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College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

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Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

CLS said:
Excellent point. Also, in college hockey the conference tournament is always meaningful for at least some teams (teams that wouldn’t qualify as at-large teams) even if it’s not equally meaningful for all.


I’m fine with Alabama having sweated also. But the hockey equivalent of Alabama – a very good team that lost a key game – wouldn’t even have to have sweated; the would have been in the tournament anyway based on their regular season record. I disagree with your statement that the regular season “doesn’t matter”. Yes, they played Mercer. But they also played and beat some very good teams. Do you think UCF would have been undefeated if they had played Alabama’s schedule? Do you think Alabama would have gotten in if they had gone 8-3 in the regular season? Or if they had gone 11-0 playing UCF’s schedule? If you do, we disagree.
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IMHO, that is irrelevant. I'm not pining for UCF, but am at least thinking that USC or OSU did more to actually earn a right to be in the championship. Bama got there on "merit". Just like OSU did last year. The fact that you don't even have to take a chance on your conference championship game and you still get in sucks. And that makes NOT winning the conference perfectly fine. And I don't like that.

For the entire season, Wisconsin got hammered for a light schedule. The ONLY team that beat them was OSU. Bama had a weaker schedule, especially when you take the context of the bowls in. Had Bama beat Auburn, and then had the crap kicked out of them by Georgia- would they still have gotten a spot? It's just one loss.

This whole championship thing sucks.
 
Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

alfablue said:
IMHO, that is irrelevant. I'm not pining for UCF, but am at least thinking that USC or OSU did more to actually earn a right to be in the championship. Bama got there on "merit". Just like OSU did last year. The fact that you don't even have to take a chance on your conference championship game and you still get in sucks. And that makes NOT winning the conference perfectly fine. And I don't like that.

For the entire season, Wisconsin got hammered for a light schedule. The ONLY team that beat them was OSU. Bama had a weaker schedule, especially when you take the context of the bowls in. Had Bama beat Auburn, and then had the crap kicked out of them by Georgia- would they still have gotten a spot? It's just one loss.

This whole championship thing sucks.
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OK, so we just don’t agree on how important winning the conference championship is. That’s a point reasonable people can disagree on.

I hate Alabama, but I’m OK with their being in the tournament. I’d also be OK with a college hockey team that comes in second in their conference during the regular season, getting bounced in the first round of their conference championship, making the tournament based on their PWR, and winning the national tournament. Presumably, you wouldn't be.

I am curious as to how you arrive at the conclusion that Alabama had a weaker schedule than Wisconsin. I don’t know what algorithm the NCAA uses, but using this one (which has the advantage of being able to get rankings on a specific date) here are the rankings for Wisconsin and Alabama:

Completion of regular season: Alabama 7, Wisconsin 45
Following conference championships: Alabama 10, Wisconsin 20
Following Orange and Sugar Bowls: Alabama 6, Wisconsin 14
End of Season: Alabama 2, Wisconsin 14
 
CLS said:
Excellent point. Also, in college hockey the conference tournament is always meaningful for at least some teams (teams that wouldn’t qualify as at-large teams) even if it’s not equally meaningful for all.


I’m fine with Alabama having sweated also. But the hockey equivalent of Alabama – a very good team that lost a key game – wouldn’t even have to have sweated; the would have been in the tournament anyway based on their regular season record. I disagree with your statement that the regular season “doesn’t matter”. Yes, they played Mercer. But they also played and beat some very good teams. Do you think UCF would have been undefeated if they had played Alabama’s schedule? Do you think Alabama would have gotten in if they had gone 8-3 in the regular season? Or if they had gone 11-0 playing UCF’s schedule? If you do, we disagree.
Click to expand...
If the hockey tourney was 4 they’d a been frucked

Make the foosball 16 teams and you’re golden :D
 
CLS said:
OK, so we just don’t agree on how important winning the conference championship is. That’s a point reasonable people can disagree on.

I hate Alabama, but I’m OK with their being in the tournament. I’d also be OK with a college hockey team that comes in second in their conference during the regular season, getting bounced in the first round of their conference championship, making the tournament based on their PWR, and winning the national tournament. Presumably, you wouldn't be.

I am curious as to how you arrive at the conclusion that Alabama had a weaker schedule than Wisconsin. I don’t know what algorithm the NCAA uses, but using this one (which has the advantage of being able to get rankings on a specific date) here are the rankings for Wisconsin and Alabama:

Completion of regular season: Alabama 7, Wisconsin 45
Following conference championships: Alabama 10, Wisconsin 20
Following Orange and Sugar Bowls: Alabama 6, Wisconsin 14
End of Season: Alabama 2, Wisconsin 14
Click to expand...

How could Bama sos go up after playing uga? That team blew a huge lead and gave up a 41y td to lose.
They were awful
 
Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

CLS said:
OK, so we just don’t agree on how important winning the conference championship is. That’s a point reasonable people can disagree on.

I hate Alabama, but I’m OK with their being in the tournament. I’d also be OK with a college hockey team that comes in second in their conference during the regular season, getting bounced in the first round of their conference championship, making the tournament based on their PWR, and winning the national tournament. Presumably, you wouldn't be.

I am curious as to how you arrive at the conclusion that Alabama had a weaker schedule than Wisconsin. I don’t know what algorithm the NCAA uses, but using this one (which has the advantage of being able to get rankings on a specific date) here are the rankings for Wisconsin and Alabama:

Completion of regular season: Alabama 7, Wisconsin 45
Following conference championships: Alabama 10, Wisconsin 20
Following Orange and Sugar Bowls: Alabama 6, Wisconsin 14
End of Season: Alabama 2, Wisconsin 14
Click to expand...

