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Covid 19
- Thread starter BlackI
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walrus
Wind up workin' in a gas station
ticapnews
Never graduate.
"That belongs in a museum!"
ticapnews
Never graduate.
But we can use the flu vaccine on it, right?
theprofromdover
The Original Dope Detector
Re: Covid 19
The doctor at the epicenter of the Bergamo Italy outbreak has posted this on Facebook. Only 1% of the cities population is infected and they are overwhelmed.
“After much thought about whether and what to write about what is happening to us, I felt that silence was not responsible,” Macchini wrote in his post, as translated by Dr. Silvia Stringhini, an epidemiologist and researcher at the Geneva University’s Institute of Global Health.
“I will therefore try to convey to people far from our reality what we are living in Bergamo in these days of Covid-19 pandemic. I understand the need not to create panic, but when the message of the dangerousness of what is happening does not reach people I shudder,” he said.
In Bergamo, a city of about 122,000 some 30 miles northeast of Milan, 1,245 people have been diagnosed with the coronavirus in one of the country’s worst-affected areas.
“I myself watched with some amazement the reorganization of the entire hospital in the past week, when our current enemy was still in the shadows: the wards slowly ’emptied,’ elective activities were interrupted,” he continued in the chilling post, which was shared more than 29,000 times.
“All this rapid transformation brought an atmosphere of silence and surreal emptiness to the corridors of the hospital that we did not yet understand, waiting for a war that was yet to begin and that many (including me) were not so sure would ever come with such ferocity,” he said.
“I still remember my night call a week ago when I was waiting for the results of a swab. When I think about it, my anxiety over one possible case seems almost ridiculous and unjustified, now that I’ve seen what’s happening. Well, the situation now is dramatic to say the least,” Macchini added.
“The war has literally exploded and battles are uninterrupted day and night. But now that need for beds has arrived in all its drama. One after the other the departments that had been emptied fill up at an impressive pace.
“The boards with the names of the patients, of different colors depending on the operating unit, are now all red and instead of surgery you see the diagnosis, which is always the ****ed same: bilateral interstitial pneumonia.”
The doctor urged people not to describe Covid-19 as a bad case of the flu.
“Now, explain to me which flu virus causes such a rapid drama. … And while there are still people who boast of not being afraid by ignoring directions, protesting because their normal routine is ‘temporarily’ put in crisis, the epidemiological disaster is taking place,” he said.
“And there are no more surgeons, urologists, orthopedists, we are only doctors who suddenly become part of a single team to face this tsunami that has overwhelmed us.
“Cases are multiplying, we arrive at a rate of 15-20 admissions per day all for the same reason. The results of the swabs now come one after the other: positive, positive, positive. Suddenly the E.R. is collapsing.”
Describing every available ventilator as “gold,” Macchini said the doctors and nurses working at his side are exhausted.
“I saw the tiredness on faces that didn’t know what it was despite the already exhausting workloads they had. I saw a solidarity of all of us who never failed to go to our internist colleagues to ask, ‘What can I do for you now?’
“Doctors who move beds and transfer patients, who administer therapies instead of nurses. Nurses with tears in their eyes because we can’t save everyone, and the vital parameters of several patients at the same time reveal an already marked destiny.
“There are no more shifts, no more hours. Social life is suspended for us. We no longer see our families for fear of infecting them. Some of us have already become infected despite the protocols,” he said.
Macchini noted that some of his colleagues have become infected themselves and then infected their relatives who “are already struggling between life and death.”
“So be patient, you can’t go to the theater, museums or the gym. Try to have pity on the myriad of old people you could exterminate,” he said.
“I finish by saying that I really don’t understand this war on panic. The only reason I see is mask shortages, but there’s no mask on sale anymore. We don’t have a lot of studies, but is panic really worse than neglect and carelessness during an epidemic of this sort?”
The doctor at the epicenter of the Bergamo Italy outbreak has posted this on Facebook. Only 1% of the cities population is infected and they are overwhelmed.
“After much thought about whether and what to write about what is happening to us, I felt that silence was not responsible,” Macchini wrote in his post, as translated by Dr. Silvia Stringhini, an epidemiologist and researcher at the Geneva University’s Institute of Global Health.
“I will therefore try to convey to people far from our reality what we are living in Bergamo in these days of Covid-19 pandemic. I understand the need not to create panic, but when the message of the dangerousness of what is happening does not reach people I shudder,” he said.
In Bergamo, a city of about 122,000 some 30 miles northeast of Milan, 1,245 people have been diagnosed with the coronavirus in one of the country’s worst-affected areas.
“I myself watched with some amazement the reorganization of the entire hospital in the past week, when our current enemy was still in the shadows: the wards slowly ’emptied,’ elective activities were interrupted,” he continued in the chilling post, which was shared more than 29,000 times.
