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Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
- Thread starter ticapnews
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Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
I'm judging by the sh-t at the theater.
But I am sure the comic books you love are the exception and show only the highest and most subtle appreciation of a full human experience.
I'm judging by the sh-t at the theater.
But I am sure the comic books you love are the exception and show only the highest and most subtle appreciation of a full human experience.
St. Clown
Liberal Rebel Scum, apparently
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
The bad guys in many comic books tend to simply be evil McGuffins, setting up the parable of whatever story they're telling. Often that's lost in the movie versions, or completely altered for a simpler story - not that they're overly complex in the first place.
Thinking of stories that have become movies, The X-Men started as an anti-bigotry story during the times of the Civil Rights movement. Alan Moore's The Watchmen was twofold; first, it was about the perils and fear that created certain untenable situations surrounding nuclear war, and also unchecked authoritarian power. Spider-Man was simply relating teen fear and a certain amount of whimsy.
The bad guys in many comic books tend to simply be evil McGuffins, setting up the parable of whatever story they're telling. Often that's lost in the movie versions, or completely altered for a simpler story - not that they're overly complex in the first place.
Thinking of stories that have become movies, The X-Men started as an anti-bigotry story during the times of the Civil Rights movement. Alan Moore's The Watchmen was twofold; first, it was about the perils and fear that created certain untenable situations surrounding nuclear war, and also unchecked authoritarian power. Spider-Man was simply relating teen fear and a certain amount of whimsy.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
They do as much as any movie you love or any book that has been written in the past 200 years. (and not nearly as verbose and heavy handed) Just because it may have a character in it dressed in a costume doesnt change that. It isnt like literary characters dont wear costumes
Most of the better comic book stories arent made into movies because they require people to think, and even when they are they are adapted in ways that change the story. (V for Vendetta or Watchmen for example) Arguably the best Iron Man story is "Demon in a Bottle" where he goes into full blown alcoholism and has to deal with the repercussions of that. Green Arrow had his sidekick become a heroin addict in the 1970s and a Black Green Lantern (Jon Stewart) came about because in the comics the black community didnt think Hal Jordan cared about them.
Then again even in the mindless stories that get put on film you can find some pretty good themes. You for some reason refuse to look at it out of some old man need to act like a young hipster but that doesnt change the fact that it is there
Not all of the stories are four color generic stories worthy of Adam West 
(but yes there were plenty)
Put it this way...comic books are better at telling real stories than say James Bond stories ever were yet I dont see you ripping them too much
They do as much as any movie you love or any book that has been written in the past 200 years. (and not nearly as verbose and heavy handed) Just because it may have a character in it dressed in a costume doesnt change that. It isnt like literary characters dont wear costumes
Most of the better comic book stories arent made into movies because they require people to think, and even when they are they are adapted in ways that change the story. (V for Vendetta or Watchmen for example) Arguably the best Iron Man story is "Demon in a Bottle" where he goes into full blown alcoholism and has to deal with the repercussions of that. Green Arrow had his sidekick become a heroin addict in the 1970s and a Black Green Lantern (Jon Stewart) came about because in the comics the black community didnt think Hal Jordan cared about them.
Then again even in the mindless stories that get put on film you can find some pretty good themes. You for some reason refuse to look at it out of some old man need to act like a young hipster but that doesnt change the fact that it is there
Not all of the stories are four color generic stories worthy of Adam West (but yes there were plenty)Put it this way...comic books are better at telling real stories than say James Bond stories ever were yet I dont see you ripping them too much
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
Not to Handy. To Handy, all art is equal. And if you suggest maybe Hamlet is better than Stephenie Meyer you're a horrible, no good elitist.
Not to Handy. To Handy, all art is equal. And if you suggest maybe Hamlet is better than Stephenie Meyer you're a horrible, no good elitist.
bigblue_dl
Armed
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
All the same, apparently. And don't you dare suggest otherwise. That would be being a hipster.
All the same, apparently. And don't you dare suggest otherwise. That would be being a hipster.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
I have never said anything of the kind. Are the voices in Flaggy's head seeping into yours?
I would never say all art is equal, I would say all art is subjective but it certainly isnt equal. I would also say your opinion (or mine for that matter) is no more correct or valid than anyone else's. What motivates us or what we are able to see inside a book, or play or poem or picture is oftentimes unique to us. No one opinion (or even the majority of opinions) is necessarily more correct than another.
It is like I say with music...I may think certain bands are awful and hate their music but I can still say they have talent. Same is true for movies and literature and yes, even comic books.
BTW who the *bleep* is Stephanie Meyer?
I have never said anything of the kind. Are the voices in Flaggy's head seeping into yours?
I would never say all art is equal, I would say all art is subjective but it certainly isnt equal. I would also say your opinion (or mine for that matter) is no more correct or valid than anyone else's. What motivates us or what we are able to see inside a book, or play or poem or picture is oftentimes unique to us. No one opinion (or even the majority of opinions) is necessarily more correct than another.
It is like I say with music...I may think certain bands are awful and hate their music but I can still say they have talent. Same is true for movies and literature and yes, even comic books.
BTW who the *bleep* is Stephanie Meyer?
bigblue_dl
Armed
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
Oh yeah, leather straps, ball gags and hand-cuffs, tons of handcuffs. Oh, and butt stuff.
Oh yeah, leather straps, ball gags and hand-cuffs, tons of handcuffs. Oh, and butt stuff.
St. Clown
Liberal Rebel Scum, apparently
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
Vampires that sparkle in the sunlight, and Kristen Stewart.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
Well you'd know if you weren't such a highbrow poseur...
All art has subjective elements. But not all things about all art are subjective.
I fully agree that the purpose of art is to climb inside and be inspired.
