Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

[Spartanforlife4]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

They're mad because they're expected to accept the image of two dudes kissing in a public space is perfectly ok. That they can't even make nasty jokes about what the two of them do behind closed doors.

They're mad because they have to accept that soon, people of color will outnumber white people in this country, and then they'll be the minority. With that, they'll have to accept that they might even have to take orders from a black or Hispanic boss, that those minoroties will increasingly be in positions of authority over them.

Simply put, they're mad that this country no longer looks like it did in 1950, the good old days.

There was a poll awhile back in SoCar or Florida that a showed a fifth of them were mad the country didn't look like 1850.

 

[leswp1]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

The whack jobs, as you call them, are (and I sound like a broken record) the "Mad as hell and I'm not taking it anymore" crowd. ....

Someone else just posted a response and I am chiming in to agree- there are the people who are angry about the system but pragmatic or fairly reasonable in their thinking (they figure out that tD is a blow hard and he can't possibly do all he says- because he promises to do 2 polar opposite things frequently). I would count myself as one of these.

Then there are the crazy, self absorbed, not particularly bright people who are mad, have a warped and inaccurate memory of the way it used to be, and want to believe all the people/things they don't like can be removed. Their reality does not allow them to realize a president can't wave a magic wand to make things right the way they see it.

BIG difference.

 

[leswp1]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

They're mad because they're expected to accept the image of two dudes kissing in a public space is perfectly ok. That they can't even make nasty jokes about what the two of them do behind closed doors.

They're mad because they have to accept that soon, people of color will outnumber white people in this country, and then they'll be the minority. With that, they'll have to accept that they might even have to take orders from a black or Hispanic boss, that those minoroties will increasingly be in positions of authority over them.

Simply put, they're mad that this country no longer looks like it did in 1950, the good old days.

They are mad because when the odds are evened out you have less chance of success. That is a fairly human trait. One that I got lectures on avoiding as I grew up.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

Just as I would posit that the mad as hell crowd exists on both sides.

The right is often snowed by media/group think to believe that the enemy left is going to force porn down everyone's throat. And based on posters in this thread, you see a similar left obsession that the right is taking over the government and forcing religion down everyone's throat.

Both sides are out to lunch on these matters... these are microscopic in terms of impact on governmental action and overall societal impacts.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

They're mad because they've been told to be angry and that all their problems are the fault of someone else. It's the liberals. Or the immigrants. Or the blacks. They are whack jobs. And you are one too.

I wouldnt say he is a whack job, but the rest I agree with 100%. People think they should be better off and have more, and when they dont they need someone to blame. (cause it cant be their fault...party of personal responsibility and all) Why admit you might be the problem when there are Mexicans and they want to be treated like Americans too!

 

[Handyman]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

i think you're blending the mah crowd in with the racists, xenophobes, and christian sharia law folks. You can be mad as hell, but over what? What are they mad about? Certainly it can't be because regulations are "too high". deregulation is what caused the massive financial crisis. It can't be because of the economy. The economy has been growing, slowly, for six years. Jobs have been added every month since 2010. gdp has grown since obama took office.

So what could you possible be angry about?

Taxes on the rich have gone down because of the republicans and either have gone up on the middle and lower classes or effectively gone up due to higher fees, sales taxes, and whatever other codeword you want to use for taxes. None of us* have benefited from any of the tax cuts the republicans have enacted. They all disproportionately favor the wealthy. Historically, this** is what effective rates have done since wwii (i put the graph together based on irs and other government sources). The income gap has only widened over the last 15 years. Corporations have been paying less and less every year.

If none of that makes you angry, then are you mad at the poor getting healthcare? Are you mad at religious bigotry being removed from our laws so that we look less like a christian saudi arabia than we have in the past?

* - well, maybe some of us, i have no idea
** - albeit slightly misleadingly as it doesn't take into account how deductions were taken into account but i believe it takes inflation into account

qft!

 

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

It takes a certain degree of emotional maturity to realize that Mommy and Daddy were just as full of sh-t as everybody else.

Like my dad banking a major portion of his and mom's retirement on real estate. Now they're stuck with three homes, two of which are in locations where they won't sell anytime soon.

 

[rufus]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

Just as I would posit that the mad as hell crowd exists on both sides.

The right is often snowed by media/group think to believe that the enemy left is going to force porn down everyone's throat. And based on posters in this thread, you see a similar left obsession that the right is taking over the government and forcing religion down everyone's throat.

Both sides are out to lunch on these matters... these are microscopic in terms of impact on governmental action and overall societal impacts.

