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Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

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Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

Kepler said:
Some days it's hard to be an atheist and know there is no hell.
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I don't know, Trump going after another reporter isn't anything new. The fact that people are making this about his disability to get Trump to say something foolish on the record while also claiming that the disability isn't of concern to him just sounds like reporters trolling for a story. Trump's said worse and his supporters don't seem to care. Before "disabled" they'll think about the reporter's NYT ties and go from there.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

dxmnkd316 said:
Why is what Princeton is doing "stupid?"
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Taking Wilson's name off the buildings and white washing him from the school is ridiculous. (the rest of the demands I am fine with) This need to distance ourselves from our past is going to be the ultimate downfall of our society.

Even if you leave out the fact that the man was President, the contributions he made to Princeton itself should be celebrated by the school. Look back, Princeton was kind of the joke of the Ivies before he became president of the school. (they were called the "drunken brother") This is an institution of higher learning and they cant celebrate one of their most important educators and campus leaders?

Wilson was a segregationist...a fact that has been known for quite some time. Are we to no longer allowed venerate any president or public figure from a racist time because they have views that are now controversial? (when at the time they would have been at worst status quo) How far back should we go? Should we take Washington off everything? Should Jefferson be whitewashed out? How about Lincoln? We already have the stupid movement around here to change the name of Lake Calhoun...what is next anything named Sibley? (or any other number of people who helped kill Natives?)

The protesters say they want debate, but wiping away Wilson from the campus wont promote debate. It will effectively end the conversation. You want people to remember the bad stuff Wilson did, then every time he comes up you talk about it. You wash it away and everyone will forget. This crap is no different than textbook companies in Texas trying to keep slavery out so America isnt seen in a bad light. We made mistakes, we have learned along the way and (hopefully) evolved. We need to acknowledge our history, the good and the bad and realize that most people are a combo of both.
 
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Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

Handyman said:
Taking Wilson's name off the buildings and white washing him from the school is ridiculous. (the rest of the demands I am fine with) This need to distance ourselves from our past is going to be the ultimate downfall of our society.

Even if you leave out the fact that the man was President, the contributions he made to Princeton itself should be celebrated by the school. Look back, Princeton was kind of the joke of the Ivies before he became president of the school. (they were called the "drunken brother") This is an institution of higher learning and they cant celebrate one of their most important educators and campus leaders?

Wilson was a segregationist...a fact that has been known for quite some time. Are we to no longer allowed venerate any president or public figure from a racist time because they have views that are now controversial? (when at the time they would have been at worst status quo) How far back should we go? Should we take Washington off everything? Should Jefferson be whitewashed out? How about Lincoln? We already have the stupid movement around here to change the name of Lake Calhoun...what is next anything named Sibley? (or any other number of people who helped kill Natives?)

The protesters say they want debate, but wiping away Wilson from the campus wont promote debate. It will effectively end the conversation. You want people to remember the bad stuff Wilson did, then every time he comes up you talk about it. You wash it away and everyone will forget. This crap is no different than textbook companies in Texas trying to keep slavery out so America isnt seen in a bad light. We made mistakes, we have learned along the way and (hopefully) evolved. We need to acknowledge our history, the good and the bad and realize that most people are a combo of both.
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Every good man is a saint and all flawed men are evil devils.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

Handyman said:
Taking Wilson's name off the buildings and white washing him from the school is ridiculous. (the rest of the demands I am fine with) This need to distance ourselves from our past is going to be the ultimate downfall of our society.

Even if you leave out the fact that the man was President, the contributions he made to Princeton itself should be celebrated by the school. Look back, Princeton was kind of the joke of the Ivies before he became president of the school. (they were called the "drunken brother") This is an institution of higher learning and they cant celebrate one of their most important educators and campus leaders?

Wilson was a segregationist...a fact that has been known for quite some time. Are we to no longer allowed venerate any president or public figure from a racist time because they have views that are now controversial? (when at the time they would have been at worst status quo) How far back should we go? Should we take Washington off everything? Should Jefferson be whitewashed out? How about Lincoln? We already have the stupid movement around here to change the name of Lake Calhoun...what is next anything named Sibley? (or any other number of people who helped kill Natives?)

