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Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!
- Thread starter FadeToBlack&Gold
- Start date
- Status
Count your dishes.
bigblue_dl
Armed
FadeToBlack&Gold
8647
RaceBoarder
Waiting for the Snow to fly...
Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!
I feel that this is a good example of what's wrong with our country right now for many people:
As I've mentioned before I've fallen into the "Millenial Trap" in that I'm working in low level retail while having a degree. I have to work a 2nd job, as my main job flat out doesn't pay the bills, but does provide insurance, which is 100% needed. I'm also being blocked from moving up because I'm getting beat out by people with a ton more experience who are moving down a job level instead of progressing upwards.
So I recently applied for a Lead position with a smaller, but still "National" outdoor retailer. As with most jobs, the initial application took a good chunk of time because I needed to upload a resume and then re-enter the same info several different times throughout the process. That went well and I was then asked to interview twice for the position. Those also went well. During the interview process, it was briefly asked what I was looking for in terms of pay. I gave my reply which matched what I put on the initial application. This was a bump in pay from what I make currently, but also on par with what similar positions pay according to research from places like GlassDoor, Indeed, etc.
I was offered the job. HOWEVER, what this place was offering in pay was downright insulting. I was offered a whole $0.21/hour increase from my current pay (basically my current pay rounded up to the next whole number
) and easily $3-5/hour under what I was expecting. I was clearly shocked about this revelation and, although professional, made it clear that there was no way this would work out. (It was already discussed regarding my 2nd job and how that was needed to pay the bills. The new company was not willing to have the flexibility I currently have so I would have to drop the 2nd job if I took the position. I thought I made that super clear that I was there for more $$$)
Point of this is that I wasted probably 10-12+ hours on this process. Doing the stupid long, time consuming application, two interviews, clearing my schedule to accommodate said interviews, taking the time to get a haircut, and whatever else I did to prep for all this. And then to have this all go to s*it because the company ignored my salary requirements. I would have been much better off to have never received a call back.
But this is the current state of things. People commonly say "Don't make enough? Find a new job..." Well, that's easily said, but the process is not an easy one and one simple slip up and it all goes to waste. In my case it all went to waste because of stupidity on the other end of the table. This is why it's frustrating to be part of the "working poor" in 2018
I feel that this is a good example of what's wrong with our country right now for many people:
As I've mentioned before I've fallen into the "Millenial Trap" in that I'm working in low level retail while having a degree. I have to work a 2nd job, as my main job flat out doesn't pay the bills, but does provide insurance, which is 100% needed. I'm also being blocked from moving up because I'm getting beat out by people with a ton more experience who are moving down a job level instead of progressing upwards.
So I recently applied for a Lead position with a smaller, but still "National" outdoor retailer. As with most jobs, the initial application took a good chunk of time because I needed to upload a resume and then re-enter the same info several different times throughout the process. That went well and I was then asked to interview twice for the position. Those also went well. During the interview process, it was briefly asked what I was looking for in terms of pay. I gave my reply which matched what I put on the initial application. This was a bump in pay from what I make currently, but also on par with what similar positions pay according to research from places like GlassDoor, Indeed, etc.
I was offered the job. HOWEVER, what this place was offering in pay was downright insulting. I was offered a whole $0.21/hour increase from my current pay (basically my current pay rounded up to the next whole number
) and easily $3-5/hour under what I was expecting. I was clearly shocked about this revelation and, although professional, made it clear that there was no way this would work out. (It was already discussed regarding my 2nd job and how that was needed to pay the bills. The new company was not willing to have the flexibility I currently have so I would have to drop the 2nd job if I took the position. I thought I made that super clear that I was there for more $$$)Point of this is that I wasted probably 10-12+ hours on this process. Doing the stupid long, time consuming application, two interviews, clearing my schedule to accommodate said interviews, taking the time to get a haircut, and whatever else I did to prep for all this. And then to have this all go to s*it because the company ignored my salary requirements. I would have been much better off to have never received a call back.
But this is the current state of things. People commonly say "Don't make enough? Find a new job..." Well, that's easily said, but the process is not an easy one and one simple slip up and it all goes to waste. In my case it all went to waste because of stupidity on the other end of the table. This is why it's frustrating to be part of the "working poor" in 2018
RaceBoarder
Waiting for the Snow to fly...
Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!
I get that the pay is low... But isn't that why you ask for current pay and salary expectations on applications? That should have been a red flag on my app from the start. Why go forward with my application at all? Why not bring up the pay in the 1st interview if you are interested in my experience but know that I'm looking for a good bit more than what you are gonna offer?
