Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

[walrus]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

There's really no sense arguing this but to spell it out, the NCAA has no choice in terms of putting a host team in its home regional if it qualifies. It's happened with UNH once or twice as a 3/4 seed. People accept that as part of the tournament process.

In the case of PC, the committee DID have a choice, and it chose to reward the No. 15 team in the field, both in terms of putting them at home and in terms of letting them play the No. 4 overall team (Miami) instead of No. 2 (North Dakota).

Giving PC, a team that as noted qualified by thousandths of percentage points of RPI, those advantages is absolutely questionable and has nothing to do with the established process of slotting host teams in their home regionals.

The NCAA wasn't going to move North Dakota out of Fargo thats for sure. BC had just as much advantage as PC did. probably had more fans at the Dunk and still lost. To be Natl Champs you have to win the games. Maine had to Play Minnie in the XCel, they had to Play Wisconsin in Milwaukee, thats the way it goes. This isn't BBall, 60 schools have Hockey, we get what we get

 

[TERRIERFANinLA]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

The NCAA wasn't going to move North Dakota out of Fargo thats for sure. BC had just as much advantage as PC did. probably had more fans at the Dunk and still lost. To be Natl Champs you have to win the games. Maine had to Play Minnie in the XCel, they had to Play Wisconsin in Milwaukee, thats the way it goes. This isn't BBall, 60 schools have Hockey, we get what we get

i thought since the very beginning of the season that PC was a powerhouse and belonged contention for the title. mauerman is the only surprise I see... he is not as good as I thought he would be and Accairi is better than I thought he would be... the whole team plays like a team and their D is solid as can be. that all said, Rico is lucky that the Dunkin Donuts Center did away with the rule that "you must be 'this' tall to coach in this venue" (I also had Harvard and BU picked for the final back in January, so what do I know... not it all, that's for sure)

 

[maineiac]

B.S.! No team should have a home ice advantage unless the NCAA is going to higher seeds home ice for EVERYONE! Providence wasn't even playing on their home ice. And you do realize that North Dakota was playing in Grand Forks no matter what seed they were, right?

REALLY? So why didn't they play in Grand Forks?

 

[maineiac]

They didn't earn anything! UND was the host of this regional whether they were 1, 2, 3, or 4.......or even didn't make the tourney. Please tell me that you understand that......please.

The NCAA rules state that the host team plays in their regional. BUT, they do have to make the tournament first or they don't play anywhere. The rules do NOT state that you play in your own city just because you happen to be in the tournament. Unless of course you get placed there due to seeding, for example 1 vs.16, 2 vs. 15 etc. Please tell me that you understand that.....please.
Oh, and I am not a western fan!

 

[maineiac]

So, you are totally fine if North Dakota would have been the last team in and played on their home ice?

CORRECT! That's what the rules state. You host and you play there. Can't be moved. Cut and dry.

 

[maineiac]

Correct again! Now we're getting somewhere.

 

[Chairman of the Boards]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

IMO, Red is not and will never be the the one to lead Maine back to hockey superiority. Hope I'm wrong for the sake of all the diehard fans out there. Thought for sure Jim Montgomery was the only logical pick to replace Whitehead. Is there anyone out there who really knows what happened in the selection process and why the Maine alumnus would opt for Denver and shun the University he helped put on the hockey map? Was it the Walshs' alleged recruiting improprieties? Does anyone anyone have a clue?

My optimism is long-dead, considering Red's results and his recruiting...

I was touting Jimmy or Bob a couple of years back, but was willing to settle for Red and his impressive resume. Now, I see no progress whatsoever and in hindsight wish that Maine had opted for a younger coach who had Maine ties and perhaps had a better touch with 18-22 YO's.

I hate to admit this, but I've thrown-in the towel. What Tim started, Red will finish. I'll still follow the Bears, but I'll be stunned (and delighted) if they make any noise in the foreseeable future, yet I just don't see any reason to expect that. None at all.

 

[Pucknut]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

They talked(ESPN)to PC Coach Nate Leaman about playing at the Dunkin Donuts Center...he said the ONLY time he was in there was to watch Providence Basketball and the hockey team had not even been there this year...according to ESPN. The advantage was they were close to there home's and they had there fans close by...happens each and every year and will continue.

Combine the Denver and Miami fans together and they probably outnumbered the Friar fans. Providence is a basketball school and if a basketball is hitting the hardwood within a 100-mi. radius they will skip the hockey game along with the pep band.

