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Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

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Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

The Sicatoka said:
So when you say "permit classes", are you claiming every gun owner must be permitted ... i.e. put into a (Donald Trump-esque) database?
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I'm not advocating for this, but a database of people who choose to own a gun is a far cry from a database of brown people.
 
Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

SJHovey said:
But there is a third step that I think we can take, and which I have advocated, which is to simply try to make it more expensive for people to own guns. I don't own 10 cars because that would be d@mn expensive. I own 10 guns, however.

Impose an insurance cost. Raise taxes on guns and ammunition and apply the proceeds to education programs or restitution of victims. Increase permit charges. Apply a fee for the federal firearms form you fill out when you buy a gun. Impose civil liability on gun owners whose weapons are used in a crime. Geez, the one thing the government is good at is figuring out ways to nickel and dime us to death. Attack this problem in the same way.
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I think you'd run afoul of McCulloch pretty quickly if you go too far down that path. "The power to tax is the power to destroy." SCOTUS just ruled that mandatory health insurance is actually a tax, and I'm sure they'd feel the same way about mandatory gun insurance. Congress does not have the power to tax away a right (see: tax, poll).
 
Kepler said:
They're really scrawny too. Coyotes always look like they're on the point of death.

The problem is, if you actually see one he's desperate enough to risk human contact and/or sick enough not to care, so he's that little wiry guy in the fight -- yes, he'll lose, but not before doing serious damage.
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Eastern coyotes are bigger than western (have bred with wolves at some point). Coyotes typically hunt alone but there have been reports of eastern ones exhibiting wolf-like tendencies to hunt in packs. Two coyotes killed a hiker in Nova Scotia a few years ago.
 
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dxmnkd316 said:
Again, how are you going to deal with people who can't afford to exercise their rights because they don't make enough money to pay for insurance? A car is not a right. A gun is.
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You have the right to travel freely among the states, too. That doesn't mean everyone can afford to do so.

Clearly the second amendment is not unlimited, or else the ban on fully automatic weapons would not be constitutional.

The first amendment isn't unlimited, either. You have the right to free speech, but the government can still regulate the time, place, and manner of that speech. Governments can impose things like permits and fees for protest marches, for instance.
 
Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

unofan said:
You have the right to travel freely among the states, too. That doesn't mean everyone can afford to do so.

Clearly the second amendment is not unlimited, or else the ban on fully automatic weapons would not be constitutional.

The first amendment isn't unlimited, either. You have the right to free speech, but the government can still regulate the time, place, and manner of that speech. Governments can impose things like permits and fees for protest marches, for instance.
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Yes, but those things are very suspect to the courts. There has to be a compelling public interest, other than "we just want to reduce it." Permits and fees for protest marches are to ensure that the protesting *does* occur - in a safe and fair way - not so that there will be less of it.
 
Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

Kepler said:
They're really scrawny too. Coyotes always look like they're on the point of death.
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Not around here they're not. Look very healthy and fit. Probably the diet of housecats, small dogs, and rabbits which are all plentiful and easy to catch.
 
Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

GrinCDXX said:
Your point being that things are the same if you choose to ignore the differences?
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A database of people different from you is a database of people different from you. I don't care if it's based on religion, gun ownership, or BC fans.

That database is a tool for untoward ends.
 
Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

LynahFan said:
I think you'd run afoul of McCulloch pretty quickly if you go too far down that path. "The power to tax is the power to destroy." SCOTUS just ruled that mandatory health insurance is actually a tax, and I'm sure they'd feel the same way about mandatory gun insurance. Congress does not have the power to tax away a right (see: tax, poll).
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Maybe. We're going to find out.

https://www.nraila.org/articles/20150824/nra-sues-to-stop-seattle-gun-tax

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/04/07/gun-taxes-owners-second-amendment/2049363/
 
Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

The Sicatoka said:
A database of people different from you is a database of people different from you. I don't care if it's based on religion, gun ownership, or BC fans.

That database is a tool for untoward ends.
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Like I said, if you ignore the difference, they're the same. If you ignore the difference between a database of sex offenders and a database of brown people, they're also the same.
 
Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

unofan said:
You have the right to travel freely among the states, too. That doesn't mean everyone can afford to do so.
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That has nothing to do with the government imposing "state migration insurance" or a "state exodus tax". Once the government starts applying those, then we'll talk.

This is about the government stepping in to limit the rights of people. Not the commercial cost of exercising rights.
 
Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

Kepler said:
A compelling public interest for gun restrictions and regulation? Uh, yeah, I think even I could write that brief.
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I think the standards for taking away a right from the Bill of Rights is a little higher than you're giving credit.
 
Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

GrinCDXX said:
Like I said, if you ignore the difference, they're the same. If you ignore the difference between a database of sex offenders and a database of brown people, they're also the same.
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A sex offender has been adjudicated as having violated law. That's public record.

Being brown, Methodist, a gun owner, or a BC fan is a Constitutionally protected right. I don't want a database of people who've done nothing illegal.
 
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Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

SJHovey said:
Maybe. We're going to find out.

https://www.nraila.org/articles/20150824/nra-sues-to-stop-seattle-gun-tax
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C'mon, City of Seattle is in violation of State of Washington law. It took seconds to figure that out.
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9.41.290

"Cities, towns, and counties or other municipalities may enact only those laws and ordinances relating to firearms that are specifically authorized by state law ..."

(North Dakota has similar law.)
 
Re: Days Since Last Mass Shooting: 0

The Sicatoka said:
A sex offender has been adjudicated as having violated law. That's public record.
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I'm aware. When you stop ignoring the differences, they become different. Just like if you were to stop ignoring the difference between people who choose to own something and people who are something, the gun-owner and brown persons databases would become different. By saying a gun owner database is "Trump-esque", you are suggesting a level of persecution that isn't there and is quite honestly ridiculous.
 
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