Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was In)

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

That is only true under certain circumstances and you (and the people who always attack third party supporters) are completely twisting it...though you only partially. In a non-presidential election you are right that it is "half" but in the presidential election it only matters in swing/close states. If someone in California or New York or Minnesota or Texas decided to vote third party it would not make a difference because the states have been decided before the ballots are cast.

So you are right, but only in about 10-12 states. The equation needs to be tinkered so as not to be intellectually dishonest. It should be an if/ten statement...IF the state is in play THEN a third party vote is half as damaging. (in theory)

IRV would solve almost all of this. But we would also have to reform (or get rid of) the Electoral College and the rule that if nobody has a majority of EV the House decides the presidency.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

Reading in today's WaPo that tD (not necessarily the GOP) wants Glass-Steagall back.

Yup, he has said this consistently throughout the campaign. IIRC they even put it in the platform, which is funny since everything else in the platform is a roll over for the big banks.

 

[unofan]

??

Bernie did do everything right. He got screwed. .

How did he get screwed? He just didn't get the votes.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

Interesting story on the Republicans' government in exile.

And so, to an almost unprecedented extent, as the 50,000 Republican activists, officials and media pour into Cleveland this week, there is something of a convention within the convention. Many of these GOP titans—the intellectual and financial pillars of the party and its possible future elected leaders—are plotting a parallel course.

In delegation breakfasts, private hotel suites and steakhouses across Cleveland—and farther afield for those, like Jeb Bush and his family, who are skipping the festivities—they are laying the foundations for the next political battles they believe can actually be won: first, to preserve the GOP majorities in the House and Senate this fall, then to save the Republican Party itself.

From the billionaire brothers Charles and David Koch to an increasingly influential GOP financier Paul Singer, from those who fell short in 2016—Ted Cruz and Scott Walker—to those who could be fresh faces in 2020—Tom Cotton, Ben Sasse, Nikki Haley—from House Speaker Paul Ryan to the not-so-subterranean contest for the chairmanship of the RepublicanNational Committee, the maneuvering is underway to pick up the shards of the shattered GOP.

“There’s a school of thought that Trump, who’s gonna get crushed, will somehow teach the party a lesson and they’ll get it out of their system,” said Stuart Stevens, who was Mitt Romney’s chief strategist in 2012. “I don’t have confidence in that.”

Indeed, many are already at work to rearrange the fractured pieces to their liking—and advantage.

tl; dr: The career Republicans are hoping for Trump to get Goldwatered, delegitimizing the grassroots and reinstalling the elite at the party helm. They will then try to figure out how to restore the GOP as the corporate con, with themselves skimming the cream off the top.

 

[joecct]

Interesting story on the Republicans' government in exile.



tl; dr: The career Republicans are hoping for Trump to get Goldwatered, delegitimizing the grassroots and reinstalling the elite at the party helm. They will then try to figure out how to restore the GOP as the corporate con, with themselves skimming the cream off the top.

Except the 1964 election tilted the GOP away from the Northeast Rockefeller Republicans. It resulted in a pretty good winning streak that started 4 years later.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

Except the 1964 election tilted the GOP away from the Northeast Rockefeller Republicans. It resulted in a pretty good winning streak that started 4 years later.

There's no Southern Strategy to fall back on now. The descent towards the bestial made sense for the GOP in the 60s as it attracted the Dixiecrats. But they absorbed all of them long ago -- there are none left to pull in -- and the continual fan service to them is repulsing everybody else.

Smerconish made a good observation on POTUS this morning: the convention should be where the party and the candidate put forward the best argument for undecideds to join them. Instead, the 2016 RNC has been a fanatics' group grope, with the base baying for blood and Rudy screeching "the browns are coming to KILL US!" and the mob screaming "cruxify her." Reagan, Bush Sr., Bill, Dubya and Obama all ran highly positive conventions. Trump's, so far, is a histrionic parade of horribles alienating everyone except the hard core True Believers.

The right has been trapped in their bubble for so long they don't know how to talk to anybody but each other.