The protesters say they want debate, but wiping away Wilson from the campus wont promote debate. It will effectively end the conversation. You want people to remember the bad stuff Wilson did, then every time he comes up you talk about it. You wash it away and everyone will forget. This crap is no different than textbook companies in Texas trying to keep slavery out so America isnt seen in a bad light. We made mistakes, we have learned along the way and (hopefully) evolved. We need to acknowledge our history, the good and the bad and realize that most people are a combo of both.
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Got it. Thought you meant the administration.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

Yeah, this whole whitewashing thing crossed the absurd line and is quickly approaching... Well, I can think of the right word (fascism is not the right word, but it's the best I could come up with).

At some point it is too far and I think we're there. We are all adults and need to separate our honoring a man who was a president and some of his beliefs. If we were talking about a former grand dragon or nazi commander, I think that would be different.

It's sort of like concern trolling where we can't be upset at two things at the same time. But in this case it's being allowed to support one thing and not another.

If students really are feeling threatened and unsafe because we have a former president's name in a building, we are in trouble.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

Handyman said:
The protesters say they want debate, but wiping away Wilson from the campus wont promote debate. It will effectively end the conversation. You want people to remember the bad stuff Wilson did, then every time he comes up you talk about it. You wash it away and everyone will forget. This crap is no different than textbook companies in Texas trying to keep slavery out so America isnt seen in a bad light. We made mistakes, we have learned along the way and (hopefully) evolved. We need to acknowledge our history, the good and the bad and realize that most people are a combo of both.
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Well said.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

St. Clown said:
The fact that people are making this about his disability to get Trump to say something foolish on the record while also claiming that the disability isn't of concern to him just sounds like reporters trolling for a story.
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The disability wasn't an issue until Trump made fun of it. I don't see your point at all.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

Kepler said:
The disability wasn't an issue until Trump made fun of it. I don't see your point at all.
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Perhaps I don't understand the order of events. I thought that the reporter published an article, then Trump referenced it as part of his "thousands of Muslims" celebrating in New Jersey, the reporter states that his article never said that, Trump says something stupid, someone else defends the reporter, and in doing so comments on his disability, then Trumps adds insult to disability, and now the story focuses on Trump's latest insult.

Am I wrong in the order of events there?
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

St. Clown said:
Perhaps I don't understand the order of events. I thought that the reporter published an article, then Trump referenced it as part of his "thousands of Muslims" celebrating in New Jersey, the reporter states that his article never said that, Trump says something stupid, someone else defends the reporter, and in doing so comments on his disability, then Trumps adds insult to disability, and now the story focuses on Trump's latest insult.

Am I wrong in the order of events there?
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I thought the timeline was:

1. 2001: Celebrating Muslims meme is pulled out of various buttholes
2. Reporter goes looking for evidence, writes that he found none
3. 2015: Trump pulls celebrating Muslims out of his butthole
4. Everybody says "that's an urban legend"
5. Trump quotes reporter's story as "proof"
6. Reporter says, no, I wrote I couldn't find any evidence
7. Trump plays schoolyard bully on the reporter
8. People rightfully say, so Trump's not just a Nazi on immigrants and religious minorities, he hates the disabled too. Hitler Hat Trick!
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

Kepler said:
I thought the timeline was:

1. 2001: Celebrating Muslims meme is pulled out of various buttholes
2. Reporter goes looking for evidence, writes that he found none
3. 2015: Trump pulls celebrating Muslims out of his butthole
4. Everybody says "that's an urban legend"
5. Trump quotes reporter's story as "proof"
6. Reporter says, no, I wrote I couldn't find any evidence
7. Trump plays schoolyard bully on the reporter
8. People rightfully say, so Trump's not just a Nazi on immigrants and religious minorities, he hates the disabled too. Hitler Hat Trick!
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That wouldn't surprise me as the order of events. Regardless, playing "gotcha" with seems like a foolish endeavor as the people supporting him have turned blind to critics and his failings, while those who are already against him will be left circle jerking until the next time he does or says something irksome.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