 

[Runsub5]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

IMO, Red is not and will never be the the one to lead Maine back to hockey superiority. Hope I'm wrong for the sake of all the diehard fans out there. Thought for sure Jim Montgomery was the only logical pick to replace Whitehead. Is there anyone out there who really knows what happened in the selection process and why the Maine alumnus would opt for Denver and shun the University he helped put on the hockey map? Was it the Walshs' alleged recruiting improprieties? Does anyone anyone have a clue?

The AD and/or the search committee didn't want him. He had at least one skeleton in his closet. It was acknowledged by him and apparently the University chose to go in a different direction. As I recall, the AD had a conversation with him but it never really got serious. I tend to agree with you about "RedNeck" Red. I hope he is successful (appearing in a Frozen Four). I think the team will get better and they will be competitive. I don't see him being a perennial Frozen Four competitor. I do see the team making the NCAA regional occasionally. I am probably wrong.

 

[BobF]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

The AD and/or the search committee didn't want him. He had at least one skeleton in his closet. It was acknowledged by him and apparently the University chose to go in a different direction. As I recall, the AD had a conversation with him but it never really got serious. I tend to agree with you about "RedNeck" Red. I hope he is successful (appearing in a Frozen Four). I think the team will get better and they will be competitive. I don't see him being a perennial Frozen Four competitor. I do see the team making the NCAA regional occasionally. I am probably wrong.

FWIW my memory is Montgomery took the Denver job before the search committee was formed (I was at the Frozen Four in Pittsburgh when he took the job), so Jimmy could not officially apply but since TW was gone he allegedly had a conversation with the acting AD. Jimmy decided he could not afford to wait on accepting a job and was offered the one at Denver before Maine could even officially interview him.

As for Red, it may or may not comfort some of you to know that prior to the BU-Yale game I ran into a Yale parent who saw my Maine jacket and immediately asked about Red. He said how much he, his son, and his family loved Red, how he recruited his son and how they hope (as do I) that he is successful. I do think next year is critical, Red will have mostly his guys playing his system. Personally I think and hope we will be better. The jury is still out on the future. No question Jimmy jumped into a better situation with better talent and in the short term he has done much better than Red, and I was a big Jimmy backer. But like Gwozdecky he did not get to a Frozen Four. I have no idea about what "baggage" he had, but Denver an elite institution hired him so his record has to be pretty clean. I like Red, think he is doing many things right and hope that we start to see results next year!

Looking forward to attending the Frozen Four and watching Eichel and No. Dak. and PC-UNO. Based on our performance this year PC is the better team! Hoping BU gets it done as Eichel brings back memories of PK in terms of an impact freshmen, glad he played college hockey. Next year he will be in Arizona or Buffalo, hopefully not another Oiler!

 

[Priceless]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

IMO, Red is not and will never be the the one to lead Maine back to hockey superiority. Hope I'm wrong for the sake of all the diehard fans out there. Thought for sure Jim Montgomery was the only logical pick to replace Whitehead. Is there anyone out there who really knows what happened in the selection process and why the Maine alumnus would opt for Denver and shun the University he helped put on the hockey map? Was it the Walshs' alleged recruiting improprieties? Does anyone anyone have a clue?

Alleged? It was pretty well proven. And no, that's not why the university didn't want Jimmy. Look at it from their perspective: They had turned the women's basketball program over to a former star and that was a dumpster fire that cost the school a ton of money and goodwill with the fans. WBB was a revenue sport at one time and the school desperately needs them. Now along comes the Men's Ice Hockey program, the chief revenue sport for the school. Were they going to hand it over to an alumnus who hadn't coached at the college level before? The situations weren't the same, and you'll hear people swear Monty was qualified and would have brought such excitement to see him back at his alma mater. You think people weren't psyched to see Cindy at the helm of the WBB she brought to prominence? Now not only was WBB a disaster, but the program's #1 alumna was a pariah. What would have happened if Monty had come here and failed? Couple that with the skeleton Jimmy had in his own closet and Maine's desire not to have the athletics department turned upside down again like happened in 94 and 95 and you see why the school didn't want him. I have heard from people in the know that if he had come back to Maine a certain coach who was nearing the end of his tenure would have called his pals in Indianapolis and reported said skeleton. Monty coming back here (at this time) was not going to happen. Maybe in the future, but Denver can throw a lot of money at him and their history (and current position) are a bit better than Maine's.