Wherever you can find the sublime, look there. A man's reach should exceed his grasp, or what's a heaven for? So if Marvel is putting out stuff that drops you in your tracks and makes you gape with wonder, that's great, stick with that. The wonder is, after all, the point. Everything else is just a ladder.
Well you'd know if you weren't such a highbrow poseur...
All art has subjective elements. But not all things about all art are subjective.
I fully agree that the purpose of art is to climb inside and be inspired.
Wherever you can find the sublime, look there. A man's reach should exceed his grasp, or what's a heaven for? So if Marvel is putting out stuff that drops you in your tracks and makes you gape with wonder, that's great, stick with that. The wonder is, after all, the point. Everything else is just a ladder.
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Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
To someone else it might. (personally I hope not but it could be)
I am not making an elitism argument in any way but you certainly are making it easy too if I want to.
I am not trying to make the point you think I am. All I am saying is that there is more to comic books than just Spiderman making jokes and Superman saving the day with a big smile on his face.
To someone else it might. (personally I hope not but it could be)
I am not making an elitism argument in any way but you certainly are making it easy too if I want to.
I am not trying to make the point you think I am. All I am saying is that there is more to comic books than just Spiderman making jokes and Superman saving the day with a big smile on his face.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
Of course it might. The whole point is that person would be wrong. It may be a greater expression of art to them -- nobody controls our taste except ourselves. Porn means far, far more to me than Hildegard of Bingen.
But if I were to say porn is a greater expression of art than Hildegard objectively, well, I would be wrong.
Of course it might. The whole point is that person would be wrong. It may be a greater expression of art to them -- nobody controls our taste except ourselves. Porn means far, far more to me than Hildegard of Bingen.
But if I were to say porn is a greater expression of art than Hildegard objectively, well, I would be wrong.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
Ah. So now the Hyperbolic Hipsters are saying that I believe Twilight is equal to Shakespeare? Interesting...
(never watched or read Twilight)
So here is what we have learned today...comic books are bland stories that have no real value and to suggest otherwise is tantamount to saying that all art is equal. Of course no one actually said that except the people all in a twitter because people disagreed with their opinion which maybe says more about them than anything 
I guess I need to go back to just saying "like what you like for whatever reason you like it".
Ah. So now the Hyperbolic Hipsters are saying that I believe Twilight is equal to Shakespeare? Interesting...
(never watched or read Twilight)
So here is what we have learned today...comic books are bland stories that have no real value and to suggest otherwise is tantamount to saying that all art is equal. Of course no one actually said that except the people all in a twitter because people disagreed with their opinion which maybe says more about them than anything
I guess I need to go back to just saying "like what you like for whatever reason you like it".
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
I will say comic books are better stories than you think they are. Since I havent read every story or seen every movie (and neither have you) I dont think either of us can objectively say otherwise.
Porn is the answer to the question "Why are we here"
I will say comic books are better stories than you think they are. Since I havent read every story or seen every movie (and neither have you) I dont think either of us can objectively say otherwise.
Porn is the answer to the question "Why are we here"
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
I love Doc Savage. I think it's one of the best views into the mid-century American mind of human children we have. Doc Savage is "better" than most people think once you accept it for what it is -- you enter into the spirit of the dance; you play the game by the correct rules. I am sure comic books work the same way. I'm not running them down.
I was saying that the breadth of emotional maturity of comics I have read and seen treated as movies is truncated and the spectrum that survives the cut appeals to adolescent boys. You can say the same thing about, say, Westerns, or Marine recruiting ads, and for the same reasons. The salesman knows who he's talking to.
There's some rancor for me because I think American culture is currently dominated by these themes, and that these themes are not worthy of adults. They are superficial and they lead very easily to the uncaring violence that we see surrounding our world. They are hard, whereas deep mature emotions are permeable and above all adjustable. The primary thematic elements and emotions of comic book movies are literally stupefying: they replace complex, queasy, ambivalent emotions with bumper sticker slogans. These are extremely appealing to teens who are looking to be magnetized, and by 50-year old teens who never made the transition to adult thinking. I think when they take over the cultural leadership of a society they are harmful, not to mention boring.
I love Doc Savage. I think it's one of the best views into the mid-century American mind of human children we have. Doc Savage is "better" than most people think once you accept it for what it is -- you enter into the spirit of the dance; you play the game by the correct rules. I am sure comic books work the same way. I'm not running them down.
I was saying that the breadth of emotional maturity of comics I have read and seen treated as movies is truncated and the spectrum that survives the cut appeals to adolescent boys. You can say the same thing about, say, Westerns, or Marine recruiting ads, and for the same reasons. The salesman knows who he's talking to.
There's some rancor for me because I think American culture is currently dominated by these themes, and that these themes are not worthy of adults. They are superficial and they lead very easily to the uncaring violence that we see surrounding our world. They are hard, whereas deep mature emotions are permeable and above all adjustable. The primary thematic elements and emotions of comic book movies are literally stupefying: they replace complex, queasy, ambivalent emotions with bumper sticker slogans. These are extremely appealing to teens who are looking to be magnetized, and by 50-year old teens who never made the transition to adult thinking. I think when they take over the cultural leadership of a society they are harmful, not to mention boring.
bigblue_dl
Armed
Re: Movies! The Last Jedi: Ragnarok
I wouldn't have nearly as much of an issue with the comic book movies if there weren't about 2 coming out every month. It seems like they keep making the same movies over, and over, and over again. I mean, how many times can you tell the same exact story about some ******* kid getting bit by some poison spider?
I wouldn't have nearly as much of an issue with the comic book movies if there weren't about 2 coming out every month. It seems like they keep making the same movies over, and over, and over again. I mean, how many times can you tell the same exact story about some ******* kid getting bit by some poison spider?
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