Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an election

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

Exactly why he's more Veep material. While Kasich won't be the nominee, that would be a good ticket, probably the best they can do at this point. Rubio's problem is who gets the nomination. If Jebbers! rises from the grave, can't have two from the same state. If Cruz takes it, I don't think the GOP is ready for an All Hispanic All Star Team ticket. I mean, there's gotta be at least one old white guy in there or why have a Republican party anymore?

What I will say this this, I have no clue who gets the GOP nomination anymore. Jebbers! is getting tuned out and he's a terrible campaigner. Trump is a side show. Carson is nuts. Christie-Huckleberry-Paul are non-entities. Cruz is going to live and die by how the base reacts to the govt shutdown/debt default he's about to cause. I'm of the opinion the more people drop out the stronger Trump is going to become. Walker's organization was supposed to give him a strong showing in Iowa. Now Cruz and Carson are vying for the fundie vote with a lot less staffers, while Trump gets to clean up everybody else. I don't think the establishment guys even are making a play in that state (Bush, Kasich, maybe even Rubio). If Trump wins Iowa do to divided religious nutter vote, then wins New Hampshire due to divided Establishment stiff vote between Kasich and Bush, look out. Has anybody won both those states and not been the nominee?

The Koch's were backing Walker. It will be interesting to see where there money ends up. I have a feeling Jeb is going to get a big push. And that ends Rubio. Funny how Walker thought he could land a punch on Trump on the way out. Uh, no.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

Has anybody won both those states and not been the nominee?

That's a great question.

12: Obama/Obama; Santorum/Romney
08: Obama/Clinton; Huckabee/Bush
04: Kerry/Kerry; Bush/Bush
00: Gore/Gore; Bush/McCain
96: Clinton/Clinton; Dole/Buchanan
92: Harkin/Tsongas; Bush/Bush
88: Gerhardt/Dukakis; Dole/Bush
84: Mondale/Hart; Reagan/Reagan
80: Carter/Carter; Bush/Reagan
76: "Uncommitted"/Carter; Ford/Ford
72: "Uncommitted"/Muskie; (not held)/Nixon

So, nobody has ever swept the two and not been nominated.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

Rubio is a great candidate for VP for a typical GOP candidate...just not the current favorites.

Trump would unlikely be oil and water due to personalities, his statements about Mexicans, and an already contentious relationship. Bush has the Hispanic relationship and is already from FL. Which means Rubio probably has less than a 50/50 of even getting a presidential candidate suitable for him.

 

[SJHovey]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

Exactly. The double standard here is breathtaking. Not trying to call anybody out but would any USCHO poster defend the exact same comments out of Carson with a splitting hairs defense if he had invoked the Jewish faith instead? I think not...

If Carson said "I would not support putting a Jew in the White House", I would certainly defend his right to say that, and his right to vote that way if he chooses. If he said I don't think Judaism is consistent with the constitutional values of the U.S., again I would support his right to say that and believe that.

 

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

If Carson said "I would not support putting a Jew in the White House", I would certainly defend his right to say that, and his right to vote that way if he chooses. If he said I don't think Judaism is consistent with the constitutional values of the U.S., again I would support his right to say that and believe that.

Defending his right to say is not the issue. Him being properly labeled as a bigoted idiot is.

 

[burd]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

If Carson said "I would not support putting a Jew in the White House", I would certainly defend his right to say that, and his right to vote that way if he chooses. If he said I don't think Judaism is consistent with the constitutional values of the U.S., again I would support his right to say that and believe that.

Recognizing another's right to express ideas we consider offensive is extremely important, since people only try to suppress ideas they consider offensive. But that doesn't mean we should shy away from strongly criticizing offensive ideas.

I see Rover just said it better in simpler terms.

 

[St. Clown]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

Rubio is a great candidate for VP for a typical GOP candidate...just not the current favorites.

Trump would unlikely be oil and water due to personalities, his statements about Mexicans, and an already contentious relationship. Bush has the Hispanic relationship and is already from FL. Which means Rubio probably has less than a 50/50 of even getting a presidential candidate suitable for him.

You're lumping Cubans and Mexicans into the same demographic? Don't let the Cubans and Mexicans here you say that.

 

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

My take on VP's is that they rarely win you a state (LBJ - Texas in '60) but they can add some balance or help set a theme for a campaign. Clinton-Gore was New Democrats both in age and ideology for example. Cheney assured the pro war pro 1% tax cut crowd that Bush would toe the line.

Rubio wouldn't "win" Florida for the GOP but he'd signify that they were ready to move on from the Republican Jesus model, which is tall, white, 60+ years old, wealthy, with an Anglo sounding last name. I read some pundidiot saying how Bush-Kasich would be a nightmare for the Dems. Yes, I'm sure the Dems are terrified at two ancient DC fossils, both senior citizen white guys who've been around since the dawn of time, trying to appeal to an ever more diverse electorate. Is it too late for a Dole-Hatch pairing?

I'm not sure there's a lot of depth to Rubio. If there is he hasn't shown it yet but that matters a lot less with the #2 on the ticket (Quayle for example, or Agnew if you really want to go back in time). He's the perfect compliment to whatever old corpse they plan on floating up for the nomination.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

If Carson said "I would not support putting a Jew in the White House", I would certainly defend his right to say that, and his right to vote that way if he chooses. If he said I don't think Judaism is consistent with the constitutional values of the U.S., again I would support his right to say that and believe that.

