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Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
- Thread starter joecct
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Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Tell me again that all candidates are the same.
Tell me again that all candidates are the same.
FlagDUDE08
Banned
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
There's a big difference between campaigning and actually governing. How many things has Obama re-neged on? How about all the other Presidents in the past 60 or so years?
There's a big difference between campaigning and actually governing. How many things has Obama re-neged on? How about all the other Presidents in the past 60 or so years?
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
If you've followed Bernie's career, you know this is what he believes in. He makes me look centrist. That's what I'm talkin' about.
At least cast a vote for him in the primary. That makes more of a difference than baying at the moon.
If you've followed Bernie's career, you know this is what he believes in. He makes me look centrist. That's what I'm talkin' about.
At least cast a vote for him in the primary. That makes more of a difference than baying at the moon.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Bernie is the best...he is the only guy I would honestly stump for.
The problem is he will shred Wall Street which guarantees The Pantsuited Cyborg wins. And no matter how much he might make her pivot somewhat left (hah!) she will never come down for the reforms on Wall Street that are needed because they own her.
Bernie is the best...he is the only guy I would honestly stump for.
The problem is he will shred Wall Street which guarantees The Pantsuited Cyborg wins. And no matter how much he might make her pivot somewhat left (hah!) she will never come down for the reforms on Wall Street that are needed because they own her.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
They do own her and her better, er, worse, er, about the same really half. And that does blow. But the better Bernie does, the more the younger Democrats in the farm system will recognize that they don't have to join the Dark Side the way the Clinton generation did. Not to mention, as long as the Queen in Yellow keeps it polite between them, bringing the kind of youth, energy, and idealism into the Democratic party that she so painfully obviously won't.
We've been served a glass half full: a candidate with a high probability of winning and a low probability of doing anything good if she does win (other than keeping the shoggoths sealed in their Cyclopean tombs). The trick is to move the latter up a few ticks without affecting the former. I think Bernie helps do that. Bernie may in fact be ideal because he is NO threat to her, so she won't go nuclear and alienate the liberal wing.
They do own her and her better, er, worse, er, about the same really half. And that does blow. But the better Bernie does, the more the younger Democrats in the farm system will recognize that they don't have to join the Dark Side the way the Clinton generation did. Not to mention, as long as the Queen in Yellow keeps it polite between them, bringing the kind of youth, energy, and idealism into the Democratic party that she so painfully obviously won't.
We've been served a glass half full: a candidate with a high probability of winning and a low probability of doing anything good if she does win (other than keeping the shoggoths sealed in their Cyclopean tombs). The trick is to move the latter up a few ticks without affecting the former. I think Bernie helps do that. Bernie may in fact be ideal because he is NO threat to her, so she won't go nuclear and alienate the liberal wing.
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Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
More Bernie. This is the 10k foot view of his platform, per his daily beg for money letter:
Income and wealth inequality: In the United States today we have the most unequal wealth and income distribution of any major country on earth -- worse than at any time since the 1920s. This is an economy that must be changed in fundamental ways.
Jobs and income: In my view, we need a massive federal jobs program which puts millions of our people back to work. We must end our disastrous trade policies. We need to raise the minimum wage to a living wage. And we have to fight for pay equity for women.
Campaign finance reform: As a result of the Citizens United Supreme Court decision, American democracy is being undermined by the ability of the Koch brothers and other billionaire families. These wealthy contributors can literally buy politicians and elections by spending hundreds of millions of dollars in support of the candidates of their choice. We need to overturn Citizens United and move toward public funding of elections so that all candidates can run for office without being beholden to the wealthy and powerful.
Climate change: Climate change is real, caused by human activity and already devastating our nation and planet. The United States must lead the world in combating climate change and transforming our energy system away from fossil fuels and toward energy efficiency and sustainability.
College affordability: Every person in this country who has the desire and ability should be able to get all the education they need regardless of the income of their family. This is not a radical idea. In Germany, Scandinavia and many other countries, higher education is either free or very inexpensive. We must do the same.
Health care: Shamefully, the United States remains the only major country on earth that does not guarantee health care to all people. The United States must move toward a Medicare-for-all single-payer system. Health care is a right, not a privilege.
Poverty: The United States has more people living in poverty than at almost any time in the modern history of our country. I believe that in a democratic, civilized society none of our people should be hungry or living in desperation. We need to expand Social Security, not cut it. We need to increase funding for nutrition programs, not cut them.