I'm not upset over not getting the job... I'm upset because I feel like I wasted a bunch of time that I don't really have and that loss could have been easily prevented.
I get that the pay is low... But isn't that why you ask for current pay and salary expectations on applications? That should have been a red flag on my app from the start. Why go forward with my application at all? Why not bring up the pay in the 1st interview if you are interested in my experience but know that I'm looking for a good bit more than what you are gonna offer?
I'm not upset over not getting the job... I'm upset because I feel like I wasted a bunch of time that I don't really have and that loss could have been easily prevented.
Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!
My company is straightfoward on pay. It's competitive with other companies in the industry, and we have great benefits. However, the stigma of working in a warehouse, and/or the physicality of the work...the younger generation doesn't care. They don't care about health insurance, or PTO time, etc. They want the money up front. We have 3-4 positions open because of this.
My company is straightfoward on pay. It's competitive with other companies in the industry, and we have great benefits. However, the stigma of working in a warehouse, and/or the physicality of the work...the younger generation doesn't care. They don't care about health insurance, or PTO time, etc. They want the money up front. We have 3-4 positions open because of this.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Oh I know...but honestly from what I have been told no one reads any of that stuff anyways. The hiring process is pretty shady a lot of the time.
FadeToBlack&Gold
8647
Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!
What's amazing is that they think they can do that, and get away with it, given that our current market favors candidates.
What that tells me is, they don't care about hiring the best person. They just want a body.
I pulled myself out of the hiring process at one of my current company's direct competitors a couple of months back, because the managing director who was supposed to interview me, failed to call me at either of the times we had established. I didn't receive a note from the recruiter until several hours after each appointment that she needed to reschedule. That tells me they don't respect anyone's time.
What's amazing is that they think they can do that, and get away with it, given that our current market favors candidates.
What that tells me is, they don't care about hiring the best person. They just want a body.
I pulled myself out of the hiring process at one of my current company's direct competitors a couple of months back, because the managing director who was supposed to interview me, failed to call me at either of the times we had established. I didn't receive a note from the recruiter until several hours after each appointment that she needed to reschedule. That tells me they don't respect anyone's time.
St. Clown
Ideas Posted are Likely Not My Own
Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!
They ask for pay rates from other companies to know what their competition is paying. You should lie, quite frankly, and add a couple bucks to your current pay when asked in the future.
They ask for pay rates from other companies to know what their competition is paying. You should lie, quite frankly, and add a couple bucks to your current pay when asked in the future.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Agreed. Plus lots of companies use computer programs to sort through resumes. They look for key words and that is it. Hiring managers don't even read em.
dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!
I would have never gotten my current job if I wasn’t hired as a contract engineer first. I applied to my current company about 70 times and never heard anything.
Not to brag, just want to prove a point. I’m now tagged high potential, I’m a task force chair for a corporate engineering standard, I have become a corporate expert in a major area of our ERP system, and I have had at least two open job offers for various positions for about five and a half years now
The way hiring is done now is a f-cking joke. There isn’t any thought put into hiring the best person. It’s computerized to find the best paper candidate. You can’t contact hiring managers to express your desire to work there, there’s no way to emphasize strengths or your work ethic, and there’s no way to recommend people for jobs.
I count my blessings every day. I don’t know how I worked my way to where I am.
I would have never gotten my current job if I wasn’t hired as a contract engineer first. I applied to my current company about 70 times and never heard anything.
Not to brag, just want to prove a point. I’m now tagged high potential, I’m a task force chair for a corporate engineering standard, I have become a corporate expert in a major area of our ERP system, and I have had at least two open job offers for various positions for about five and a half years now
The way hiring is done now is a f-cking joke. There isn’t any thought put into hiring the best person. It’s computerized to find the best paper candidate. You can’t contact hiring managers to express your desire to work there, there’s no way to emphasize strengths or your work ethic, and there’s no way to recommend people for jobs.
I count my blessings every day. I don’t know how I worked my way to where I am.
Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!
This started years ago. My old job, they were hiring newbies for senior positions because they had a degree, despite the oldsters knowing every which way about the company.
My current job, you HAVE to have a degree now, or be working on one, to be mgmt. The previous runner of our entire building? No degree, he worked his way up from a truck loader. It's bullsh*.
This started years ago. My old job, they were hiring newbies for senior positions because they had a degree, despite the oldsters knowing every which way about the company.
My current job, you HAVE to have a degree now, or be working on one, to be mgmt. The previous runner of our entire building? No degree, he worked his way up from a truck loader. It's bullsh*.
bigblue_dl
Armed
Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!