No one is saying he doesnt have the right to say it but nice try. He has the right to be a bigot if he so chooses. What we are saying is that should be enough to stop people from voting for him. The fact that it isnt, and that the Right seems to be parsing it out and making it seem less bigoted for some reason tells a pretty ugly tale. (and shows the White House wasnt off in what they said yesterday)

edit: As we said before if he had said he wouldnt vote for a Jew for the same reason, he has that right to do it but he would have dropped out of the race this morning.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

My take on VP's is that they rarely win you a state (LBJ - Texas in '60) but they can add some balance or help set a theme for a campaign. Clinton-Gore was New Democrats both in age and ideology for example. Cheney assured the pro war pro 1% tax cut crowd that Bush would toe the line.

Rubio wouldn't "win" Florida for the GOP but he'd signify that they were ready to move on from the Republican Jesus model, which is tall, white, 60+ years old, wealthy, with an Anglo sounding last name. I read some pundidiot saying how Bush-Kasich would be a nightmare for the Dems. Yes, I'm sure the Dems are terrified at two ancient DC fossils, both senior citizen white guys who've been around since the dawn of time, trying to appeal to an ever more diverse electorate. Is it too late for a Dole-Hatch pairing?

I'm not sure there's a lot of depth to Rubio. If there is he hasn't shown it yet but that matters a lot less with the #2 on the ticket (Quayle for example, or Agnew if you really want to go back in time). He's the perfect compliment to whatever old corpse they plan on floating up for the nomination.

Rubio may not be super stellar for VP...but he's as good as anyone for the average white GOP candidate. Just not for Bush, Carson, Trump, Cruz, or maybe Carly. Ok...it doesn't look like he'll be VP now does it.

 

[Slap Shot]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

Fiorina has way more substance than Palin ever did and to say otherwise is pure ignorance.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

Fiorina has way more substance than Palin ever did and to say otherwise is pure ignorance.

And more than Bachmann as well. She'd be way over her head regardless.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

Fiorina has way more substance than Palin ever did and to say otherwise is pure ignorance.

What substance? What has she said that has any value outside of lies about Planned Parenthood?

 

[SJHovey]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

No one is saying he doesnt have the right to say it but nice try. He has the right to be a bigot if he so chooses. What we are saying is that should be enough to stop people from voting for him. The fact that it isnt, and that the Right seems to be parsing it out and making it seem less bigoted for some reason tells a pretty ugly tale. (and shows the White House wasnt off in what they said yesterday)

edit: As we said before if he had said he wouldnt vote for a Jew for the same reason, he has that right to do it but he would have dropped out of the race this morning.

No. What you posted (as the original post on this subject) was this:

So Ben Carson thinks that a presidents religion should matter and that if it doesnt square with he Constitution they should not allowed to run for office. Has this nutjob actually read the Constitution?

and I called B.S. on you, because that is not what Carson said. That may be your knee jerk interpretation of what Carson said, but it is substantially different than saying "I would not support putting a muslim in the white house."

 

[joecct]

What substance? What has she said that has any value outside of lies about Planned Parenthood?

They're not lies. But the willingness not to believe in the truth is a common fault when the truth is unbelievable.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

Well sorry but that is what it sounds like to me, you disagree that is your opinion. I dont think he is speaking about how he would vote it sounds to me like he is saying he doesnt think they should run for office. Like I said your opinion may be different. (which is no more correct than my apparent "knee jerk" interpretation)

I also never said he didnt have the right to that opinion so I call BS on your knee jerk interpretation of that.

 

[geezer]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

edit: As we said before if he had said he wouldnt vote for a Jew for the same reason, he has that right to do it but he would have dropped out of the race this morning.

Let's try another one: "I would not advocate putting an evangelical Christian fundamentalist in the white house."
Acceptable personal opinion, or pure evil?
Yeah, maybe the guy's a jerk but I think it's being a little overblown. The outrage meter is pretty sensitive if you say "Muslim."

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

They're not lies. But the willingness not to believe in the truth is a common fault when the truth is unbelievable.

So she saw a video of a baby having its brain harvested to be sold? Even though there is zero proof that such a video exists? Did your buddy Pat the Racist tell you that

But willingness not to believe the truth is a common fault when the truth is made up of facts and not supposition and plays to your internal beliefs.

 

[JF_Gophers]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

I don't like any religion clouding the views of people in any office from Rowan County clerk on up.

 

[geezer]

Re: Campaign 2016 - People lie the most after a hunt, during a war or before an elect

Well sorry but that is what it sounds like to me, you disagree that is your opinion. I dont think he is speaking about how he would vote it sounds to me like he is saying he doesnt think they should run for office. Like I said your opinion may be different. (which is no more correct than my apparent "knee jerk" interpretation)

I also never said he didnt have the right to that opinion so I call BS on your knee jerk interpretation of that.

I appreciate you trying to take cover now, but "doesn't think they should run" (personal preference) is NOT the same as "should NOT BE ALLOWED to run" (what you actually said). Sorry for enjoying this...