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Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

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Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

dxmnkd316 said:
I'm not sure that's the problem. Wasn't the whole root cause the fact that they extended the fuselage and they had to adjust how the automated flight controls work? I don't recall exactly what it was, but I could have sworn I heard that somewhere.

If you need the computer to make the adjustments, your plane isn't airworthy. That's the kind of stuff they build into fighter jets. They can be inherently unstable because they need maneuverability.

I could be pulling all of this straight out of my a-s though, so YMMV.
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You're right, the true root issue is that the airframe isn't as stable as a passenger jet is supposed to be because of what they had to do to make room for the larger engines. I guess what I meant is the sensors are what needs to be fixed short of scrapping the planes.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

GrinCDXX said:
You're right, the true root issue is that the airframe isn't as stable as a passenger jet is supposed to be because of what they had to do to make room for the larger engines. I guess what I meant is the sensors are what needs to be fixed short of scrapping the planes.
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Yeah, I should have clarified my answer was to a question you weren't asking. You're absolutely right as well. Because we all know Boeing isn't going to scrap the airframe.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

And actually, I didn't realize McNerney was CEO a Boeing when this was all being designed. That guy was awful. He was basically shown the door at my company because his GE model crap was killing our corporation just like it will kill GE.

All of this sh-t came from the top.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

Another thing that really confuses me about the design of this system is that it apparently isn't using the pilot's control inputs as another signal that it can use. Meaning, if the pilot is aggressively trying to pitch the nose up, shouldn't the system just automatically stop trying to pitch the nose down; then raise an alarm, and disable itself?
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

GrinCDXX said:
Another thing that really confuses me about the design of this system is that it apparently isn't using the pilot's control inputs as another signal that it can use. Meaning, if the pilot is aggressively trying to pitch the nose up, shouldn't the system just automatically stop trying to pitch the nose down; then raise an alarm, and disable itself?
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Yeah, that's the thing that just baffled me about this whole system. I thought the pilot was god on an aircraft. I don't like the idea of computers being god.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

Meanwhile, while Red Don and the Chinese president continue to try to work out a trade deal, China orders 300 Airbuses.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

rufus said:
Meanwhile, while Red Don and the Chinese president continue to try to work out a trade deal, China orders 300 Airbuses.
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LOL. What a maroon.

I always kinda liked Europe better than the US. More power to them.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

rufus said:
Meanwhile, while Red Don and the Chinese president continue to try to work out a trade deal, China orders 300 Airbuses.
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This is why whatever shortcut you're taking might seem like a great way to cut costs, ultimately, doing things the right way is always cheaper in the long run.

Well done FAA and Boeing. You killed 300 people and less importantly cost us all money. **** you.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

Kepler said:
LOL. What a maroon.

I always kinda liked Europe better than the US. More power to them.
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I don't fly much at all, but the last time I flew cross country to visit my sister, years ago, when Boeing was having issues with another of their planes involved in frequent crashes, I made sure the airline I was flying used the Airbus.

The actual flying part isn't bad. Sorta like taking the bus. it's the takeoffs and landings I could do without.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

The irony being that Airbus generally relies more on automation/software than Boeing does. Maybe that's why Boeing isn't as good at it....

I saw an industry-insider cartoon years ago depicting the latest Airbus cockpit, with just one button labeled "Fly" and another labeled "Land."
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

dxmnkd316 said:
This is why whatever shortcut you're taking might seem like a great way to cut costs, ultimately, doing things the right way is always cheaper in the long run.

Well done FAA and Boeing. You killed 300 people and less importantly cost us all money. **** you.
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tDon's positions on trading with China certainly couldn't have helped either.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

LynahFan said:
The irony being that Airbus generally relies more on automation/software than Boeing does. Maybe that's why Boeing isn't as good at it....

I saw an industry-insider cartoon years ago depicting the latest Airbus cockpit, with just one button labeled "Fly" and another labeled "Land."
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I don't see that as ironic at all. Automation was not the problem. Bad development / release management was the problem.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

dxmnkd316 said:
Yeah, that's the thing that just baffled me about this whole system. I thought the pilot was god on an aircraft. I don't like the idea of computers being god.
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how about a nice game of chess?
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

WOW Airlines has ceased operations.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

joecct said:
WOW Airlines has ceased operations.
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Apparently it cancelled all flights with customers already at gates waiting to board, that's crazy. My wife and I used it once to fly back from Berlin, cheap as hell if you don't mind no frills.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

joecct said:
WOW Airlines has ceased operations.
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Been rumored for two years now. You can't offer $200-300 fares to Europe forever and expect to make money, no matter how many services you trim or upcharge for. They also got overly ambitious and tried to expand to third-tier cities like STL, CLE, CVG, etc. which is in interesting idea in theory, but in practice those cities have pretty small markets for flights to/from Europe. The kind of people in Ohio or Missouri with the money and interest to go can definitely afford to fly a better airline, so most of the time their flights were ferrying college-aged, low-budget backpacker types over the Atlantic. And their hub at KEF was turning into a nightmare, as it was never built to handle the traffic they and Icelandair were throwing at it.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

FadeToBlack&Gold said:
And their hub at KEF was turning into a nightmare, as it was never built to handle the traffic they and Icelandair were throwing at it.
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Oh yeah, it's definitely overgrown itself. We were there in summer 2016 and then spring 2018; while they had added a little more by 2018, it still felt about half the size it should be. In theory maybe it means their plan to get more people to Iceland was working, but quicker than they assumed it would.
 
Re: Business, Economics, and Tax Policy 8: Bezos Takes Over the World

FadeToBlack&Gold said:
Been rumored for two years now. You can't offer $200-300 fares to Europe forever and expect to make money, no matter how many services you trim or upcharge for. They also got overly ambitious and tried to expand to third-tier cities like STL, CLE, CVG, etc. which is in interesting idea in theory, but in practice those cities have pretty small markets for flights to/from Europe. The kind of people in Ohio or Missouri with the money and interest to go can definitely afford to fly a better airline, so most of the time their flights were ferrying college-aged, low-budget backpacker types over the Atlantic. And their hub at KEF was turning into a nightmare, as it was never built to handle the traffic they and Icelandair were throwing at it.
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Agree with all of the above. I flew on the first Icelandair flight ever out of Cleveland (now grounded as it was a 737 max) through KEV to Oslo.It was still a pretty cheap flight 700-800 round trip. Got stranded in KEV on the way back as the flight was delayed in Oslo. It was a nightmare and there were no practical options to get back to the states for 1-2 days. With WOW gone, I imagine that is even worse.
 
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