“All this rapid transformation brought an atmosphere of silence and surreal emptiness to the corridors of the hospital that we did not yet understand, waiting for a war that was yet to begin and that many (including me) were not so sure would ever come with such ferocity,” he said.
“I still remember my night call a week ago when I was waiting for the results of a swab. When I think about it, my anxiety over one possible case seems almost ridiculous and unjustified, now that I’ve seen what’s happening. Well, the situation now is dramatic to say the least,” Macchini added.
“The war has literally exploded and battles are uninterrupted day and night. But now that need for beds has arrived in all its drama. One after the other the departments that had been emptied fill up at an impressive pace.
“The boards with the names of the patients, of different colors depending on the operating unit, are now all red and instead of surgery you see the diagnosis, which is always the ****ed same: bilateral interstitial pneumonia.”
The doctor urged people not to describe Covid-19 as a bad case of the flu.
“Now, explain to me which flu virus causes such a rapid drama. … And while there are still people who boast of not being afraid by ignoring directions, protesting because their normal routine is ‘temporarily’ put in crisis, the epidemiological disaster is taking place,” he said.
“And there are no more surgeons, urologists, orthopedists, we are only doctors who suddenly become part of a single team to face this tsunami that has overwhelmed us.
“Cases are multiplying, we arrive at a rate of 15-20 admissions per day all for the same reason. The results of the swabs now come one after the other: positive, positive, positive. Suddenly the E.R. is collapsing.”
Describing every available ventilator as “gold,” Macchini said the doctors and nurses working at his side are exhausted.
“I saw the tiredness on faces that didn’t know what it was despite the already exhausting workloads they had. I saw a solidarity of all of us who never failed to go to our internist colleagues to ask, ‘What can I do for you now?’
“Doctors who move beds and transfer patients, who administer therapies instead of nurses. Nurses with tears in their eyes because we can’t save everyone, and the vital parameters of several patients at the same time reveal an already marked destiny.
“There are no more shifts, no more hours. Social life is suspended for us. We no longer see our families for fear of infecting them. Some of us have already become infected despite the protocols,” he said.
Macchini noted that some of his colleagues have become infected themselves and then infected their relatives who “are already struggling between life and death.”
“So be patient, you can’t go to the theater, museums or the gym. Try to have pity on the myriad of old people you could exterminate,” he said.
“I finish by saying that I really don’t understand this war on panic. The only reason I see is mask shortages, but there’s no mask on sale anymore. We don’t have a lot of studies, but is panic really worse than neglect and carelessness during an epidemic of this sort?”
NCAA watcher
Registered User
Re: Covid 19
According to the CDC, the flu hospitalization rate as of the week ending February 29, 2020, was 57.9 per 100,000 cases.
The AHA has estimated the CV hospitalization rate as 5%. In the Chinese study of 72,000+ patients, 14% of cases were severely ill and an additional 5% of cases were critical.
The hospitalization rate for CV is like 10X the flu plus it appears that outbreaks are localized.
All of this means the need for scarce resources will be far greater than we see with the flu
According to the CDC, the flu hospitalization rate as of the week ending February 29, 2020, was 57.9 per 100,000 cases.
The AHA has estimated the CV hospitalization rate as 5%. In the Chinese study of 72,000+ patients, 14% of cases were severely ill and an additional 5% of cases were critical.
The hospitalization rate for CV is like 10X the flu plus it appears that outbreaks are localized.
All of this means the need for scarce resources will be far greater than we see with the flu
leswp1
Well-known member
Re: Covid 19
You also belong in the real thread- posting stuff that is based in reality.
This is what came out thru the WHO at the height of the Wuhan part of the outbreak. Not just the morbidity and mortality but the state of the healthcare system.
You also belong in the real thread- posting stuff that is based in reality.
NCAA watcher
Registered User
Re: Covid 19
Pretty disheartening that some folks are so willing to be so vocal in disseminating talking points without any thought, simply because it aligns with their political views. String together two facts about the number of flu deaths without considering the obvious question about future cases (the exponential growth of cases by CV), would fail basic logic 101 in any class.
Not only do they fail to think, but they are so quick to circulate the "fact" and chastize others for thinking, solely because it fits the agenda. It's as if they are unaware that there are experts who model these things their entire life.
That is a step below just being ignorant.
Pretty disheartening that some folks are so willing to be so vocal in disseminating talking points without any thought, simply because it aligns with their political views. String together two facts about the number of flu deaths without considering the obvious question about future cases (the exponential growth of cases by CV), would fail basic logic 101 in any class.
Not only do they fail to think, but they are so quick to circulate the "fact" and chastize others for thinking, solely because it fits the agenda. It's as if they are unaware that there are experts who model these things their entire life.
That is a step below just being ignorant.
leswp1
Well-known member
Re: Covid 19
All. of. this.