Huh. Glad I've never had to look for a job.
Huh. Glad I've never had to look for a job.
dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!
This is funny. Today my company announced a referral program. Not all positions are eligible though. And it's probably more of a:
--Person applies
--Person fills in your name on application form
--Follows same process as normal...
Maybe not. But at least it's a start.
This is funny. Today my company announced a referral program. Not all positions are eligible though. And it's probably more of a:
--Person applies
--Person fills in your name on application form
--Follows same process as normal...
Maybe not. But at least it's a start.
bigblue_dl
Armed
Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!
I don't know if we have a formal referral program at my company. When I helped a mutual friend of ours get a position here, I just went directly to the manager that was looking for an engineer, and gave him my recommendation. The manager that was hiring then told HR that this person was one of the people he wanted to interview, based on my recommendation. He had applied online for the position, so HR picked him and a few other qualified candidates to be interviewed by the hiring manager, and he ended up getting the job. No actual formal process, just talking to people.
This is funny. Today my company announced a referral program. Not all positions are eligible though. And it's probably more of a:
--Person applies
--Person fills in your name on application form
--Follows same process as normal...
Maybe not. But at least it's a start.
I don't know if we have a formal referral program at my company. When I helped a mutual friend of ours get a position here, I just went directly to the manager that was looking for an engineer, and gave him my recommendation. The manager that was hiring then told HR that this person was one of the people he wanted to interview, based on my recommendation. He had applied online for the position, so HR picked him and a few other qualified candidates to be interviewed by the hiring manager, and he ended up getting the job. No actual formal process, just talking to people.
Re: Gear Grinding 9: I Need a Wine!
Gah.
My wife, who is an otherwise rational person with degrees in math, physics, and engineering physics and is a rabid pro-vaxxer (her sister works for the Gates foundation modeling vaccine efficacy), has somehow fallen for the non-GMO marketing BS. Unbelievable. This in spite of the following organizations saying that GMO foods are perfectly safe:
National Academy of Sciences: "To date, no adverse health effects attributed to genetic engineering have been documented in the human population."
American Association for the Advancement of Science: "The science is quite clear: crop improvement by the modern molecular techniques of biotechnology is safe."
American Medical Association: "Bioengineered foods have been consumed for close to 20 years [in 2012], and during that time, no overt consequences on human health have been reported and/or substantiated in the peer-reviewed literature"
Food and Drug Administration: "Credible evidence has demonstrated that foods from the Genetically Engineered plant varieties marketed to date are as safe as comparable, non-Genetically Engineered foods."
Royal Society: "Foods derived from GM crops have been consumed by hundreds of millions of people across the world for more than 15 years [in 2008], with no reported ill effects"
European Commission: "These [GMO development and research] activities provide at least equal assurance of the safety of these foods compared to conventional counterparts."
World Health Organization: "No effects on human health have been shown as a result of the consumption of such foods by the general population in the countries where they have been approved."
Yes, you *CAN* be too careful - otherwise, staying in bed all day wearing a football helmet would be considered perfectly rational.
Gah.
My wife, who is an otherwise rational person with degrees in math, physics, and engineering physics and is a rabid pro-vaxxer (her sister works for the Gates foundation modeling vaccine efficacy), has somehow fallen for the non-GMO marketing BS. Unbelievable. This in spite of the following organizations saying that GMO foods are perfectly safe:
National Academy of Sciences: "To date, no adverse health effects attributed to genetic engineering have been documented in the human population."
American Association for the Advancement of Science: "The science is quite clear: crop improvement by the modern molecular techniques of biotechnology is safe."
American Medical Association: "Bioengineered foods have been consumed for close to 20 years [in 2012], and during that time, no overt consequences on human health have been reported and/or substantiated in the peer-reviewed literature"
Food and Drug Administration: "Credible evidence has demonstrated that foods from the Genetically Engineered plant varieties marketed to date are as safe as comparable, non-Genetically Engineered foods."
Royal Society: "Foods derived from GM crops have been consumed by hundreds of millions of people across the world for more than 15 years [in 2008], with no reported ill effects"
European Commission: "These [GMO development and research] activities provide at least equal assurance of the safety of these foods compared to conventional counterparts."
World Health Organization: "No effects on human health have been shown as a result of the consumption of such foods by the general population in the countries where they have been approved."
Yes, you *CAN* be too careful - otherwise, staying in bed all day wearing a football helmet would be considered perfectly rational.
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