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Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

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Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

If Bernie has the capacity to expand the electorate, then he'll win the primary. If the extent that he can expand it is overated, then Biden will win. Bernie supporters need to stop whining and back up what Sanders claims at his rallies.
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

Handyman said:
So the way to be Democratic is to...not be Democratic? You honestly dont see the stupidity of this? Not to mention this belief that Biden coming out of a convention in such a way would somehow beat Trump is laughable.

I am consistent about this in 2008 when rumors were the SDs were going to block Obama I was railing on them then. (Rover took much umbrage to this) You dont get to be a party that is "trying to save the country from a tyrant" and act like tyrants while doing so. That isnt how this works. The ends dont justify the means. A brokered convention is one thing...this is subverting the will of the many for the gain of the elite few. That isnt preventing Trump it is just doing what he does only to your own people not the other side. We whine he is a President with a minority share of support, and yet some are advocating for the possibility of a candidate to run against him with a minority share of support.

And lets not even get into how many of these clowns rail on the Electoral College all day long and how that makes them a hypocrite in this conversation.

It doesnt matter who the candidate is...the SDs should have no power. They should be behind the scenes wheeling and dealing, not handpicking the candidate they like because...REASONS. That is anti-Democratic and it is a stupid losing strategy.
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Actually this is not correct. The parties can do whatever they want to select their candidate. Given how things are turning out I'd have to say Perez has done just as bad a job as the last chair. If the party wants a Democratic system they can employ a Democratic system. But, they don't have to. Hell, the Presidential election isn't Democratic either.
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

bronconick said:
If Bernie has the capacity to expand the electorate, then he'll win the primary. If the extent that he can expand it is overated, then Biden will win. Bernie supporters need to stop whining and back up what Sanders claims at his rallies.
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Yep. It's time to put up or shut up.
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

don't look now, but Biden just passed Bernie in the 538 forecast

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2020-primary-forecast/?ex_cid=rrpromo

now giving Biden 3:10 chance of securing a majority of the delegates and Sanders 1:12. The chance of no one winning a majority of the delates is now 3 in 5.

predicting 1,740 delegates for Biden and 1,362 for Sanders.

I don't think this has much meaning at this point in time though but I think the model should start to stabilize after today.


Sanders needs Warren to drop out ASAP.
 
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Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

The obsession with me out here has now crossed the line from flattering to creepy! Yikes, maybe I should have run for Prez? :D

Regarding the convention: the only thing I would change is super delegates don't get to vote until round 3. As in you have a little time for horse trading until they get involved but you can't have 30 rounds. But, the supporters of the candidate who loses need to put their big boy pants on and coalesce around the winner. I would hope some deals are made so that both wings are represented in the administration (how does Biden-Sarandon sound??? :eek:). What's the alternative? If everyone drops out in March someone will b itch that its a coronation and not a contest. If everyone stays in until the end you may get no one with a majority by the time we get to the convention.

In the meantime, just let the process play out. If Sanders truly is flooding the system with new voters, no amount of insider scheming will keep him from the nomination. If he truly has a 30% ceiling then its going to be hard for him to hold off the moderates. Either way there is no unfairness in the process thus far. May the best person win.
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

so I'm voting today. I'm still undecided at this point. My #1 concern is who has the best chance to beat Trump.

I like Warren, but considering she'll be dropping out soon I will be voting for Sanders or Biden. Please convince me your candidate has the best chance of beating Trump. I like many of Bernie's policies, but I think there is a near zero percent chance he would be able to enact them, and I'm a little suspect of how effective he will be at a president (since he'll actually have to do more than rail on the rich). At this point I'm only interested in arguments related to electability.
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

BassAle said:
so I'm voting today. I'm still undecided at this point. My #1 concern is who has the best chance to beat Trump.

I like Warren, but considering she'll be dropping out soon I will be voting for Sanders or Biden. Please convince me your candidate has the best chance of beating Trump. I like many of Bernie's policies, but I think there is a near zero percent chance he would be able to enact them, and I'm a little suspect of how effective he will be at a president (since he'll actually have to do more than rail on the rich). At this point I'm only interested in arguments related to electability.
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Allow me to propose an alternative. Vote Warren if you like her best. I will be doing the same here in Mass. We don't know, and we're not going to know, who's in the best position to beat Chump no earlier than after today, and maybe not for another month. We've only had 4 contests which is not enough evidence to see who's catching fire. Super Tuesday will help but not in time for you or me. If we vote Warren and she earns delegates, she could end up being the kingmaker in a brokered convention. If so I trust her to make the right decisions.
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

