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Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
Huh, Biden's middle name is "Robinette".
Huh, Biden's middle name is "Robinette".
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Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
- Thread starter ticapnews
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psych
Well-known member
I’m aware that superdelegates only get to vote on the second ballot and later. I know Sanders played a role in making that happen. It goes to show the strength he now has in the Democratic Party without being an actual Democrat. That said, at this point in time, he’s not projected to win a majority of delegates, and therefore, swaying super delegates would very much be in play for a Biden or even Bloomberg. And, I would think of any people in the country, superdelegates would absolutely be swayed by, or at least take into account, a vice presidential pick. The common voter? Probably not. Superdelegates? I would think so. Biden sees that as his chance, based on his statement he’ll contest a convention IF no one gets the majority of delegates. Super Tuesday will make that picture a lot clearer.
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
I think that one of the effects of 2016, both here and abroad, is that a lot more people are a lot less certain about what will happen on election day. Except on message boards, where we all speak with absolute certainty.
I think that one of the effects of 2016, both here and abroad, is that a lot more people are a lot less certain about what will happen on election day. Except on message boards, where we all speak with absolute certainty.
ticapnews
Never graduate.
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
I'm shocked Sniffles hasn't turned that into a punchline on Twitter yet. Maybe he's a secret Law & Order fan.
I'm shocked Sniffles hasn't turned that into a punchline on Twitter yet. Maybe he's a secret Law & Order fan.
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
This is all working out the way its supposed to. People with no chance drop out and the stronger candidates move on. I agree that this year is a bit different because of 1) Bloomberg's billions, and 2) the chance that this is decided at the convention which could keep people in for bit longer than usual.
However if it becomes a two person race let the best one win. That should lessen the odds of a divided convention and have one clear winner that everyone else can coalesce around.
Huh. Who would have figured that?
This is all working out the way its supposed to. People with no chance drop out and the stronger candidates move on. I agree that this year is a bit different because of 1) Bloomberg's billions, and 2) the chance that this is decided at the convention which could keep people in for bit longer than usual.
However if it becomes a two person race let the best one win. That should lessen the odds of a divided convention and have one clear winner that everyone else can coalesce around.
Huh. Who would have figured that?
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D
Deutsche Gopher Fan
Guest
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
I love Abrams as veep no matter what. Honestly, it’d be hard to come up with a worse choice than who Hilary chose- we can’t have it be the worlds most boring white dude
I love Abrams as veep no matter what. Honestly, it’d be hard to come up with a worse choice than who Hilary chose- we can’t have it be the worlds most boring white dude
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
Yes. Hillary ****ed that up as well. It's like a ****ing clown was running that campaign.
Yes. Hillary ****ed that up as well. It's like a ****ing clown was running that campaign.
ticapnews
Never graduate.
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
The superdelegates that are current or retired politicians, maybe a VP pick will sway them. The superdelegates that are lobbyists and business executives who were granted status in return for generous contributions...no. They will be swayed by money. The gravy train will end if Sanders is elected. If a Biden or Bloomberg get in, that will be fine. If Sniffles wins another term they will say publicly how disappointed they are and then return to counting their money.
The superdelegates that are current or retired politicians, maybe a VP pick will sway them. The superdelegates that are lobbyists and business executives who were granted status in return for generous contributions...no. They will be swayed by money. The gravy train will end if Sanders is elected. If a Biden or Bloomberg get in, that will be fine. If Sniffles wins another term they will say publicly how disappointed they are and then return to counting their money.
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
When did Hillary offer the VP post to mookie?
When did Hillary offer the VP post to mookie?
ticapnews
Never graduate.
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
He turned her down. And he didn't want to be VP either.
He turned her down. And he didn't want to be VP either.
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
Oh, is THAT what the offer was contingent on?
Oh, is THAT what the offer was contingent on?
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
Endorsed Biden on her way out.
This is going to be one of those fun "Dead candidate gets elected" results. Anybody know what the MN early voting percentage is?
Endorsed Biden on her way out.
This is going to be one of those fun "Dead candidate gets elected" results. Anybody know what the MN early voting percentage is?
ticapnews
Never graduate.
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
Bernie will be in St Paul tonight. Sign them up for the rally and when they get the text confirmation maybe they'll go
Bernie will be in St Paul tonight. Sign them up for the rally and when they get the text confirmation maybe they'll go
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
I was gonna say, why would Stacy be in DC?
I was gonna say, why would Stacy be in DC?
D
Deutsche Gopher Fan
Guest
I believe voting has been open for awhile...will be interesting.
I have to decide if I’m still going for Liz or just going for Bernie
psych
Well-known member
I don’t disagree with any of that. But, you basically made a case that IF it gets to the second ballot, because no one received a majority of delegates, nearly all of the superdelegates will choose Biden, because of their money being protected. Your argument, which I discern is different from Kepler’s, despite both being Sanders fans, is that an announcement of Stacey Abrams as the VP choice for Sanders is not worth that much to his securing the nomination. If Sanders has a good Super Tuesday tomorrow like projected, but still doesn’t earn the majority of delegates, which, again, is the requirement and currently most likely scenario, what gets him over the top?
My post a couple days ago about the establishment not coalescing around Biden is not aging very well.