 

[The Rube]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

How did he get screwed? He just didn't get the votes.

The whole delegate/superdelegate/popular vote thing.

Mind you, while a better choice than Hillary in my mind, he was far from getting a vote from me.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

Day Three Freak Show schedule (lulz in bold):

Laura Ingraham, Radio Host

Phil Ruffin, Businessman
Ruffin is an American businessman with diverse interests in real estate, lodging, manufacturing, energy, and retail enterprises. Ruffin started his business in 1959 with a single convenience store and quickly grew to own 65 stores in four states. He currently holds 12 hotels in Kansas, Maryland, California, Oklahoma, Texas, and Alabama.

Pam Bondi, Attorney General of Florida

Eileen Collins, Astronaut (retired)
Eileen Collins is an astronaut and veteran of four Space Shuttle missions. She was the first woman to command a Space Shuttle mission and logged over 537 hours in space during her tenure at NASA.

Michelle Van Etten, Small Business Owner
Michelle Van Etten is a small business owner who was recently featured in The Greatest Networkers in the World second edition. Michelle employs over 100,000 people and is a strong supporter of Donald Trump, knowing his policies will support businesses all across America.

Kentucky State Senator Ralph Alvarado, Jr.

Darrell Scott, Pastor
Dr. Darrell C. Scott, Senior Pastor and Co-Founder of New Spirit Revival Center Ministries, has given his life to spreading the word of God and helping those in need. Scott started the New Spirit Revival Center in Cleveland Heights, Ohio on February 14, 1994, with just four members in attendance. His ministry has since grown to numbers in the thousands and has focused on reviving its Cleveland Community.

Harold Hamm, Continental Resources
Harold Hamm is an American entrepreneur and played a key role in the development of the technologies behind the United States’ recent renaissance in oil and natural gas production. Born in Lexington, Oklahoma, Hamm was the youngest of 13 children. With just a high-school education, Hamm started his own business at the age of 21. This grassroots startup, Continental Resources, soon became a NYSE-traded, Top 10 oil producer in the United States Lower 48.

Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker

Lynne Patton, The Eric Trump Foundation
Lynne Patton is Vice President of The Eric Trump Foundation and Senior Assistant to Eric Trump, Ivanka Trump, and Donald Trump, Jr. As VP, Lynne works in tandem with the Executive Director/President of the Foundation to oversee all operations, volunteers, events, outreach, social media, vendors, and corporate partnerships. She assists with the planning of all major fundraising events for the Foundation. She also works to identify and develop viable partnerships and research projects for the Foundation in conjunction with St. Jude Children’s Research Hospital.

U.S. Senator Marco Rubio (R-Florida)

U.S. Senator Ted Cruz (R-Texas)

Eric Trump, Executive Vice President of The Trump Organization

Newt & Callista Gingrich, Former Speaker of the House and his wife

Indiana Governor Mike Pence, Presumptive candidate for Vice President

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

How did he get screwed? He just didn't get the votes.

He got "screwed" in the sense that he was running against not just Hillary but the DNC. But Trump had the same problem and he stacked RNC bodies like cordwood.

There's no doubt the DNC would have screwed Bernie using supers in Philly, but they didn't have to. He didn't have anything stolen from him -- he lost. The fight was dirty but politics is dirty and the ability to win in the trenches is one predictor of how well someone will do when holding office, since the dirtiness doesn't stop on inauguration day, it only gets worse.

Do people think Trump and the RNC are going to run a clean campaign this summer and fall? Hillary is an ambulatory mass of scar tissue -- she's the Bear Jew of politics. She will be equal to whatever garbage they throw at her. Bernie would likely have been a little too moral to be a good candidate.

 

[BassAle]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

The whole delegate/superdelegate/popular vote thing.

Mind you, while a better choice than Hillary in my mind, he was far from getting a vote from me.

uhhhh

he lost in elected delegates and popular vote (by millions of votes). Did you want the superdelegates to back him anyway? If you got rid of superdelegates he would have still lost.

how is that getting screwed?