Tax reform: We need real tax reform which makes the rich and profitable corporations begin to pay their fair share of taxes. We need a tax system which is fair and progressive. Children should not go hungry in this country while profitable corporations and the wealthy avoid their tax responsibilities by stashing their money in the Cayman Islands.
More Bernie. This is the 10k foot view of his platform, per his daily beg for money letter:
Income and wealth inequality: In the United States today we have the most unequal wealth and income distribution of any major country on earth -- worse than at any time since the 1920s. This is an economy that must be changed in fundamental ways.
Jobs and income: In my view, we need a massive federal jobs program which puts millions of our people back to work. We must end our disastrous trade policies. We need to raise the minimum wage to a living wage. And we have to fight for pay equity for women.
Campaign finance reform: As a result of the Citizens United Supreme Court decision, American democracy is being undermined by the ability of the Koch brothers and other billionaire families. These wealthy contributors can literally buy politicians and elections by spending hundreds of millions of dollars in support of the candidates of their choice. We need to overturn Citizens United and move toward public funding of elections so that all candidates can run for office without being beholden to the wealthy and powerful.
Climate change: Climate change is real, caused by human activity and already devastating our nation and planet. The United States must lead the world in combating climate change and transforming our energy system away from fossil fuels and toward energy efficiency and sustainability.
College affordability: Every person in this country who has the desire and ability should be able to get all the education they need regardless of the income of their family. This is not a radical idea. In Germany, Scandinavia and many other countries, higher education is either free or very inexpensive. We must do the same.
Health care: Shamefully, the United States remains the only major country on earth that does not guarantee health care to all people. The United States must move toward a Medicare-for-all single-payer system. Health care is a right, not a privilege.
Poverty: The United States has more people living in poverty than at almost any time in the modern history of our country. I believe that in a democratic, civilized society none of our people should be hungry or living in desperation. We need to expand Social Security, not cut it. We need to increase funding for nutrition programs, not cut them.
Tax reform: We need real tax reform which makes the rich and profitable corporations begin to pay their fair share of taxes. We need a tax system which is fair and progressive. Children should not go hungry in this country while profitable corporations and the wealthy avoid their tax responsibilities by stashing their money in the Cayman Islands.
FlagDUDE08
Banned
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Can't; not registered with that party. And I've had enough of Vermont politicians for quite a while, even though one of the libertarian heroes did hail from that state (Calvin Coolidge).
I understand what he's trying to do, and what I see is Marxism. He isn't the candidate for me. That being said, given the way the New World Order is going, it would not surprise me if he ended up in office, and not only pushed the Marxism, but also social authoritarianism for the rest of the agenda.
Can't; not registered with that party. And I've had enough of Vermont politicians for quite a while, even though one of the libertarian heroes did hail from that state (Calvin Coolidge).
I understand what he's trying to do, and what I see is Marxism. He isn't the candidate for me. That being said, given the way the New World Order is going, it would not surprise me if he ended up in office, and not only pushed the Marxism, but also social authoritarianism for the rest of the agenda.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Marxism?
Does anyone in this country understand what the word socialism, and marxism actually mean?
Marxism?
Does anyone in this country understand what the word socialism, and marxism actually mean?
FlagDUDE08
Banned
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Newspeak changes the definition of words day after day, under the guise of "political correctness". I don't know what you want it to be today, but I stand by what I type.
Newspeak changes the definition of words day after day, under the guise of "political correctness". I don't know what you want it to be today, but I stand by what I type.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
The GOP has programmed people that anything short of letting the rich make the poor into shoes is TEH DEMON COMMINISM!!1! Because things like child labor laws, the FDA, the interstate highway system and social security are, ya know, the serpent of gubmint intruding into Baby Jesus' laissez-faire Garden of Eden.
Bernie's a democratic socialist -- he'd be center-left in most of Europe. Their Socialists would toss him out as a reactionary, let alone real Marxists.
The GOP has programmed people that anything short of letting the rich make the poor into shoes is TEH DEMON COMMINISM!!1! Because things like child labor laws, the FDA, the interstate highway system and social security are, ya know, the serpent of gubmint intruding into Baby Jesus' laissez-faire Garden of Eden.
Bernie's a democratic socialist -- he'd be center-left in most of Europe. Their Socialists would toss him out as a reactionary, let alone real Marxists.
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ScoobyDoo
NPC
FlagDUDE08
Banned
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Awww, how cute.