Denial is the most potent drug in humanity. People do not like to change and they would much rather be told that everything is OK than to think they have to change.
The fact we have leaders willing to say false and misleading statements is mind-boggling but not as distressing as the number of people willing to be lead to a dangerous place.
All. of. this.
Denial is the most potent drug in humanity. People do not like to change and they would much rather be told that everything is OK than to think they have to change.
The fact we have leaders willing to say false and misleading statements is mind-boggling but not as distressing as the number of people willing to be lead to a dangerous place.
Slap Shot
I got nothing
Re: Covid 19
Which entities (beyond social media) are not exercising practical caution and common sense? Hysteria regarding the supposed hysterical reactions to the current situation is every bit as off the charts as that which they're complaining about.
Which entities (beyond social media) are not exercising practical caution and common sense? Hysteria regarding the supposed hysterical reactions to the current situation is every bit as off the charts as that which they're complaining about.
Patman
Rodent of Unusual Size
As if you've been immune to such hackery.
My only contention is in the denominators and whether or not the mortality rates are truly as high as we claim due to lack of detection. On the other hand one can say that the regular flu also goes around without detection.
What we need is clean and clear info and I feel that isnt happening right now because data quality has been bad. Most. Most. Most people will listen to well reasoned argument when presented. Often the problem is that a well reasoned case doesnt get presented and the person isnt given the opportunity to sort through and argue with the argument. this is ignoring certain information and logic hole including those who purport as living in my home town.
To that person, do not go near my parents... you are a dangerously ignorant person.
Right now, I see many reasons for expansive sick leave policies and manufacture blue collar slow down and as this is a legit crisis some way to deal with or amend the losses by employer and employee. Right now I'm not a fan of closing schools unless you are using the arguement that one patient is already too late. However. If we are using that protocol then we should already be forcing all white collar work to go home and or telework. I prefer the one case rule before we shut down businesses and schools. Universities and colleges are a bit tougher because of the dormitory and tight quarter living
All this said if we are looking at pseudo quarantine of six months to a year goods and services still need to move or else we all starve. So we cant go crazy and shut down everything. We need to make sure utilities stay in operation.
Above all the various levels have to work with the people. This is political establishment and medical establishment. We cant just cancel society... but we can work together
dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
Re: Covid 19
Who gives a **** about the denominator when the numerator is enough to cripple our systems?
Who gives a **** about the denominator when the numerator is enough to cripple our systems?
Patman
Rodent of Unusual Size
Stop acting like a little child. Where have I am said that I haven't gotten a thing or two wrong.
I dont know how old you are. But I'm going to assume its 12 for the time being. Acting hysterical does not gain you any respect.
dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
Re: Covid 19
hysterical? Ha. Ok. Im pointing out where you’re not just wrong but dangerously wrong and have done so several times. That you keep repeating this selfish and incorrect talking point is kind of insane. Like you aren’t listening to fact.
But of course, it’s histrionics when someone says, “Italy shut down” or “The numerator is big enough to cripple our system”, both facts. You haven’t listened to reason, you haven’t listened to facts, you’ve continued to repeat dangerous right wing talking points, and I’m left wondering what your angle is.
hysterical? Ha. Ok. Im pointing out where you’re not just wrong but dangerously wrong and have done so several times. That you keep repeating this selfish and incorrect talking point is kind of insane. Like you aren’t listening to fact.
But of course, it’s histrionics when someone says, “Italy shut down” or “The numerator is big enough to cripple our system”, both facts. You haven’t listened to reason, you haven’t listened to facts, you’ve continued to repeat dangerous right wing talking points, and I’m left wondering what your angle is.
Sean Pickett
2009 NCAA Champions
Re: Covid 19
Serious question here. One of the things people here have stocked up on is bottled water. San Pellegrino is bottled in Bergamo. Should that be a concern if it is one of the epicenters of the outbreaks?
Serious question here. One of the things people here have stocked up on is bottled water. San Pellegrino is bottled in Bergamo. Should that be a concern if it is one of the epicenters of the outbreaks?
HockeyRef
Well-known member
Re: Covid 19
Today the WHO declares Covid-19 officially a pandemic:
From Germany:
Chancellor Angela Merkel said on Wednesday that the coronavirus was likely to infect about two-thirds of the German population.
“Given a virus for which there is no immunity and no immunization, we have to understand that many people will be infected. The consensus among experts is that 60 to 70 percent of the population will be infected,” she said.
Wow....
Today the WHO declares Covid-19 officially a pandemic:
From Germany:
Chancellor Angela Merkel said on Wednesday that the coronavirus was likely to infect about two-thirds of the German population.
“Given a virus for which there is no immunity and no immunization, we have to understand that many people will be infected. The consensus among experts is that 60 to 70 percent of the population will be infected,” she said.
Wow....
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