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
If the delegate count at the end is something like 45-35-20 between Sanders-Biden-All Others I don't see a scenario where Sanders wouldn't get the nod. Logic would dictate that most of Warren's people if given the chance will gravitate towards Sanders and put him over the top as well as people who feel the candidate with the plurality should get the nomination.
The problem becomes if they're like 40-40 with 20 % split among a few other candidates. That could get ugly and you can't really do a unity ticket with two 80 year olds.
If the delegate count at the end is something like 45-35-20 between Sanders-Biden-All Others I don't see a scenario where Sanders wouldn't get the nod. Logic would dictate that most of Warren's people if given the chance will gravitate towards Sanders and put him over the top as well as people who feel the candidate with the plurality should get the nomination.
The problem becomes if they're like 40-40 with 20 % split among a few other candidates. That could get ugly and you can't really do a unity ticket with two 80 year olds.
ticapnews
Never graduate.
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
An announcement would be huge for the people in states still to vote, which is significant. New York, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Michigan, Florida. Most of which will also be important for the general. If he gets a good boost tomorrow and is able to use that momentum to carry future states then he will win on the first ballot. If Biden and Bloomberg are able to blunt his momentum then it will be a contested convention.
An announcement would be huge for the people in states still to vote, which is significant. New York, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Michigan, Florida. Most of which will also be important for the general. If he gets a good boost tomorrow and is able to use that momentum to carry future states then he will win on the first ballot. If Biden and Bloomberg are able to blunt his momentum then it will be a contested convention.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Demcratic Challengers 11: Saving the Republic one voter at a time!
Abrams is regularly trumpeted on Dem sites like Kos as a progressive, not a centrist. She also has gotten a lot of press about it. Here is some.
I don't think it's exactly inside baseball that Abrams is strongly Left. She has a different flavor from Sanders -- she is more about identity than economics -- but she recognizes each colors the other.
The Strong Left fights on two fronts.
The Culture Front (Abrams, AOC, Kos) believes if you change the culture from sexism and racism to social equality then the principal injustices of society will be remedied. They see the brutality of society as arising from the dominance of white males and the "othering" of the rest of the population. Kill bigotry and then you have a community of humans who will respect each other. Economic justice is achieved as the lack of a dominant identity detoxifies social relations. This form of Leftism has been ascendant in the universities and among activists since the mid-1970s and is why we have made so much progress on social justice.
The Economic Front (Sanders, Kepler, Jacobin) believes you must address economic inequality first and, while this will not correct an individual's sexism and racism, it will reduce the impact of bigotry from systemic and institutional oppression to the private neuroses of isolated subcultures of idiots. Dry up the ability of racists and sexists to afflict others and you neuter their ability to do harm. They can stew in the juices of their sexism and racism as much as they want -- they no longer matter. Also, bigotry against oppressed groups depends heavily on tropes involving their relative lack of economic and political power, so the more equal things are the less they will suffer socially from conflation with their handicapped economic position. To take a simple example, as blacks escape poverty white people stop thinking they are lazy or criminals (c.f. Irish, Italians). This form of Leftism was ascendant in the universities and among activists from the end of WW2 through the early 1970s and was why we made so much progress during that interval on economic justice which unfortunately since then has been lost.
The difference is of emphasis: each respects the other's commitment and each sees its own agenda reflected in the other's. It's just a difference of opinion as to where to attack the enemy line. For obvious reasons white males like myself tend to fight on the Economic Front while POC and women tend to fight on the Culture Front.
Abrams is regularly trumpeted on Dem sites like Kos as a progressive, not a centrist. She also has gotten a lot of press about it. Here is some.
I don't think it's exactly inside baseball that Abrams is strongly Left. She has a different flavor from Sanders -- she is more about identity than economics -- but she recognizes each colors the other.
The Strong Left fights on two fronts.
The Culture Front (Abrams, AOC, Kos) believes if you change the culture from sexism and racism to social equality then the principal injustices of society will be remedied. They see the brutality of society as arising from the dominance of white males and the "othering" of the rest of the population. Kill bigotry and then you have a community of humans who will respect each other. Economic justice is achieved as the lack of a dominant identity detoxifies social relations. This form of Leftism has been ascendant in the universities and among activists since the mid-1970s and is why we have made so much progress on social justice.
The Economic Front (Sanders, Kepler, Jacobin) believes you must address economic inequality first and, while this will not correct an individual's sexism and racism, it will reduce the impact of bigotry from systemic and institutional oppression to the private neuroses of isolated subcultures of idiots. Dry up the ability of racists and sexists to afflict others and you neuter their ability to do harm. They can stew in the juices of their sexism and racism as much as they want -- they no longer matter. Also, bigotry against oppressed groups depends heavily on tropes involving their relative lack of economic and political power, so the more equal things are the less they will suffer socially from conflation with their handicapped economic position. To take a simple example, as blacks escape poverty white people stop thinking they are lazy or criminals (c.f. Irish, Italians). This form of Leftism was ascendant in the universities and among activists from the end of WW2 through the early 1970s and was why we made so much progress during that interval on economic justice which unfortunately since then has been lost.
The difference is of emphasis: each respects the other's commitment and each sees its own agenda reflected in the other's. It's just a difference of opinion as to where to attack the enemy line. For obvious reasons white males like myself tend to fight on the Economic Front while POC and women tend to fight on the Culture Front.
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