St. Clown said:
That wouldn't surprise me as the order of events. Regardless, playing "gotcha" with seems like a foolish endeavor as the people supporting him have turned blind to critics and his failings, while those who are already against him will be left circle jerking until the next time he does or says something irksome.
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That's only true as far as his current supporters go, which is only about 30% of the Republican electorate -- i.e., about 8% of the entire country. The trick is to keep pointing out that the guy is a moral toxic waste dump so those numbers never get any higher. Yes, he's fooled too many people, and yes he's got a core of supporters who actually love it when he acts totalitarian because in their hearts that's what they have always been longing for all these years -- a guy who tells them their most savage, brainless, bigoted impulses are Authentically American (hum anthem here -- Star-Spangled Banner or Giovinezza, your choice).

The first rule of disease control is to isolate the carriers and prevent infection.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

Kepler said:
That's only true as far as his current supporters go, which is only about 30% of the Republican electorate -- i.e., about 8% of the entire country. The trick is to keep pointing out that the guy is a moral toxic waste dump so those numbers never get any higher. Yes, he's fooled too many people, and yes he's got a core of supporters who actually love it when he acts totalitarian because in their hearts that's what they have always been longing for all these years -- a guy who tells them their most savage, brainless, bigoted impulses are Authentically American (hum anthem here -- Star-Spangled Banner or Giovinezza, your choice).

The first rule of disease control is to isolate the carriers and prevent infection.
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I don't know about that treatment. It seems to me that the more the press cover and discuss his outlandish happenings, the more people hear about him. If they covered the man in a bland way, not talking about his sensationalistic statements, then people would be bored of the man and either ignore him or leave his camp. Look at someone like Christie. He received a small amount of coverage for some of the boneheaded things he did, but they were relatively petty in the grand scheme of presidential politicking, and nobody really paid attention to him. Now he's an afterthought in the race, if he even receives that much credit at this point. People kept hearing about Trump because the press were entertained by him and now they've made some sort of Frankenstein's monster. If they'd have ho-hummed the man in the beginning, things would look a lot different now.

All too often, people in this country just want to be entertained. Right now, Trump is the lion tamer and the press put him there; Carson's driving the clown car, a couple others are trying to hop out of the clown car, and the rest have been relegated to freak show made up of bad prosthetics. Trump's the most entertaining, so the polled public gravitate towards him because the press has put him front and center.
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

St. Clown said:
All too often, people in this country just want to be entertained. Right now, Trump is the lion tamer and the press put him there; Carson's driving the clown car, a couple others are trying to hop out of the clown car, and the rest have been relegated to freak show made up of bad prosthetics. Trump's the most entertaining, so the polled public gravitate towards him because the press has put him front and center.
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That's a good summary.

Trump ... the barker
Carson ... the clown
Cruz ... the fire breather
Huckabee ... the psychic
Paul ... the acrobat
Kasich ... the tightrope walker
Rubio ... the ventriloquist's dummy
Fiorina ... the contortionist
Santorum ... the sword swallower
Bush ... the juggler
Christie ... the human cannonball
Jindal ... the geek
Graham ... the bearded lady
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

joecct said:
Huh?
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Surprised me too. MUL used to endorse "the farthest right that can win the general." I'd have guessed them either for Rubio or maybe protesting the whole circus and withholding their endorsement. Maybe this endorsement really just amounts to "not Jeb."
 
Re: Campaign 2016 - I'm Biden my time till I doctor the hearing.

A surprisingly good summary of Trump I read recently went something like "maybe he's not telling the truth, but his telling the truth that the base of the party wants to hear". That's the part that pundidiots (and several lefty USCHO posters ;)) don't get. They're still waiting for cons to gravitate back to Jebbers! Bush. Kep, you still have Bush in the office pool, right? :D

The problem is righties now tend to be tired, old, white, male, underemployed or unemployed (or retired) people who will believe in ANY conspiracy theory that fits into their preconceived notions. Trump is a master at playing into their fears. Why does this surprise people? From casinos to real estate Trump is a master salesman. He's giving those who feel that life and the country have passed them by the bravado they miss since Reagan went senile half way through his time in office. All the other Goopers running for Prez are chumps compared to the guy.
 
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