Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
We've never had an exorcism during a televised debate. I vote yes.
We've never had an exorcism during a televised debate. I vote yes.
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Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
- Thread starter joecct
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busterman62
I got a pocket full of kryptonite
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
I would guess that Bernie will be little more than a distraction. If for some unknown reason he gets a boatload full of $$$$ and can stick around for awhile, he's gonna pull HRC to the left in the primaries. While I realize that gives both of you a chubby, I would think that in the general election where both sides get their 45%, a further Left HRC may cost her a significant amount from the swing 10%
How?
I would guess that Bernie will be little more than a distraction. If for some unknown reason he gets a boatload full of $$$$ and can stick around for awhile, he's gonna pull HRC to the left in the primaries. While I realize that gives both of you a chubby, I would think that in the general election where both sides get their 45%, a further Left HRC may cost her a significant amount from the swing 10%
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Simple. She's already adopting much of Elizabeth Warren's policy positions. Bernie and Elizabeth see eye to eye on almost everything. Every time they agree on something it will help her nomination and give her street cred with the left. Then when she pivots for the general the left won't abandon her because the loony left will be into "history" just like they were into "history" in '08.
Simple. She's already adopting much of Elizabeth Warren's policy positions. Bernie and Elizabeth see eye to eye on almost everything. Every time they agree on something it will help her nomination and give her street cred with the left. Then when she pivots for the general the left won't abandon her because the loony left will be into "history" just like they were into "history" in '08.
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Check it out:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/02/11/will-sec-politics-be-as-powerful-as-sports/
If that goes through and I don't see why it wouldn't Calgary Ted could be sitting pretty while Walker is really left out and Jeb needs to win somewhere down South and not just in MA. Not sure Jeb is lock for either NC (lots of fundies especially in the primary) and VA.
Check it out:
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/02/11/will-sec-politics-be-as-powerful-as-sports/
If that goes through and I don't see why it wouldn't Calgary Ted could be sitting pretty while Walker is really left out and Jeb needs to win somewhere down South and not just in MA. Not sure Jeb is lock for either NC (lots of fundies especially in the primary) and VA.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Pretty much. Bernie's ideal because he understands how he can maximize liberal influence during the campaign. He's going to focus on jobs, inequality, progressive taxation, essentially a repeal of everything since 1980 from Reagan Voodoo to Clinton Triangulation to Obama Centrism, and a return to the left-populist policies that built the middle class. But he won't be spiking Hillary, because he knows she's the nominee. He can be a stalking horse to keep liberal supporters deeply involved in the campaign whereas otherwise they'd be repelled by an unopposed Hillary. Instead, Hillary will have to move towards him, and there will be a few more promises to liberal groups that she'll have to make good on as president.
Yes, it sucks that we're reduced to doing it this way, but it sure beats the 80s. Also, the media and the lofo voters have been programmed to think only along a center-to-far right political spectrum. Having Bernie's voice will remind everybody that's there's a real left. It won't win this time, but movement conservatives started building in 1964 to win in 1980.
Pretty much. Bernie's ideal because he understands how he can maximize liberal influence during the campaign. He's going to focus on jobs, inequality, progressive taxation, essentially a repeal of everything since 1980 from Reagan Voodoo to Clinton Triangulation to Obama Centrism, and a return to the left-populist policies that built the middle class. But he won't be spiking Hillary, because he knows she's the nominee. He can be a stalking horse to keep liberal supporters deeply involved in the campaign whereas otherwise they'd be repelled by an unopposed Hillary. Instead, Hillary will have to move towards him, and there will be a few more promises to liberal groups that she'll have to make good on as president.
Yes, it sucks that we're reduced to doing it this way, but it sure beats the 80s. Also, the media and the lofo voters have been programmed to think only along a center-to-far right political spectrum. Having Bernie's voice will remind everybody that's there's a real left. It won't win this time, but movement conservatives started building in 1964 to win in 1980.
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ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Also, the beauty of it is that in the Democratic party being attacked from the left helps you in the general, and in the primary. On the right the same dynamic hurts you in the primary and in the general. Romney lost all the mo he had because of what he had to do to get the nomination.
Also, the beauty of it is that in the Democratic party being attacked from the left helps you in the general, and in the primary. On the right the same dynamic hurts you in the primary and in the general. Romney lost all the mo he had because of what he had to do to get the nomination.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Wow. I can't think of a more damaging strategy for the GOP.
Wow. I can't think of a more damaging strategy for the GOP.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
When Teddy attacked Carter from the left in 1980 it killed him. Hillary actually occupies a similar conservadem slot to Carter, though obviously her primary dynamics aren't drawn from her place on the spectrum.
When Teddy attacked Carter from the left in 1980 it killed him. Hillary actually occupies a similar conservadem slot to Carter, though obviously her primary dynamics aren't drawn from her place on the spectrum.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Yep, exactly. Hillary being able to go Elizabeth on some policy and still get attacked from the left is a win win for her.