I think the left is more concerned with the increasing oligarchy in this country, but those supporting the oligarchy do use religion and social issues to sway the masses to their side.

 

[rufus]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

Like my dad banking a major portion of his and mom's retirement on real estate. Now they're stuck with three homes, two of which are in locations where they won't sell anytime soon.

In the long run, it's a good idea. As Tony Soprano said, "buy land, they aren't making any more of it"

Problem is, those in retirement don't have a long run.

 

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

In the long run, it's a good idea. As Tony Soprano said, "buy land, they aren't making any more of it"

Problem is, those in retirement don't have a long run.

Somewhat true. The real problem is, they bought/built bad real estate. It was based on the idea that they could sell one vacation home in the northern lower peninsula to a young-ish GM or Ford employee, and retire to the other. However, the real estate bubble has taught many a Millennial that buying vacation property is a terrible investment, and thus my parents are left holding the bag. I'd feel better if they had restricted themselves to one vacation home, but no...there are two homes to get rid of, paying taxes and upkeep costs all the while. Ick. They could certainly afford both while the market was high and so were their incomes, but now with their recent retirements and no traction on selling one of the homes, it'll be time for them to face their financial reckoning come May or June.

 

[Rover]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

Do like I did and buy property in the western suburbs of Boston! I'm rolling in hypothetical real estate gains as I write!

Regarding anger, the GOP has always been good at harnessing it. What benefited them previously is that they were allowed to be vague. So, you could oppose abortion for example, but what does that mean? Exceptions for health of mother, against abortion after 24 weeks, against all abortions, etc. For years conservatives got away with not filling in the blanks. Now Trump comes along and fills them in. Or you are against illegal immigration. Does that mean kick out criminals or does it mean change the Constitution to eliminate birthright citizenship?

For the Republicans, Trump + Cruz have won 70% of the primary vote. The party has made its choice. For the other 30%, perhaps joe, Bob, etc etc its OMG!!!

 

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

Do like I did and buy property in the western suburbs of Boston! I'm rolling in hypothetical real estate gains as I write!

Equivalent in the Detroit area 15 years ago would've been Midtown or Corktown, or (out the burbs) Royal Oak or Ferndale.

 

[Spartanforlife4]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

Don't make her angry. You wouldn't like her when she's angry.

That's not a very nice tone, Hillary! You were just saying Bernie needs to be nicer!

 

[joecct]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

Darn!
‏
Richard M. Nixon
President Nixon is not and will not be a candidate. - RZ

In response to:
Byron York
Rove: 'A fresh face might be the thing that could give us a chance to turn this election and win in November against Hillary.'

 

[joecct]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

...For the other 30%, perhaps joe, Bob, etc etc its OMG!!!

It's more OH Sugar Honey Ice Tea!

---------
Pat on Cleveland. He understands power, having learned it at the foot of Milhous.

 

[Slap Shot]

I do appreciate the irony of a crowd chanting "All Lives Matter", who then show complete and utter disregard to any person who does not think exactly like they do, going so far as to physically assault 15 year old girls.

The Janesville Police Department said in a statement that it is seeking two suspects in the incident, one for the pepper-spraying and one for sexual assault.

In video of the incident posted online, a young woman can be seen shouting and swearing at an older man, accusing him of touching her breasts.

"Can't help you, I never touched you," the man says, turning away from the teenager.

Others in the crowd are holding the teenager back as she pushes toward the man. She appears to strike or punch at something just off screen, and moments later an arm appears from out of frame and pepper-sprays her in the face.

First thing is if she were groped that shouldn't happen, but she clearly escalated the situation and if she did in fact punch someone can't say I blame them for using pepper spray.

Problem is there are plenty of people on both sides looking for a literal fight and well here you go. I really wish liberals would,stay away from Trump rallies and let his attacks come from within. Eventually these idiots are only going to galvanize a good amount of even his detractors and that camt help but backfire in November.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

I think the left is more concerned with the increasing oligarchy in this country, but those supporting the oligarchy do use religion and social issues to sway the masses to their side.

Think you're making a different point than I am. The board is pretty much on the side that the right is filled with loonies that hate progress and want to move us back to the stone age. I'm overstating this for understanding...but there is some merit in the general idea. I think while you are silent on that...your comparison is similar to many others I believe is not that the left has its issues...but rather that the left is observant and justifiably concerned.

My point is that just as the right is way out to lunch that the world is being taken over by left wing commies...the left (based on posts on this site) believes that the world is being taken over by 'bible thumpers'. I've voted D on every presidential election on which I've participated (going back to the 90s). But based on the site's left rhetoric, that group is just out of touch on the impact and danger to society specifically of 'bible thumpers'.