Yeah, I like Warren best and I voted for her yesterday. Plenty of time later to have to vote for someone I like less
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

Deutsche Gopher Fan said:
Yeah, I like Warren best and I voted for her yesterday. Plenty of time later to have to vote for someone I like less
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Voting for her today. I'm not going to pass up the only chance I have to cast a vote for her in an election.
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

Happy Super Tuesday, all!
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

Handyman said:
Oh please. Bernie has been a politician for almost as long as I have been alive. He isnt going to burn down anything. I know no one on either side of the argument wants to hear it but he isnt the revolutionary figure you all seem to think he is. He is a career politician who is just farther Left than most. He cant burn the system down because he is, in fact, the system. Trump had never held any office he truly was Anti-Establishment...Bernie is the Establishment.

It is rather crazy how polarizing he is. His backers think he is the Messiah Incarnate and his detractors think he is Fidel ready to topple everything, drink turpentine and **** on the smoldering ashes of it. Good lord it is kind ridiculous the closer we get to the end.
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Bernie is actually the least threatening candidate out there. He isn't really a Democrat. The power brokers in the Democratic party don't like him, they think he is grumpy and mean. He spent thirty years in Congress and couldn't get legislation passed when he actually had a vote. If he wins, so what. There isn't going to be Medicare for All. People aren't going to get their college tuition/loans forgiven.

The worst outcome for the Dems is Bernie wins and then all the young voters and Latinos that came out to support him learn the jaded truth about politics. But they're going to learn that one way or the other anyway.
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">So I was asked today and provided a theory on why so many former/current Dem Hill staffers back Warren: She is the only candidate who has directly acknowledged the brokenness they live in, rejected the idea of a "return" that's never coming and proposed blowing up the filibuster.</p>— Meredith Shiner (@meredithshiner) <a href="https://twitter.com/meredithshiner/status/1234593100603023363?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 2, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Warren would make the best president by a country mile over any other contender, including all those that have dropped out. Combination of extreme competence, vision of fighting the structural problems in our politics, and left-liberal politics is great. <a href="https://t.co/yioMLAf5yu">https://t.co/yioMLAf5yu</a></p>— Erik Loomis (@ErikLoomis) <a href="https://twitter.com/ErikLoomis/status/1234838069767004160?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 3, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

Deutsche Gopher Fan said:
Yeah, I like Warren best and I voted for her yesterday. Plenty of time later to have to vote for someone I like less
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This is exactly the best attitude. It's how I voted in the past for Jesse Jackson and, for that matter, Bernie Sanders.

Vote for your best case in the primary and then tactically (which at this point always means the Dems) in the general.
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

SJHovey said:
Bernie is actually the least threatening candidate out there. He isn't really a Democrat. The power brokers in the Democratic party don't like him, they think he is grumpy and mean. He spent thirty years in Congress and couldn't get legislation passed when he actually had a vote. If he wins, so what. There isn't going to be Medicare for All. People aren't going to get their college tuition/loans forgiven.

The worst outcome for the Dems is Bernie wins and then all the young voters and Latinos that came out to support him learn the jaded truth about politics. But they're going to learn that one way or the other anyway.
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It's pretty hilarious to watch anyone poo poo the power of the Presidency. Especially at this time in our history when it's at it's highest point.
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

Deutsche Gopher Fan said:
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">So I was asked today and provided a theory on why so many former/current Dem Hill staffers back Warren: She is the only candidate who has directly acknowledged the brokenness they live in, rejected the idea of a "return" that's never coming and proposed blowing up the filibuster.</p>— Meredith Shiner (@meredithshiner) <a href="https://twitter.com/meredithshiner/status/1234593100603023363?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 2, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Warren would make the best president by a country mile over any other contender, including all those that have dropped out. Combination of extreme competence, vision of fighting the structural problems in our politics, and left-liberal politics is great. <a href="https://t.co/yioMLAf5yu">https://t.co/yioMLAf5yu</a></p>— Erik Loomis (@ErikLoomis) <a href="https://twitter.com/ErikLoomis/status/1234838069767004160?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">March 3, 2020</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
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So Sanders is bad because he is too revolutionary. And Sanders is bad because he doesn't acknowledge the brokenness we live in. Simultaneously.
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

SJHovey said:
The worst outcome for the Dems is Bernie wins and then all the young voters and Latinos that came out to support him learn the jaded truth about politics. But they're going to learn that one way or the other anyway.
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Your concern is noted.
 
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!

SJHovey said:
Oh, I don't have any concern or worry over that. The youngsters will learn soon enough, if they haven't already.
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"Those who have betrayed their ideals will encourage you to betray yours."
 
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