People talk about pro small businesses and making corporate fat cats "pay their fair share"... well guess who ends up the worst off as a result of that "fair share" legislation? You guessed it, the small business owners. You think those corporate fat cats get paid 100% in cash? Heck no. It's mostly pre-tax benefits. You want to promote the advancement of the people? Step out of their path. Give a hand up, not a hand out. You want to trust bust? How about addressing some of the unintentional monopolies that have been created while you're at it? No one monopoly is better than another.
Awww, how cute.
People talk about pro small businesses and making corporate fat cats "pay their fair share"... well guess who ends up the worst off as a result of that "fair share" legislation? You guessed it, the small business owners. You think those corporate fat cats get paid 100% in cash? Heck no. It's mostly pre-tax benefits. You want to promote the advancement of the people? Step out of their path. Give a hand up, not a hand out. You want to trust bust? How about addressing some of the unintentional monopolies that have been created while you're at it? No one monopoly is better than another.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Mindless sloganeering.
Equal opportunity, Flaggy. That's all it was ever about. All the rest is just a smokescreen laid down by a handful of people terrified they'll fall off the top of their ever-narrowing, ever-climbing tower.
Mindless sloganeering.
Equal opportunity, Flaggy. That's all it was ever about. All the rest is just a smokescreen laid down by a handful of people terrified they'll fall off the top of their ever-narrowing, ever-climbing tower.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Ok, tell you what. I'll trade all the stuff the government gives me for all the stuff the government gives oil companies. You can prorate it based on number of US employees for the oil company if you want.
Ok, tell you what. I'll trade all the stuff the government gives me for all the stuff the government gives oil companies. You can prorate it based on number of US employees for the oil company if you want.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
This is the one thing you wrote that makes any sense, and it leads to a valid point that you didn't make but should have: big business and big government working together produces the very worst condition of servitude for the greatest number of people. I'd rather have a full-on plutocracy than a hidden plutocracy working hand in glove with the coercive power of government.
Liberty has always been gained by locking strong forces that are trying to gain dominance into conflict. Political and religious liberty rose in the West because the crown, the nobility, and the church were at each other's throats. (In the East, where they coalesced into a single entity, there was no personal liberty.) We need big government and big capital to be in constant conflict, with the balance tipping slightly one way and then the other. The space between them is where freedom gets carved out.
This is the one thing you wrote that makes any sense, and it leads to a valid point that you didn't make but should have: big business and big government working together produces the very worst condition of servitude for the greatest number of people. I'd rather have a full-on plutocracy than a hidden plutocracy working hand in glove with the coercive power of government.
Liberty has always been gained by locking strong forces that are trying to gain dominance into conflict. Political and religious liberty rose in the West because the crown, the nobility, and the church were at each other's throats. (In the East, where they coalesced into a single entity, there was no personal liberty.) We need big government and big capital to be in constant conflict, with the balance tipping slightly one way and then the other. The space between them is where freedom gets carved out.
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Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Meanwhile, back in the Mother Country....
Today is election day in the UK. BBC coverage starts soon here
It's going to be tight with a coalition government expected.
HOLY CRAP!!! Scottish National Party is forecasted to take 58 out of 59 seats in Scotland. Labour took a bath there.
BBC says Conservatives will get 316 seats (326 needed for a majority).
Meanwhile, back in the Mother Country....
Today is election day in the UK. BBC coverage starts soon here
It's going to be tight with a coalition government expected.
HOLY CRAP!!! Scottish National Party is forecasted to take 58 out of 59 seats in Scotland. Labour took a bath there.
BBC says Conservatives will get 316 seats (326 needed for a majority).
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Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Only for you WASPs. My people were destitute farmers on lousy land with crappy weather and unattractive women, but a thousand miles farther east.
Only for you WASPs. My people were destitute farmers on lousy land with crappy weather and unattractive women, but a thousand miles farther east.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
P. J. O'Rourke did a special for BBC where he waddled around playing a dumb American trying to figure out their politics. He sucked, which is too bad because he used to be really funny. Also: UKIP is nuts. It's basically the Tea Party except instead of hating Mexicans and blacks they hate Bangladeshis and... Poles?
P. J. O'Rourke did a special for BBC where he waddled around playing a dumb American trying to figure out their politics. He sucked, which is too bad because he used to be really funny. Also: UKIP is nuts. It's basically the Tea Party except instead of hating Mexicans and blacks they hate Bangladeshis and... Poles?
Re: Campaign 2016 - It's never too late to start all over again!
Mine were Irish (Free State - Donegal). Other side was Eastern France, but it may have been Germany, depending on who won the last war.
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Mine were Irish (Free State - Donegal). Other side was Eastern France, but it may have been Germany, depending on who won the last war.
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