

WE yes. Not I.

I'm not making a dumb argument, I'm making a point that we should all be sharing in the testing whenever possible, and it should not be a question of an individual's healthcare coverage who pays for it. It's not called Public Health for nothing.
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

Thank you for that note.

Other than telling me off, and the hints at some possible anti-viral meds that have very questionable efficacy but with nasty side effect, nobody has actually written down how it benefits an individual to know they have this specific virus, when compared to the general community needing to know. Is that such a hard question to answer? Apparently it is...

Have fun debating this.....

Because they need to know to isolate properly. If you have the common cold, you are going to be treated like a leper outside, but there really isn't much risk to you or others. If you have this virus, which might present similar to a common cold in younger people, you need to know that you have to isolate yourself for 14+ days to prevent the spread and not have contact with any at risk individuals. It's not always about the individual, it's about doing what's right for everyone.
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

Dr. Mrs., who has MS, had this conversation with her neurologist yesterday:

"I'm concerned about COVID-19. You told me my MS medication suppresses my immune system responses."

"Yes, it does."

"Does that mean I should stop my treatments for now to rebuild my immune system?"

"Well, here are your choices. If you stop treatment then your immune system will slowly rebuild, so your likelihood of COVID-19 contagion will slowly decrease. However, without treatment your odds of MS flare-ups will increase, and with each flare-up you risk cognitive deterioration."

(pause) "So, I can be at risk of getting sick and maybe dying, or I can decrease my odds of getting sick but then increase my risk of becoming a vegetable?"

"Kind of."

"Which do you recommend?"

"It's your decision, I can only tell you the options."

"Well, what are the probabilities of the different risks?"

"Literally nobody knows."
 
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Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

Luckily I am not diabetic, my weight is under control, my heart is strong, my blood pressure is fairly normal, I'm young, and don't have a history of renal disease, I have good insurance.

On the other hand, I have a form of asthma so I will be taking zero chances with this. Some reports give a CFR of 8% for those with chronic respiratory conditions. I'm not sure mine fully qualifies as it's exercise-induced, but I don't like the idea of rolling a die if I become infected. It's absolutely terrifying for someone like me, I can't even imagine being 60+.
 
Re: nCoV 2019-2020 Outbreak

This is a punch in the gut. I know we've never met and all, but I'm really sorry to hear you're dealing with this, comrade.

Appreciated. She's a tough desert girl. MS is in for the fight of its life. I don't envy it.
 
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