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Dead Thread 2021 -- If you're reading this, it isn't you.

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SJHovey said:
Motorcycle accident doesn't imply that it's the motorcyclist's fault. It's just a way of describing an accident, while at the same time telling the reader they type of vehicle the victim was in or operating.
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But the way they write them up does indeed imply that. Sure, he was on a motorcycle, and there was an accident. But he was doing everything right, until the idiot car driver turned in front of him.

Why don't they call it a car-motorcycle collision? Why don't they say, killed on motorcycle when a car turned in front of him. Nope, it's motorcycle accident, like he drove it off the road or something.
 
LynahFan said:
What, exactly, is that supposed to prove?

There are ~30 motorcyclist deaths per 100M miles travelled, vs. 1.5 deaths per 100M automobile miles. Given that passenger cars carry more people than motorcycles, the car safety rate is even more than the 20x better that these numbers would indicate.
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And again, I would bet the vast majority of those were not the motorcycle operator's fault.

Car just has better protective elements surrounding it's occupants.
 
rufus said:
And again, I would bet the vast majority of those were not the motorcycle operator's fault.

Car just has better protective elements surrounding it's occupants.
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Vast majority? Based on what exactly? I'm guessing it's split pretty evenly.
 
LynahFan said:
What, exactly, is that supposed to prove?

There are ~30 motorcyclist deaths per 100M miles travelled, vs. 1.5 deaths per 100M automobile miles. Given that passenger cars carry more people than motorcycles, the car safety rate is even more than the 20x better that these numbers would indicate.
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It wasn't a story intended to prove anything. Kep made the argument (which I agree with) that the minute you take a motorcycle out of the showroom, you are basically taking your life into your own hands.

But try telling that to inlaws that are 89 and 90, and have been riding motorcycles for a lifetime. I think it's asinine that they take trips, like the one to Alaska, but since it's about a 50/50 proposition that my father-in-law is carrying at any given point in time, it's not an opinion I express too openly in his presence.
 
rufus said:
But the way they write them up does indeed imply that. Sure, he was on a motorcycle, and there was an accident. But he was doing everything right, until the idiot car driver turned in front of him.

Why don't they call it a car-motorcycle collision? Why don't they say, killed on motorcycle when a car turned in front of him. Nope, it's motorcycle accident, like he drove it off the road or something.
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I hear what you are saying, but when I read "motorcycle accident," I immediately thought of two things. First, he was on a motorcycle, which I think is a fact that needs to be expressed in the story. Second, I was curious as to the surrounding facts, which caused me to go beyond the headline and look for a description of exactly what happened.

I'm just not sure there is really any other way for a journalist to write it.
 
dxmnkd316 said:
Vast majority? Based on what exactly? I'm guessing it's split pretty evenly.
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When I was first working as a nurse decades ago I worked Rehab and probably 90% of my patients injured while riding a motorcycle were not at fault so this tickled my curiosity. (almost all of them were helmetless/ not wearing protective gear which leaves people with really nasty, messy aftermath) Went down the rabbit hole- looking for stats was pretty interesting. Lots of legal fodder- law firms 'informational posts- for most part the stats they post line up with the public health stats although they tend to list only the high number, not the range.

https://www.tl4j.com/5-shocking-moto...t%20one%20car. About 75% of all motorcycle crashes involve a collision between a motorcycle and at least one car. Most of these motorcycle crashes are caused by motorists who fail to spot motorcycles in traffic when they turn, change lanes, move through an intersection, or merge. These drivers either fail to detect the motorcyclist altogether or only see him when it is too late to avoid the crash. The majority of motorcycle crashes occur in intersections when the motorist violates the motorcyclist’s right-of-way or fails to obey a traffic sign or light.

https://www.hg.org/legal-articles/li...ccidents-31124

6. In multiple vehicle accidents, 2/3 of the accidents are caused by the other vehicle violating the motorcycle's right-of-way.

7. The failure of motorists to detect and recognize motorcycles in traffic is the predominating cause of motorcycle accidents. The driver of the other vehicle involved in collision with the motorcycle did not see the motorcycle before the collision, or did not see the motorcycle until too late to avoid the collision.

https://motorcycleaccident.org/motor...ssible-causes/
Take home- Wear a helmet, don't lane split, don't speed and don't drink and drive. (and don't live in a State that is warm and sunny- they have really horrid numbers) Much as they intrigue me, I wouldn't get on one. The human wreckage that occurs in a crash is nasty with a lot of deforming, life changing injury. My 86 yo FIL was riding one until about a yr ago. Never had a single mishap.
 
Interesting. wasn't expecting that.

I guess I'd say litigating who failed to detect is tricky. Obviously the investigators may have, but I think it's also a conscious decision to pick a tiny vehicle that fits very inconveniently is the blind spot of a mini cooper. You know that risk when you purchase a motorcycle. It's easier to miss unless you're being diligent 100% of the time. Which no one is.

Some riders are very good about where they ride in relation to the other vehicles. Others weave and dart through traffic and place themselves in bad spots they shouldn't be riding in.

None of this is to absolve the car drivers. Cars should pay more attention on the road and Start Seeing Motorcycles.

But as I've always said, right of way is determined by physics, not the law.
 
leswp1 said:
probably 90% of my patients injured while riding a motorcycle were not at fault ... (almost all of them were helmetless/ not wearing protective gear...)
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So you're saying they were partly at fault.

Yeah, I know legally they aren't, but I would still be all for a law that says a motorcyclist who isn't wearing a helmet is automatically deemed to be at fault for any head injuries.
 
John Romita. The man I associate most closely with Spiderman, as his was the work I first saw on that comic.
 
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Urge Overkill drummer Blackie Onassis.


​​​​​​Getting old when you're seeing 90's band dudes dying.
 
Swiss cyclist Gino Mader.

Crashed on the windy, twisty descent of the final climb in yesterday's stage of the Tour De Suisse, and apparently fell down a ravine and ended up submerged in water. Resuscitated at the scene, but succumbed to his injuries overnight.
 
rufus said:
Swiss cyclist Gino Mader.

Crashed on the windy, twisty descent of the final climb in yesterday's stage of the Tour De Suisse, and apparently fell down a ravine and ended up submerged in water. Resuscitated at the scene, but succumbed to his injuries overnight.
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That's... awful.
 
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