And if you look at other sites, they come up with a totally different SOS rating. Seems like Bamas would have gone down after the bowl games, since the SEC was well under .500. In other words, there's barely a way to come up with a number that is statistically relevant and meaningful.

But ignore the SEC bias, the non conference schedule- Bama played FSU (which should have been strong, but they were barely .500), Colorado State, Fresno (who ended up good) and Mercer. If I were a fan, I would not be all that happy, since none of those teams, other than FSU, are terribly interesting.

Still, IMHO, it sucks that winning a conference championship has so little importance, and that also means that losing a conference, even by one game, has barely an impact. That sucks a lot of life out of what should make football interesting. Now it's more of a national sport just to get TV ratings. yay....
 
Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

alfablue said:
And if you look at other sites, they come up with a totally different SOS rating. Seems like Bamas would have gone down after the bowl games, since the SEC was well under .500. In other words, there's barely a way to come up with a number that is statistically relevant and meaningful.
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Agree there. Similar to hockey, there aren’t enough interconference games. Also, to some extent SOS is a matter of luck. As you point out, Alabama – FSU looked like a blockbuster prior to the season. And as for Wisconsin, when BYU in Provo was scheduled (probably several years ago), it looked like a great game. The trend seems to be one tough non-conference game and the rest cupcakes. If what you thought was going to be a tough game turns out to be a semi-cupcake (and/or as with Wisconsin, the teams you're scheduled to play have off years), your SOS is going to suffer.

But ignore the SEC bias, the non conference schedule- Bama played FSU (which should have been strong, but they were barely .500), Colorado State, Fresno (who ended up good) and Mercer. If I were a fan, I would not be all that happy, since none of those teams, other than FSU, are terribly interesting.
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Agree again. Unfortunately, the cupcakes aren’t going away. The power schools like them because they generally don’t risk a loss (I won’t bring up Appalachian State:)) and the cupcakes like them because of the revenue. The only thing that could curtail them is if fans stop going and/or watching them on TV.

Still, IMHO, it sucks that winning a conference championship has so little importance, and that also means that losing a conference, even by one game, has barely an impact. That sucks a lot of life out of what should make football interesting. Now it's more of a national sport just to get TV ratings. yay....
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I think that was one of the “be careful what you wish for” outcomes of the creation of, and tinkering with, the national championship tournament. We’ve seen something similar happen in hockey, but hockey’s been able to offer a plum to the tournament winner – an autobid. Still, many teams know pretty much where they will end up prior to the conference tournament. And the conference tournaments aren’t near what they used to be.

Given the national football tournament isn’t going away, what would you do? I like the suggestion of an eight team tournament with an autobid for the power five and three at-large teams, one of which must be a group of five. Might have changed some of the argument, but IMO, Alabama would have gotten in and still would have won.
 
Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

What if hockey went to just the tournament champions? The conference tournaments would become intense, full barn, showcases knowing that one loss, or a lost series, and your season is kaput.

Envision the ACC tournament prior when the NCAA only took 1 team per conference and you'll get the idea.
 
Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

I hate the idea of tournament champions so much. It erases the importance of the regular season.
 
Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

dxmnkd316 said:
I hate the idea of tournament champions so much. It erases the importance of the regular season.
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Wait, you mean the idea of taking exclusively tourney champs, right? Because yes then you're right.

I have no problem at all with the current system of picking teams. Seeding has one thing that's wrong: there should be no concept of "host" and seeding should be strictly according to PWR and completely ignore proximity and attendance. We're picking the best hockey team, not the deepest alumni pockets.
 
Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

I’d be happy taking conference champions. From the regular season. Get rid of the fluky tournaments.

Obviously in football it’s a necessary evil to have a final game. But for sports with enough games it’s a dilution if the meaning of a championship.
 
dxmnkd316 said:
I’d be happy taking conference champions. From the regular season. Get rid of the fluky tournaments.

Obviously in football it’s a necessary evil to have a final game. But for sports with enough games it’s a dilution if the meaning of a championship.
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Money from fat cat alums. However, in hockey the tournaments have lost their lustre. Back in the day when I was an undergrad you had to make the conference finals to get an NCAA bid (unless you were BU).

The ECAC tournament at the Garden was some intense hockey.
 
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Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

SF has won 5 in a row. Why aren’t they in the playoffs?

Or are they and they got a bye out of the wild card game....
 
Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

Clemson got some good news today for the 2018 season, as Clelin Ferrell, Austin Bryant, Kendall Joseph, and Mark Fields all announced they will return for next season. This follows up on Mitch Hyatt announcing his return earlier this week. The Tigers are still waiting for Christian Wilkins to make his decision, and Deon Cain already announced he will enter the NFL Draft. There is still a long way to go in the offseason and crazy things can happen, but Clemson looks like the early favorite to win the ACC and make their 4th straight Playoff appearance.
 
Fighting Sioux 23 said:
Clemson got some good news today for the 2018 season, as Clelin Ferrell, Austin Bryant, Kendall Joseph, and Mark Fields all announced they will return for next season. This follows up on Mitch Hyatt announcing his return earlier this week. The Tigers are still waiting for Christian Wilkins to make his decision, and Deon Cain already announced he will enter the NFL Draft. There is still a long way to go in the offseason and crazy things can happen, but Clemson looks like the early favorite to win the ACC and make their 4th straight Playoff appearance.
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Everyone on earth is trying to avoid being drafted by the clowns.....
 
Re: College Football 2017-18: Now with more CTE!

mookie1995 said:
Everyone on earth is trying to avoid being drafted by the clowns.....
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We should test this by having CLE trade the 1 & 4. How many of these guys would have an agonizing reappraisal?
 
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