 

[BobF]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

Alleged? It was pretty well proven. And no, that's not why the university didn't want Jimmy. Look at it from their perspective: They had turned the women's basketball program over to a former star and that was a dumpster fire that cost the school a ton of money and goodwill with the fans. WBB was a revenue sport at one time and the school desperately needs them. Now along comes the Men's Ice Hockey program, the chief revenue sport for the school. Were they going to hand it over to an alumnus who hadn't coached at the college level before? The situations weren't the same, and you'll hear people swear Monty was qualified and would have brought such excitement to see him back at his alma mater. You think people weren't psyched to see Cindy at the helm of the WBB she brought to prominence? Now not only was WBB a disaster, but the program's #1 alumna was a pariah. What would have happened if Monty had come here and failed? Couple that with the skeleton Jimmy had in his own closet and Maine's desire not to have the athletics department turned upside down again like happened in 94 and 95 and you see why the school didn't want him. I have heard from people in the know that if he had come back to Maine a certain coach who was nearing the end of his tenure would have called his pals in Indianapolis and reported said skeleton. Monty coming back here (at this time) was not going to happen. Maybe in the future, but Denver can throw a lot of money at him and their history (and current position) are a bit better than Maine's.

WOW! Priceless can't believe how much you miss the mark on this. Cindy had ZERO experience except being an assistant at what Brown??? Jimmy worked at Notre Dame as a grad assistant under Jeff Jackson, then went to RPI recruited and served under Appert, left that to go to USHL and work as a head coach for 2 years win a championship and recruit at that level. And that equates to Cindy???? Really thought you knew your stuff, but this post demonstrates otherwise. Jimmy never had the opportunity to apply due to timing, not that he was unproven and not ready for the job like Blodgett. To the contrary he had been prepping for a head coach job doing everything right. It was timing more than anything that played a role I think what we have seen after two years at Denver shows Jimmy was up to being a head coach in college hockey!

AND what is the skeleton as Denver obviously missed it!

 

[Runsub5]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

..........No question Jimmy jumped into a better situation with better talent and in the short term he has done much better than Red, and I was a big Jimmy backer. But like Gwozdecky he did not get to a Frozen Four..........

Gwozdecky won two Frozen Four titles.

 

[BobF]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

Gwozdecky won two Frozen Four titles.

I am well aware having witnessed one in person. However at the time he was dismissed it was due to "not advancing". Really it was due to the size of his contract and recent losses in regionals.

 

[Priceless]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

WOW! Priceless can't believe how much you miss the mark on this. Cindy had ZERO experience except being an assistant at what Brown??? Jimmy worked at Notre Dame as a grad assistant under Jeff Jackson, then went to RPI recruited and served under Appert, left that to go to USHL and work as a head coach for 2 years win a championship and recruit at that level. And that equates to Cindy???? Really thought you knew your stuff, but this post demonstrates otherwise. Jimmy never had the opportunity to apply due to timing, not that he was unproven and not ready for the job like Blodgett. To the contrary he had been prepping for a head coach job doing everything right. It was timing more than anything that played a role I think what we have seen after two years at Denver shows Jimmy was up to being a head coach in college hockey!

AND what is the skeleton as Denver obviously missed it!

I told you the situations were different but to look at it from the school's perspective, not a fan's. Of course Monty has done well at Denver. He took over a team that had been to the NCAA tournament six straight years and hadn't won less than 20 games since the Clinton administration. He picked up right where Gwoz left off. He is a fantastic fit for them. If you think he would have done that at Maine you're delusional. Scotty Bowman couldn't have led this team to the NCAAs.

Denver didn't miss the skeleton. They didn't care about the skeleton. Maine did.

 

[Runsub5]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

....... Of course Monty has done well at Denver. He took over a team that had been to the NCAA tournament six straight years and hadn't won less than 20 games since the Clinton administration. He picked up right where Gwoz left off.......

The recruiter who assembled most of that team is now in Providence. DU should still be able to recruit with it's reputation and financial resources, but they lost a proven recruiter in Steve Miller.

 

[BobF]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

I told you the situations were different but to look at it from the school's perspective, not a fan's. Of course Monty has done well at Denver. He took over a team that had been to the NCAA tournament six straight years and hadn't won less than 20 games since the Clinton administration. He picked up right where Gwoz left off. He is a fantastic fit for them. If you think he would have done that at Maine you're delusional. Scotty Bowman couldn't have led this team to the NCAAs.