I've just never noticed that my own side of the spectrum is obtuse, being duped, and is out of touch just like the right side of the spectrum yet on different issues.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

On the Thumpers: outside of the deep south and (inexplicably, to me anyway) part of the prairie they are not a threat to take over anything above a local district. They are particularly obnoxious because they spew as much insane bile as they please but when anybody criticizes them in the least they run screaming under the "religious freedom" skirts and try to rally the majority of sane religious observers to their side. The Thumpers themselves are only about 25% of the whole country -- they can't win a national election, but they can (and did) hold a party hostage if they gain enough power and that means about 50% of the time they have way too much power for their numbers.

The genuine threat from the right is fascism: the alliance of knuckledragging social mores, unrestrained plutocratic power, and a "law and order" militarized state. It's been getting more dangerous over the last half century as the Republican party got more and more extreme in the first two components. Hitherto the only thing that's saved the GOP from descending into an outright fascist party has been a commitment to the small-r republican principles of the Founders and to small government. If they lose that immunity to a police state they'll be an existential threat to American democracy. A major terrorist attack would be the perfect excuse for that to happen.

 

[leswp1]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

First thing is if she were groped that shouldn't happen, but she clearly escalated the situation and if she did in fact punch someone can't say I blame them for using pepper spray.

Problem is there are plenty of people on both sides looking for a literal fight and well here you go. I really wish liberals would,stay away from Trump rallies and let his attacks come from within. Eventually these idiots are only going to galvanize a good amount of even his detractors and that camt help but backfire in November.

If that had happened outside of a tD rally would people's reaction be different? Agree no one should be agitating but many women are taught to swing and ask questions later if groped. Pepper spray is waaaay over reacting to a 15 yr old swinging unless she had a tire iron.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Campaign 2016 Part, let's say, X: There's a red moon rising On the Cuyahoga River

We're going to be talking a lot about Rule 40(b), so I went looking for it.

RULE NO. 40
Nominations

(a) In making the nominations for President
of the United States and Vice President of the United
States and voting thereon, the roll of the states shall be
called separately in each case; provided, however, that
if there is only one candidate for nomination for Vice
President of the United States who has demonstrated
the support required by paragraph (b) of this rule, a
motion to nominate for such office by acclamation
shall be in order and no calling of the roll with respect
to such office shall be required.

(b) Each candidate for nomination for
President of the United States and Vice President of
the United States shall demonstrate the support of a
majority of the delegates from each of eight (8) or
more states, severally, prior to the presentation of the
name of that candidate for nomination.
Notwithstanding any other provisions of these rules or
any rule of the House of Representatives, to
demonstrate the support required of this paragraph a
certificate evidencing the affirmative written support
of the required number of permanently seated
delegates from each of the eight (8) or more states
shall have been submitted to the secretary of the
convention not later than one (1) hour prior to the
placing of the names of candidates for nomination
pursuant to this rule and the established order of
business.

(c) The total time of the nominating speech
and seconding speeches for any candidate for
nomination for President of the United States or Vice
President of the United States shall not exceed fifteen
(15) minutes.

(d) When at the close of a roll call any
candidate for nomination for President of the United
States or Vice President of the United States has
received a majority of the votes entitled to be cast in
the convention, the chairman of the convention shall
announce the votes for each candidate whose name
was presented in accordance with the provisions of
paragraph (b) of this rule. Before the convention
adjourns sine die, the chairman of the convention shall
declare the candidate nominated by the Republican
Party for President of the United States and Vice
President of the United States.

(e) If no candidate shall have received such
majority, the chairman of the convention shall direct
the roll of the states be called again and shall repeat
the calling of the roll until a candidate shall have
received a majority of the votes entitled to be cast in
the convention.

Sorry for the effed up formatting; blame the knucks.

The thing that strikes me is what happens to the delegates committed to the loser candidates on the first ballot? Let's say I'm the one Jim Gilmore delegate. His name can't be placed in nomination because he does not have a majority of the delegates in 8 or more state. But I'm committed to him. Am I DQ'ed? If so, does this change the count of the delegates required for nomination?

If I am reading this right the only chance Drumpf and Cruz have to limit the voting to just them is on the first ballot. On subsequent ballots a majority of state delegates could send certification to the chair that they support Candidate X, and if enough states do this then X is now OK under the rule. But ballot 1 is still interesting because of the Gilmore delegate dilemma. What happens?