Yep, exactly. Hillary being able to go Elizabeth on some policy and still get attacked from the left is a win win for her.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
busterman62
I got a pocket full of kryptonite
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Making HRC shift left doesn't buy her much of anything IMO. The group that Bernie appeals to (ie. yourself, Scooby, et al) are all going to vote D or not at all. That vote may not be in support of HRC but against what you feel is a far worse option. (I suppose Scooby might vote with Walker just to prove a point but I highly doubt it). No different than the Fundie Right voting with Jeb cause HRC is really Satan or just not going to the poll altogether. Both sides will average out the other.
The non-aligned center will decide the election not the 43-45% that will pull R or D regardless of the name in front of the letter. Swerve too far to the left or the right and you'll lose that vote. If Bernie can pull HRC to your way of thinking, I think it will do nothing but hurt her with those of us in the center. Same holds true with Jeb and the Republican Clown Car.
Sorry, I still don't get it.
Making HRC shift left doesn't buy her much of anything IMO. The group that Bernie appeals to (ie. yourself, Scooby, et al) are all going to vote D or not at all. That vote may not be in support of HRC but against what you feel is a far worse option. (I suppose Scooby might vote with Walker just to prove a point but I highly doubt it). No different than the Fundie Right voting with Jeb cause HRC is really Satan or just not going to the poll altogether. Both sides will average out the other.
The non-aligned center will decide the election not the 43-45% that will pull R or D regardless of the name in front of the letter. Swerve too far to the left or the right and you'll lose that vote. If Bernie can pull HRC to your way of thinking, I think it will do nothing but hurt her with those of us in the center. Same holds true with Jeb and the Republican Clown Car.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Yep. More votes. Unlike this last midterm where the lefties stayed home.
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Like this article:
http://wonkwire.com/2015/04/29/republicans-secret-to-boosting-the-economy-tax-cuts-for-the-rich/
Regarding Sanders, I think his impact is really on the margins. If it convinces hard core lefties that Clinton and Bernie's views aren't really all that far apart, then great. He doesn't seem to dislike her so I'm not expecting a bloodbath as after seeing too many people get hoodwinked in 2000 one would expect liberals to come home this time. Also I think the absurd attacks on Hillary are starting to motivate the Keps of the world to go from lukewarm grudging supporters to full on bandwagoners as the prospect of a Hillary Presidency torturing the right wing chattering class is just too good to pass up!
Like this article:
http://wonkwire.com/2015/04/29/republicans-secret-to-boosting-the-economy-tax-cuts-for-the-rich/
Regarding Sanders, I think his impact is really on the margins. If it convinces hard core lefties that Clinton and Bernie's views aren't really all that far apart, then great. He doesn't seem to dislike her so I'm not expecting a bloodbath as after seeing too many people get hoodwinked in 2000 one would expect liberals to come home this time. Also I think the absurd attacks on Hillary are starting to motivate the Keps of the world to go from lukewarm grudging supporters to full on bandwagoners as the prospect of a Hillary Presidency torturing the right wing chattering class is just too good to pass up!
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Unlike you, the Kep's of the world care more about the good of the country than opportunities to gloat about winning a contest.Like this article:
http://wonkwire.com/2015/04/29/republicans-secret-to-boosting-the-economy-tax-cuts-for-the-rich/
Regarding Sanders, I think his impact is really on the margins. If it convinces hard core lefties that Clinton and Bernie's views aren't really all that far apart, then great. He doesn't seem to dislike her so I'm not expecting a bloodbath as after seeing too many people get hoodwinked in 2000 one would expect liberals to come home this time. Also I think the absurd attacks on Hillary are starting to motivate the Keps of the world to go from lukewarm grudging supporters to full on bandwagoners as the prospect of a Hillary Presidency torturing the right wing chattering class is just too good to pass up!
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Unlike you, I realize its possible to do both! Ever heard of a win-win situation?
Unlike you, I realize its possible to do both! Ever heard of a win-win situation?
busterman62
I got a pocket full of kryptonite
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
I guess that I am just a figment of my imagination
I guess that I am just a figment of my imagination
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Just keep track of how you vote in the next 3 or 4 elections.
I absolutely used to think there were undecideds and independents, and that I was one of them. There aren't, and I wasn't, I just hadn't figured it out.
Voting is not rational, it's tribal.
Just keep track of how you vote in the next 3 or 4 elections.
I absolutely used to think there were undecideds and independents, and that I was one of them. There aren't, and I wasn't, I just hadn't figured it out.
Voting is not rational, it's tribal.
I didn't say it was impossible to do both, nor even that you personally don't do both. Your postings make it abundantly clear which you care about more.
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Interesting article...
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/04/the-strange-charisma-of-john-kasich/391772/
Interesting article...
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/04/the-strange-charisma-of-john-kasich/391772/
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