Denver didn't miss the skeleton. They didn't care about the skeleton. Maine did.

Think you need to read my previous post on Red and Jimmy. Maine NEVER had the opportunity to interview Jimmy officially so it is a moot point. And ridiculous to say it was okay to say Denver could hire him but Maine could not base upon a skeleton dating back to when Jimmy played???? Have no issues with Red's hire, do have issues with all this talk about a skeleton that no one can comment on when he was hired by a prestigious institution. Let's face facts. If Jimmy was available and had been interviewed by the committee he would have been the favorite. That was not the case, he was already the head coach of Denver. Why revise history and compare him to Blodgett like he was a consideration? He was not. There was another former Maine alum who is a head coach in the NHL who was. That never happened and I think that may have been for the best as well. I do believe Red was the right choice given the options. Now just hoping he proves it!

 

[Runsub5]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

I can't remember the time sequence off the top of my head, but I really like Cavanaugh. As I recall the search committee was still being formed when he signed with Connecticut. Articulate and bright.

 

[Fishman'81]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

Think you need to read my previous post on Red and Jimmy. Maine NEVER had the opportunity to interview Jimmy officially so it is a moot point. And ridiculous to say it was okay to say Denver could hire him but Maine could not base upon a skeleton dating back to when Jimmy played???? Have no issues with Red's hire, do have issues with all this talk about a skeleton that no one can comment on when he was hired by a prestigious institution. Let's face facts. If Jimmy was available and had been interviewed by the committee he would have been the favorite. That was not the case, he was already the head coach of Denver. Why revise history and compare him to Blodgett like he was a consideration? He was not. There was another former Maine alum who is a head coach in the NHL who was. That never happened and I think that may have been for the best as well. I do believe Red was the right choice given the options. Now just hoping he proves it!

I remember the whole deal a little differently than most posters seem to...

Monty had been convicted of a DWI, and then he was quoted as feeling injured to have been left-out of the interviewed by Maine.

(I don't have any idea if one thing had anything to do with the other, but I'm fairly confident that both are searchable facts. And it seems clear that Maine didn't want him.)

If I had a magic wand, I'd go back and hire Corkum. He had the pedigree, the relative youth and the fire. I can't imagine how Maine hockey could have been any worse right now if he'd been given a couple of years to right the ship, and I wouldn't be at at all surprised if it would have been a lot better.

 

[Priceless]

Re: Maine Hockey 2014-15 Volume 2: Red's Revenge

Think you need to read my previous post on Red and Jimmy. Maine NEVER had the opportunity to interview Jimmy officially so it is a moot point. And ridiculous to say it was okay to say Denver could hire him but Maine could not base upon a skeleton dating back to when Jimmy played???? Have no issues with Red's hire, do have issues with all this talk about a skeleton that no one can comment on when he was hired by a prestigious institution. Let's face facts. If Jimmy was available and had been interviewed by the committee he would have been the favorite. That was not the case, he was already the head coach of Denver. Why revise history and compare him to Blodgett like he was a consideration? He was not. There was another former Maine alum who is a head coach in the NHL who was. That never happened and I think that may have been for the best as well. I do believe Red was the right choice given the options. Now just hoping he proves it!

No, the skeleton in the closet wasn't from when he was a player (I think I covered this). It was from when he was an assistant at RPI. Also, as Fishman points out, he had a DWI on his record. Denver (a private institution) may not care but Maine (a very public institution) does. Especially when the administration has already been down that road with another coach.

If Maine had wanted to talk to Monty they could have. The quote was that no one from Maine had contacted him and he was hurt by that. That should tell you that A) He was receptive to an offer and B) Maine never wanted him. One of the reasons was they were gunshy after the Blodgett fiasco. Maine certainly could have reached out to him and told him not to do anything sudden, he's under consideration for the job. Unfortunately, Denver got to him first. They moved quickly while Maine plodded along. Maine's season ended March 15. Denver's ended March 29. Monty was hired April 13. They moved lightning fast. Not that it mattered, because Maine never wanted him. Notice I never said *I* didn't want him.

I think he would have made a fine coach and was certain it was going to happen. I heard from a (very misinformed) source that it was happening. I had texted players that they were going to love playing for him. Then word came that he was going to Denver. Very disappointing. I was (and am) thrilled with the hire of Red and I do believe he can lead this team back to prominence, but the "what might have been" is going to linger until he does.