 

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

Smerconish made a good observation on POTUS this morning: the convention should be where the party and the candidate put forward the best argument for undecideds to join them. Instead, the 2016 RNC has been a fanatics' group grope, with the base baying for blood and Rudy screeching "the browns are coming to KILL US!" and the mob screaming "cruxify her." Reagan, Bush Sr., Bill, Dubya and Obama all ran highly positive conventions. Trump's, so far, is a histrionic parade of horribles alienating everyone except the hard core True Believers.

The right has been trapped in their bubble for so long they don't know how to talk to anybody but each other.

I was thinking the same thing. The GOP already has the conspiracy theory nutter crowd. I have no idea what they're trying to accomplish. Never been a fan of Republicans, but they usually know how to run a good convention (I don't remember any before 1984). This is by FAR the strangest "organized" political event I've ever witnessed.

 

[The Rube]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

He got "screwed" in the sense that he was running against not just Hillary but the DNC. But Trump had the same problem and he stacked RNC bodies like cordwood.

There's no doubt the DNC would have screwed Bernie using supers in Philly, but they didn't have to. He didn't have anything stolen from him -- he lost. The fight was dirty but politics is dirty and the ability to win in the trenches is one predictor of how well someone will do when holding office, since the dirtiness doesn't stop on inauguration day, it only gets worse.

Do people think Trump and the RNC are going to run a clean campaign this summer and fall? Hillary is an ambulatory mass of scar tissue -- she's the Bear Jew of politics. She will be equal to whatever garbage they throw at her. Bernie would likely have been a little too moral to be a good candidate.

What you said.

 

[BassAle]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

okay I'm scared. I took the quiz again and i got

96% Hillary
95% Bernie
93% Jill Stein
65% Gary Johnson
41% Trump

I feel dirty Trump was so high, but my choice for November is clear.

 

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

uhhhh

he lost in elected delegates and popular vote (by millions of votes). Did you want the superdelegates to back him anyway? If you got rid of superdelegates he would have still lost.

how is that getting screwed?

Not sure why we have to still litigate this, but here goes. Sanders lost due to his lack of appeal to minority voters and how to handle the Obama legacy. As a momentum candidate, he basically tied in Iowa and scored a blowout win in NH. That led to...Nevada, far more diverse and where he suffered a clear loss (5-6%). You maybe could chalk that up the Harry Reid's organization in a caucus state, but getting crushed in South Carolina doomed him. Took away his momentum, foreshadowed what was to come during Super Tuesday, and forced his campaign to deal with a block of voters who opposed Sanders, but who they couldn't label conservative corporate sell-out whores.

Rightly or wrongly, black voters in particular weren't into Sanders. That more than anything else is why he lost.

 

[The Rube]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

okay I'm scared. I took the quiz again and i got

96% Hillary
95% Bernie
93% Jill Stein
65% Gary Johnson
41% Trump

I feel dirty Trump was so high, but my choice for November is clear.

A bit worried myself, although some of the answers I chose weren't worded exactly as I would have liked, but they were very close to what I feel (as is the case with many of these types of quizzes):

Trump 85%
Johnson 84%
Sanders 57%
Clinton 53%
Stein 51%

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

The Onion sums up the RNC.

Also.

 

[Jimjamesak]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

Looking at the speaker list, how is someone who employs "over 100,000 people" a small business owner?

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

The whole delegate/superdelegate/popular vote thing.

Mind you, while a better choice than Hillary in my mind, he was far from getting a vote from me.

Sorry but this is flat out wrong. He lost fair and square. (I am a Bernie guy) If Superdelegates were not a thing he still loses.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

What you said.

That isnt getting screwed, that is losing. That is like hockey fans who whine when their team doesnt get an equal number of PPs. Sure there maybe, could be, possibly something shady going on but that isnt proof of it.

Bernie lost because he couldnt win the states he needed to win to get the delegates needed. If he could have flipped a few of the bigger states the SDs would have joined him. He couldnt and they didnt.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part XIV: Just Dropped in (To See What Condition My Convention Was

The new phone books are here, and the PEC histograms are out.